Where has the sense of shame gone?

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felra

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Where has the sense of shame gone? The healthy shame that convicts us when we stray from the straight and narrow way that leads to life; when we abandon the road to Calvary in a certain area; when we turn down or turn a blind eye to the truth when confronted with a moral or matter of faith challenge?

Too often it seems that we are more worried about how self or others will be offended, rather than how the truth that is Jesus Christ as revealed and taught by the Church is offended. Seems that we live in times that feelings, fear of how we will be perceived, compete with speaking plainly and calling sin by its name and letting the truth speak to us, speak for it self. We seem to be a people that insist on being heard first, and truth is just another voice clamoring for attention, and those who present it are riding high on their own self-righteous agenda (I know that I am not talking about anyone on these forums 😉 ).

I sometimes get the feeling that the house is ablaze, but no one wants to be offended by a compassionate yell “fire! get out with your life while you can”. Why so apparent little shame to be found these days?
 
The pendulum is swinging…

There was a time when it was taught the human body was something to be ashamed of, to hide, because it was associated with sinful thoughts.

Unfortunately, some people took that to the extreme and did some serious damage to others in the way of identifying and punishing ‘offenders’.

Then there was a time when the human body was taught to be beautiful, God’s perfect creation, to be embraced and honored.

Unfortunately, some people took that to the extreme and did some serious damage to others in the way they called on people to ‘bare all proudly’.

Where offenders of the earlier teaching would be publicly humiliated, physically hurt or killed,

The offenders of the later teaching were not subjected to such actions.

This has led to a broader acceptance of the second teaching.

However, Truth prevails, and while there have been few public humiliating trials or executions, STDs, sterility, abortion and the emotional effects after, have been steadily getting the message across that the second teaching isn’t all it was cracked up to be.

Now, I believe, thanks to JPII, the pendulum is heading back toward the center where it should be. I am finding hope in this younger Catholic generation - those raised by the people here on these boards - they are being raised in the Truth and they are our future.
 
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felra:
I sometimes get the feeling that the house is ablaze, but no one wants to be offended by a compassionate yell “fire! get out with your life while you can”. Why so apparent little shame to be found these days?
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I don’t know. Sometimes I wonder if it doesn’t get lost amid all the other “shame” we feel. In psychobabble terms, I think it takes time to learn to distinguish the source of the shame. Is it our superego, some type of society message, something our parents told us, something from sesame street, or is it the truth? We have messages pouring in, and no one establishes a base of truth in us to build on. It is jumbled together from the start.

I think some rebel and throw shame out the window, and others just plod along, confused and trying to sort it out.
 
I was thinking the same thing the other day, driving down the expressway, seeing multiple ads on billboards, buses, etc with people wearing just their underwear. When did that become acceptable?
 
😦 I am ashamed to grow up in a generation without shame. 😦

Look about in any Wal-Mart or K-Mart or wherever you shop, and what do you see? You see literally everything advertised by a model with a Barbie or Ken body. It is absolutely sickening! My parents don’t even care about it, though I love them dearly, I cannot concur with them there!

It depresses me to see the new “fashions” that hit the market, and disappoints me to see that people actually wear them!

May the Lord help us in this dark time. 😦
 
When society shamed an individual they are judging that individuals acts. If you try to be judgmental of a person’s acts these days you seem to get ten people shouting you down.
 
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felra:
Where has the sense of shame gone? The healthy shame that convicts us when we stray from the straight and narrow way that leads to life; when we abandon the road to Calvary in a certain area; when we turn down or turn a blind eye to the truth when confronted with a moral or matter of faith challenge?

Too often it seems that we are more worried about how self or others will be offended, rather than how the truth that is Jesus Christ as revealed and taught by the Church is offended. Seems that we live in times that feelings, fear of how we will be perceived, compete with speaking plainly and calling sin by its name and letting the truth speak to us, speak for it self. We seem to be a people that insist on being heard first, and truth is just another voice clamoring for attention, and those who present it are riding high on their own self-righteous agenda (I know that I am not talking about anyone on these forums 😉 ).

I sometimes get the feeling that the house is ablaze, but no one wants to be offended by a compassionate yell “fire! get out with your life while you can”. Why so apparent little shame to be found these days?
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IMO, a great deal of this loss has to do with the acceptance of modern psychology. Some of these theories have become accepted as almost infallible and coupled with that is those pronouncing these theories have divorced these concepts from truth.

In the end, we have generations that think any proscription is puritanical or a type of repression instead of seeing the moral law as true freedom and enlightenment.
 
The core of the issue is the Moral Relativism that came with the Radical Secularism. Anything and everything is permissible under this philosophy.

PF
 
Interesting how there are extremes and no one is taking the reasonable course.

Absolutely, moral relativism has created an atmosphere of “if it feels good, do it and don’t be ashamed!” It has also created a backlash against those who would stand up for the truths that are handed down to us via the Church.

On the other hand, there is also this spirit of superiority that is amazing. No compassion, just pound pound! POUND! with pure law and no grace, compassion or mercy.

I only saw Jesus rebuke people who were the ones putting demands on people without mercy. In the Gospel of Matthew, Jesus admonishes the religious elite by saying, "Go and learn what this means, ‘I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.’ (Matt 9:13 and Matt 12:7). It’s not necessarily a message of law that is troublesome, it’s the message of law without grace.

As an example, some people on this board LOVE to talk about homasexials and how they’re the fall of the Republic, all on their own. I don’t see much talk about giving the truth of the Gospel to people who are homosexually attracted that yes, they are sinners and yes, they are in serious trouble but God loves them and Jesus came for their salvation and calls them to change their lives out of love for Him. Instead, it’s pound POUND! POUND. It’s the approach that makes all the difference. If the person doesn’t receive the message delivered in a spirit of charity, then it’s their responsibility…if the person rejects what they believe to be an attack because of the way the message is delivered…well, then I’d say that we need to look at who is delivering the message.
 
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LCMS_No_More:
On the other hand, there is also this spirit of superiority that is amazing. No compassion, just pound pound! POUND! with pure law and no grace, compassion or mercy. …As an example, some people on this board LOVE to talk about homasexials and how they’re the fall of the Republic, all on their own. I don’t see much talk about giving the truth of the Gospel to people who are homosexually attracted …Instead, it’s pound POUND! POUND. It’s the approach that makes all the difference.
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Please don’t hijack this thread for your own agenda. 😦 There are plenty of other active threads that are currently dealing with your contention.
 
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LCMS_No_More:
On the other hand, there is also this spirit of superiority that is amazing. No compassion, just pound pound! POUND! with pure law and no grace, compassion or mercy.
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IMO, there is also the spirit of error that falsely concludes any assertion of the truth is without charity.

How can anyone have a discussion about moral absolutes, or shame, or propriety if every single time an accusation of Phariseeism is raised?
 
I find it interesting that I see no mention of nudity, modesty, or sexuality in the original post, but things of this sort came up. Is the word “shame” usually used in modern speech surrounding these topics? For me, “shame” is unlikely to bring these up. I think first upon sin or guilt or impropriety of any sort, that might seem sort of public, or get commented on by others. Huh, now that I think upon it, dress is in that category. But I guess I think a million other things are, too.:hmmm:
 
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felra:
Where has the sense of shame gone? The healthy shame that convicts us when we stray from the straight and narrow way that leads to life; when we abandon the road to Calvary in a certain area; when we turn down or turn a blind eye to the truth when confronted with a moral or matter of faith challenge?

Shame got abolished during Vatican II…I’m sure I have the document somewhere; I think it’s called Pudor Gentium or some other Latin thing…let’s see…hmmm…anyway, we don’t teach about shame because it isn’t part of the spirit of the Council…want a hug?
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WHAT?!?!! Pius XII was truly the last of the Great Popes, then. 😦
 
Seems to me that it has been a case of throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Ever since psychology identified shame as evil- a destructive force that shatters the sensitive ego, it has been difficult to return to the sensible use of it, as a tool in the realization of sin and part of the process of repentance. Instead, society seems to want to avoid it at all costs, but this has lead to destructuve confusion, not comfort. The old song says it mightily, :'twas grace that taught my heart to fear, and grace those fears relieved…how precious did that grace appear, the hour I first believed" The totality of grace- justice and mercy, both, are necessary for conversion of the heart.
 
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