Where to Turn?

[Wildkit]

If you were evangelizing a Non-Christian, and he desired to go with the Eastern Orthodox Church, what would you do?

 

[DJK100]

If you were evangelizing a Non-Christian, and he desired to go with the Eastern Orthodox Church, what would you do?

Try asking him to look into Eastern Rite Catholic Churches before he makes his final decsion.

 

[Bezant]

Try asking him to look into Eastern Rite Catholic Churches before he makes his final decsion.

This is probably a good idea, although if he decides to go Orthodox, leave him to his decision.

 

[PJM]

=Wildkit;9085871]If you were evangelizing a Non-Christian, and he desired to go with the Eastern Orthodox Church, what would you do?

1. ASK Why?
2. Explain that no where in the Bible has God ever; even once permitted any faith beliefs other than His Own. That is precisely why God Himself ordains and Founded ONLY One God; Only One set of Faith beliefs and Only One Church…

The Key’s to heven were given to ONLY Peter and Christ Own CC:thumbsup:

Psalms 127:1 "“Unless the Lord builds the house, those who build it labor in vain. Unless the Lord watches over the city, the watchman stays awake in vain.”

ONLY THE CC HAS BOTH THE HOLY SPIRIT [JN.14;16-17 AND JN.20;19-22; AND JESUS HIMSELF TO WARRANT THEIR TEACHING TRUTH… JOHN 17:15-19; MT.28;16-19; AND MT.16;15-19

John.14: 26 “But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.”

Acts.20: 28 “Take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to care for the church of God [SINGULAR] which he obtained with the blood of his own Son.”

**Romans 13: 2 **“Therefore he who resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment.”

Eph. 4: 1-7 “I therefore, a prisoner for the Lord, beg you to lead a life worthy of the calling to which you have been called, with all lowliness and meekness, with patience, forbearing one another in love, ***eager to maintain the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to the one hope that belongs to your call, one Lord, one faith,[ONLY ONE SET OF FAITH BELIEFS] ***one baptism, one God and Father of us all, who is above all and through all and in all. But grace was given to each of us according to the measure of Christ’s gift".

**John.10: 16 **“And I have other sheep, that are not of this fold; I must bring them also, and they will heed my voice. ***So there shall be one flock, one shepherd” ***

Eph. 2:19-20 “So then you are no longer strangers and sojourners, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God,[SINGULAR] ***built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus himself being the cornerstone, *** in whom the whole structure is joined together and grows into a holy temple in the Lord; in whom you also are built into it for a dwelling place of God in the Spirit.”

**Eph. 3: 9-10 ** “And to make all men see what is the plan of the mystery hidden for ages in God who created all things; that through the church **singular] **the manifold wisdom of God might now be made known to the principalities and powers in the heavenly places. This was according to the eternal purpose which he has realized in Christ Jesus our Lord,

God Bless,
Pat**

 

[Bezant]

1. Explain that no where in the Bible has God ever; even once permitted any faith beliefs other than His Own. That is precisely why God Himself ordains and Founded ONLY One God; Only One set of Faith beliefs and Only One Church…

Doesn’t the Orthodox Church say the exact same thing ? How does one tell the difference between one Church who says “We are the historical Church that Jesus founded” and the other Church that says, “We are the one Church, the Way, the Truth, the Life?”

 

[PJM]

=Bezant;9116386]Doesn’t the Orthodox Church say the exact same thing ? How does one tell the difference between one Church who says “We are the historical Church that Jesus founded” and the other Church that says, “We are the one Church, the Way, the Truth, the Life?”

READ the Bible my friend,** [Mt.16:15-19 and Mt. 28: 16-20]** there can be as you suggest ONLY one truth.

Here is what the early Father thought and Thought:

Ignatius of Antioch
You [the See of Rome] have envied no one, but others have you taught. I desire only that what you have enjoined in your instructions may remain in force (Epistle to the Romans 3:1 [A.D. 110]).

Irenaeus
But since it would be too long to enumerate in such a volume as this the succession of all the churches, we shall confound all those who, in whatever manner, whether through self-satisfaction or vainglory, or through blindness and wicked opinion, assemble other than where it is proper, by pointing out here the successions of the bishops of the greatest and most ancient church known to all, founded and organized at Rome by the two most glorious apostles. Peter and Paul, that church which has the tradition and the faith which comes down to us after having been announced to men by the apostles. With that church, because of its superior origin, all the churches must agree, that is, all the faithful in the whole world, and it is in her that the faithful everywhere have maintained the apostolic tradition (Against Heresies 3:3:2 [inter A.D. 180-190]).

Clement of Alexandria
[T]he blessed Peter, the chosen, the preeminent, the first among the disciples, for whom alone with himself the Savior paid the tribute [Matt. 17:27], quickly grasped and understood their meaning. And what does he say? “Behold, we have left all and have followed you” [Matt. 19:2 7, Mark 10:28] (Who is the Rich Man That is Saved? 21:3-5 [A.D. 200]).

Tertullian
[T]he Lord said to Peter, “On this rock I will build my Church, I have given you the keys of the kingdom of heaven [and] whatever you shall have bound or loosed on earth will be bound or loosed in heaven” [Matt. 16:18-19]. … Upon you, he says, I will build my Church; and I will give to you the keys, not to the Church; and whatever you shall have bound or you shall have loose
and, not what they shall have bound or they shall have loosed (Modesty 21:9-10 [A.D. 220]).

Letter of Clement to James
Be it known to you, my lord, that Simon [Peter], who, for the sake of the true faith, and the most sure foundation of his doctrine, was set apart to be the foundation of the Church, and for this end was by Jesus himself, with his truthful mouth, named Peter, the first-fruits of our Lord, the first of the apostles; to whom first the Father revealed the Son; whom the Christ, with good reason, blessed; the called, and elect (Letter of Clement to James 2 [A.D, 221]).

Cyprian
With a false bishop appointed for themselves by heretics, they dare even to set sail and carry letters from schismatics and blasphemers to the Chair of Peter and to the principal church [at Rome], in which sacerdotal unity has its source" (Epistle to Cornelius [Bishop of Rome] 59:14 [A.D. 252]).

The Lord says to Peter: “I say to you,” he says, “that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my Church” . . . On him he builds the Church, and to him he gives the command to feed the sheep John 21:17], and although he assigns a like power to all the apostles, yet he founded a single chair [cathedra], and he established by his own authority a source and an intrinsic reason for that unity. Indeed, the others were that also which Peter was *, but a primacy is given to Peter, whereby it is made clear that there is but one Church and one chair. So too, all [the apostles] are shepherds, and the flock is shown to be one, fed by all the apostles in single-minded accord. If someone does not hold fast to this unity of Peter, can he imagine that he still holds the faith? If he [should] desert the chair of Peter upon whom the Church was built, can he still be confident that he is in the Church? (The Unity of the Catholic Church 4 [A.D. 251]).

Cyril of Jerusalem
In the power of the same Holy Spirit, Peter, both the chief of the apostles and the keeper of the keys of the kingdom of heaven, in the name of Christ healed Aeneas the paralytic at Lydda, which is now called Diospolis [Acts 9 ;3 2-3 4] (Catechetical Lectures 17;27 [A.D. 350]).

Optatus
In the city of Rome the Episcopal chair was given first to Peter, the chair in which Peter sat, the same who was head — that is why he is also called Cephas — of all the apostles, the one chair in which unity is maintained by all. Neither do the apostles proceed individually on their own, and anyone who would [presume to] set up another chair in opposition to that single chair would, by that very fact, be a schismatic and a sinner. . . . Recall, then, the origins of your chair, those of you who wish to claim for yourselves the title of holy Church" (The Schism of the Donatists 2:2 [circa A.D. 367]).

Ambrose of Milan
[Christ] made answer: “You are Peter, and upon this rock will I build my Church . . .” Could he not, then, strengthen the faith of the man to whom, acting on his own authority, he gave the kingdom, whom he called the rock, thereby declaring him to be the foundation of the Church [Matt. 16:18]? (The Faith 4:5 [A.D. 379]).

Augustine
Among these [apostles] Peter alone almost everywhere deserved to represent the whole Church. Because of that representation of the Church, which only he bore, he deserved to hear “I will give to you the keys of the kingdom of heaven” (Sermons 295:2 [A.D. 411]).

Who is ignorant that the first of the apostles is the most blessed Peter? (Commentary on John 56:1 [A.D. 416]).

OF COUSE THEY CLAIM WHAT THEY DO: OTHERWISE, LIKE PROTESTANTS THEY HAVE NO ARGUMENT.*

 

[Bezant]

READ the Bible my friend,** [Mt.16:15-19 and Mt. 28: 16-20]** there can be as you suggest ONLY one truth.

Here is what the early Father thought and Thought:

Well, the Orthodox have also read the Bible and have scriptural evidence to support their position. They also have evidence from the apostolic fathers to support their historical arguments.

I’m not arguing that the Orthodox Church is the historical church that Jesus founded. However, if you’re already a faithful Orthodox or Catholic, obviously this information affirms your faith.

But as a potential convert considering Orthodoxy or Catholicism, you must choose between Churches with very similar histories, evidence, and positions, but rather nuanced differences on major issues (e.g., the Filioque, ancestral sin). For many considering conversion, these similarities and nuanced differences makes discerning between the Churches very difficult. From that perspective, I don’t think the answer becomes clear only if you read this or that verse.

OF COUSE THEY CLAIM WHAT THEY DO: OTHERWISE, LIKE PROTESTANTS THEY HAVE NO ARGUMENT.

If they have no argument, then there’s no harm in examining it

In all seriousness though, the Orthodox have strong arguments, and Protestants have strong arguments; whether or not they are right is a different matter.

 

[PJM]

=Bezant;9118215]Well, the Orthodox have also read the Bible and have scriptural evidence to support their position. They also have evidence from the apostolic fathers to support their historical arguments.

I’m not arguing that the Orthodox Church is the historical church that Jesus founded. However, if you’re already a faithful Orthodox or Catholic, obviously this information affirms your faith.

But as a potential convert considering Orthodoxy or Catholicism, you must choose between Churches with very similar histories, evidence, and positions, but rather nuanced differences on major issues (e.g., the Filioque, ancestral sin). For many considering conversion, these similarities and nuanced differences makes discerning between the Churches very difficult. From that perspective, I don’t think the answer becomes clear only if you read this or that verse.

If they have no argument, then there’s no harm in examining it

In all seriousness though, the Orthodox have strong arguments, and Protestants have strong arguments; whether or not they are right is a different matter.

So dear freind LET"S examine their evidence togeather:thumbsup:

What is it?