Where to begin in the spiritual life?

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Augustine said:
I would say that the first step is prayer. Even before reading the Scriptures, because if they’re not read prayerfully, they’re just a bunch of books.

:blessyou:
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Absolutely. Ask, seek, knock.

If you want to go deeper in faith, ask God to take you deeper in faith.

Then grab a bible and get into a small group study.
 
Strategery - love your user name. That is what I do for a living…
 
Lifeisawesome, are you the Decider? 😃

Sorry…I had to ask that, lol.

With Tongue Planted Firmly in Cheek.
Stephen
 
Stephen - as a matter of fact, I am a decider, but only with respect to how to do the strategry. The fundamental purpose of my role is to help the deciders be as strategerific as possible. Hence forth, and no more.
 
Monica4316 said:
This is true, but I just wanted to add - not disagreeing with you at all, just adding - I heard some desert fathers said that even the Jesus prayer can be harmful if not prayed with humility and if the person cares too much about contemplation and not enough about simply serving God. If you say it only once a day, that doesn’t really apply. But if you say it 100 times a day, like a Rosary, it can even lead to spiritual delusion if the person is not watching their pride and sinfulness. Basically all I’m saying is, prayer is definitely a big part of growing spiritually but it mustn’t be something separate from our lives. Which I’m sure we’ll all agree with 🙂

God bless!
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Spiritual pride can come in any method of prayer.

In prayer, we humbly turn to God and open ourselves to His transforming grace.

Some people, out of pride, begin to see a transformation in themselves and begin to think it was of their own doing, rather than God’s.

Nothing we have comes from ourselves. God gives us all that we are.

In all things, be humble, for God loves the humble.

Jim
 
JimR-OCDS said:
Spiritual pride can come in any method of prayer.

In prayer, we humbly turn to God and open ourselves to His transforming grace.

Some people, out of pride, begin to see a transformation in themselves and begin to think it was of their own doing, rather than God’s.

Nothing we have comes from ourselves. God gives us all that we are.

In all things, be humble, for God loves the humble.

Jim
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Amen
 
Prayer first. Spiritual reading and reflection second. Putting what you learn into the active life, third.

Read the saints. Find books and letters written by them, and buy them and read them.

Try Universalis too for the Liturgy of the Hours, the readings for each day especially.

And do it all trying to enkindle the spark of love of God and for love of God. 🙂
 
Lifeisawsome,
One thing you said,
it is merely adult and honorable behavior.
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The rules of this Forum? or The rules you make and or abide by?
I am puzzled now, with your answer, to what you edited my words as, (2), and (4).
Concerning believing and truth, which person here, do you know, believes 100% of the time? I mean believes his LORD. This is not to demean anyone or accuse anyone. It is a fair question. And which person here can honestly say, truth is their trademark? It eminates from him and he owns no lies?
If your mouth does not betray you and you never betray truth and love, then you are a perfect person. Maybe I have even betrayed love when I was taken to have accused someone of "hiding behind the rules ".
Is it not true that the bible talks of a man, called Moses, who hid his face behind a veil to protect the children of Israel from the harm of seeing the Glory of God on his face, of which he had to hide between two large rocks on a mountain to protect him? And does not this same bible say, that he hid behind this same veil long after the glory departed from his face? These are the subtle rules that I speak of. We make them to protect ourselves and others, rightly, and then continue to let them hang over our own heads long after the use is gone or right. We hang them on others so that they must be held to our image, rather than the likeness and image of ONE in whose image we are made in.
Is my question then, in this light, not valid and without pretense in this forum? Or do you find fault in me pointing out to those who, without a veil yet, truthfully want to know where to begin in the spiritual life?

I wrote:
“Why not begin with believing what is true about the one you seek anything from? (2)
It is my observation that anyone who hides behind rules of engagement with the one they want to talk to, it is because they are afraid of that one or what they can do to them should they be found out for who they are. (3)”

Think of Moses asking to see God’s Glory hiding behind the Rock.
And think of Israel’s children looking at Moses ( the new Forum master, The carrier of the WORDS from God ), he’s wearing that veil still, but the glow is gone.

So is this question of believing in HIM and the TRUTH of HIM, really assumed or does God really make that kind of a judgement within the context of HIS GLORY and not ours?

Please explain to me if this is not so.
I wrote:
"I read that Jesus loves you. Start there and don’t hide behind the rules.(4) "

Jesus is HONORABLE and the true ADULT in all of HIS behavior.

Is it Jesus you react to or hiding behind the rules? Jesus set us free as I read it all.
 
Lifeisawesome said:
I agree with this order so far - depending upon the person of course:
  1. Daily Prayer Habit - Start simple
  2. Regular Participation in the Sacraments
  3. Reading the Catechism
  4. Reading Scripture
In my mind the following are more advanced activities that follow once the basics (above) are covered.
  • Rosary
  • Chaplet
  • etc
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This would be my opinion
  1. Daily Prayer - Rosary, Chaplet of Seven Sorrows, Divine Mercy Chaplet
  2. Sacraments
  3. Devotional reading - Scripture, writings of the saints, particularly if they have had a large following among exceptionally holy people, writings of the Popes, and reading the Cathechism
I tend to see Christ as the “good doctor”, so a lot of the things that we have in the faith are like medicine. Just because one doesn’t understand them doesn’t mean that they don’t work. Just like negative spiritual warfare done on a person or original sin, just because a person doesn’t believe it exists doesn’t mean it isn’t in operation. :eek: St. Louis Mary de Montfort in True Devotion to Mary said that the Eucharist and Blessed Virgin are like the gold and silver in our faith and St. Maria Faustina’s devotional life practice according to her diary appeared as if she had grasped these concepts without having been taught, though she was sometimes instructed by Christ, which might have been a reason for her extremely high level of santification. Diary of St. Maria Faustina Divine Mercy in My Soul saint-faustina.com/Diary/DMIMS1.shtml

Maybe the point of Scripture is to explain, encourage devotion to, and clarify the Eucharist - Jesus Christ - and devotion to the Mother of the Word is the Jacob’s Ladder, a safe, secure, stairway to Christ. Perhaps the Church is to safeguard, define, and protect the true devotion to Christ. Communion is to receive Christ into oneself, Confession is to confess to Christ as through a veil. If these concepts are true, then when one understands these things conceptually, maybe one’s spiritual life begins to make more sense. Rather than practicing particular prayers, participating in activities, reading things, organizing things etc. because one particularly takes a fancy to it, one does so because one sees these things as useful and situation + time-appropriate tools for coming closer to Christ oneself and bring others with one. If the goal of the Christian life is perfect union with Christ, one might want to participate in the activities most shown through time, observation of others, divine revelation, and logic to lead to this perfect union and take time to understand why people who reached high levels of sanctity chose certain practices. 🙂 😛 🙂

I place prayer over Sacraments simply because one can pray without being fully confirmed into the Catholic Church, but once one is confirmed, the Sacraments, in particular the Eucharist, takes precedence over prayer I suspect. It’s not a sin to not say the Rosary daily as it is a sin to miss Sunday mass. However, I have heard several stories of people who began particular prayers, in particular the Rosary (although I imagine it could also happen with the others: Chaplet of Seven Sorrows or Divine Mercy Chaplet but perhaps has not yet been attempted), and were eventually led to the Church 😉

P.S. I checked out your spiritual direction page and was very interested in the priest. Is he open to questions from curious random strangers? 🙂

*Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with Thee. Blessed art Thou among women and blessed is the fruit of Thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen. *

Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse. Come Holy Spirit, come by means of the powerful intercession of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, your well beloved spouse.

For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world! For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world! For the sake of his sorrowful passion, have mercy on us and on the whole world!

O Mary, conceived without sin, pray for us who have recourse to thee and those who do not!
Sorrowful and Immaculate Heart of Mary, pray for us!

*Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with Thee. Blessed art Thou among women and blessed is the fruit of Thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death. Amen. *
 
Lifeisawesome said:
I gave a talk to the men at my parish this morning on my conversion to Catholicism. At the end, one participant threw up a softball for the benefit of the others. He asked, me, “If someone wanted to go deeper in their faith, where should they start?” I thought it was a great question. How would you answer it?
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This thread has many good responses and suggestions. One thing I would add: it is very helpful in beginning any journey, and it continues to be helpful during the journey, to have a “roadmap” of the path from here to there.

Our Catholic traditional spiritual theology includes the crucially important understanding of the “three ways”, or three stages of the interior life. (Teresa’s experience of the seven interior mansions is, I believe, completely consistent with that overview of the three main stages.) It is helpful for several reasons to receive some understanding of all this - to know what to expect, and what to hope for, and what to prepare for. Especially it is important for a serious disciple and pilgrim to not be overwhelmed, or despairing, or confused more than is unavoidable if and when the experience of the 1st dark night comes upon him.

This spirituality can help orient a person toward the holiness that is our common vocation, and can be something of an interior and personal guide in the journey. Because good spiritual directors are so very rare, such a foundation can be crucial.

fide
 
fide said:
This thread has many good responses and suggestions. One thing I would add: it is very helpful in beginning any journey, and it continues to be helpful during the journey, to have a “roadmap” of the path from here to there.

Our Catholic traditional spiritual theology includes the crucially important understanding of the “three ways”, or three stages of the interior life. (Teresa’s experience of the seven interior mansions is, I believe, completely consistent with that overview of the three main stages.) It is helpful for several reasons to receive some understanding of all this - to know what to expect, and what to hope for, and what to prepare for. Especially it is important for a serious disciple and pilgrim to not be overwhelmed, or despairing, or confused more than is unavoidable if and when the experience of the 1st dark night comes upon him.

This spirituality can help orient a person toward the holiness that is our common vocation, and can be something of an interior and personal guide in the journey. Because good spiritual directors are so very rare, such a foundation can be crucial.

fide
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I think your comments are very true. The challenge in my experience is that your vantage point, the proclivity/inclination, knowledge to even bring this up far surpasses the average Catholic who is taking the beginning steps toward deepening their faith. However, to those who are already well on their way - your suggestions are important.
 
Lifeisawesome said:
I think your comments are very true. The challenge in my experience is that your vantage point, the proclivity/inclination, knowledge to even bring this up far surpasses the average Catholic who is taking the beginning steps toward deepening their faith. However, to those who are already well on their way - your suggestions are important.
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Maybe you are right - certainly beginners would not be able to hold all that a full exposition would entail. However, the danger “on the other side” so to speak is that many beginners fail to recognize that their experience is, indeed, only that in the beginning, and that the “road” changes radically as the journey proceeds.

For example, I frequently hear from laity and from the pulpit the example of St. Peter - how brash he was, how he “didn’t get it”, how he failed to understand the Lord, etc. etc. And this example is then held up to justify our brashness, our “not getting it”, our inability to understand the Lord, etc. After all, Peter was an apostle and a saint - hence, all we need do is stumble along as Peter did, and all is well. Thus, mediocrity and compromise and worldliness get justified, and “holiness” is made out to be pretty much what we are right now.

This truncated spirituality fails to acknowledge that Peter was in a process, and his beginning was definitely not his end. He did finally reach true holiness of life, because he persevered with the Lord through the Passion (after his crisis and recovery) and Resurrection and Ascension. He did not remain where he was - and neither should we. This all makes sense to us if and only if we have some knowledge of the journey, and its intended end result of authentic holiness.
 
fide said:
Maybe you are right - certainly beginners would not be able to hold all that a full exposition would entail. However, the danger “on the other side” so to speak is that many beginners fail to recognize that their experience is, indeed, only that in the beginning, and that the “road” changes radically as the journey proceeds.

For example, I frequently hear from laity and from the pulpit the example of St. Peter - how brash he was, how he “didn’t get it”, how he failed to understand the Lord, etc. etc. And this example is then held up to justify our brashness, our “not getting it”, our inability to understand the Lord, etc. After all, Peter was an apostle and a saint - hence, all we need do is stumble along as Peter did, and all is well. Thus, mediocrity and compromise and worldliness get justified, and “holiness” is made out to be pretty much what we are right now.

This truncated spirituality fails to acknowledge that Peter was in a process, and his beginning was definitely not his end. He did finally reach true holiness of life, because he persevered with the Lord through the Passion (after his crisis and recovery) and Resurrection and Ascension. He did not remain where he was - and neither should we. This all makes sense to us if and only if we have some knowledge of the journey, and its intended end result of authentic holiness.
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Well said - hard to argue…
 
Lifeisawesome said:
Well said - hard to argue…
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Thank you. It has been good talking thus with you - but the question remains: How then, in the context of such misunderstandings among so many Catholics, both clergy and laity, are we to promote the solid teaching of Vatican II, All are called to holiness, to the fullness of Christian life and to the perfection of charity?

The saints have shown us that real, authentic holiness for human persons is not a hopeless dream - “perfection” as God desires it of us - the perfection of charity - is not an impossibility. His grace is sufficient, and it is poured out to us to overflowing. Yes it is hard: the cross is hard! But this is our vocation, God’s intention, our deepest and most longed-for desire: to be in communion with God the Holy Trinity and with one another, in the eternal fire of His love and holiness.

May the Lord help us, and shepherd us to Him. May the Lord enable in us (to quote the book of Catherine Doherty) the Gospel without compromise.

May the Lord guide you, Lifeisawesome, and me to a full participation in His work.
 
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