Which Catholic Church do you belong to?

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Peter_J said:
True. As a matter of fact, until a few hours ago, all the ECs in the poll fell into one of three families: West Syriac, East Syriac, and Greek Catholics.
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I have seen some YouTube videos of Armenian liturgies (I do not know if they were Catholic or Armenian Apostolic), but from what I have seen so far, their worship is beautiful.
 
angelic06 said:
I have seen some YouTube videos of Armenian liturgies (I do not know if they were Catholic or Armenian Apostolic), but from what I have seen so far, their worship is beautiful.
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I’d like to see those … maybe not just yet (I’m still working my way through the various West Syrian and East Syrian liturgies), but someday, along with Coptic, Ethiopian, and/or Eritrean liturgies. 👍
 
Latin, Roman Rite. As an aside, a particular favorite of mine is The Liturgy of Saint John Chrysostom. At Easter, I particularly use the Hymn of the Cherubim for reflection. The recording that I have is by Konstanin Shvedov. Sung by Slavyanka, a Men’s Chorus, is out of the context of the Russian Orthodox Church.

For those not familiar, the Hymn of the Cherubim is as follows:

Let us, who mystically represent
the Cherubim, and chant
the thrice-holy hymn
to the Life-giving Trinity,lay aside all earthly care.

Amen. That we may raise
on high the King of all,
Who comes invisibly upborne
by Angelic Hosts.
Alleluia, Alleluia. Alleluia.

It’s three mins 30 secs with about 3/4‘s of this in a reverent, even somewhat mournful tone. I think of the Christ, having been crucified and now dead. From on high, even the angels weep for the Lamb who was slain. Yet, the final fourth of the hymn has a triumphant sound. He who was dead is no longer constrained by a tomb. He is raised from the dead and raised to the Throne of Heaven. I can hardly listen to it without tears.

Do I understand correctly that while there might be a liturgy, such as the one mentioned, there are actually different musical settings? One of you more familiar with this might set me straight.
 
Ontheway said:
Russian Catholic Church? What is that? Same goes for the other national catholic churches. If there is a Romanian Catholic Church is it similar to American Catholic Church?
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No. In these countries there are communities of Roman/Latin Catholics and communities of Eastern/Byzantine Catholics, all in union with Rome. Independent Catholic churches didn’t develop in Central and Eastern Europe, with the exception of Poland AFAIK. If the OP said “other Greek Catholics”, he referred to Eastern/Byzantine Catholics.
 
5Loaves said:
…that we may receive the King of all,
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The small booklet that came with the CD has what I assume to be the original Russian text and four (4) translations of the liturgy. I checked the English and it has “raise on high”. The text for the other three is:

Romanian: Yako da Tsarya vayekh podimyem,
French: Pour recevoir le Roi de toutes choses,
German: Auf daB wir erheben den Kunig des Alls,

So, it’s a question of whether there’s a misprint of the original or a translation error. Thank you calling my attention to this. As I stated, I use hymns, at times, for reflection. Ones in English direct my attention and thoughts. Those in another language allow me more to concentrate more on what the musical composition is suggesting, if this makes any sense.

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savone said:
Romanian: Yako da Tsarya vayekh podimyem,
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This is not Romanian. “Tsarya” suggests a Slavic root, so maybe the translation is from a Slavic language.

Romanian: “Ca pe Împăratul tuturor să primim” (ca să primim = that we may receive, Împăratul tuturor = the King of all).
 
vames said:
This is not Romanian. “Tsarya” suggests a Slavic root, so maybe the translation is from a Slavic language.

Romanian: “Ca pe Împăratul tuturor să primim” (ca să primim = that we may receive, Împăratul tuturor = the King of all).
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The booklet doesn’t give language headings for each translation. Three of them - English, French, and German are known. At least from a standpoint of curiosity, there are at least three (3) questions.

There is the one raised by you, vames. What is the language that appears under the words “Bozhestvennaya Liturgiya”? One is raised by 5Loaves with regards to the translation of a text. And, a third one pertains to the other, 5th, language. I thought it might be Russian because of the nature of some of the characters used.

Thank you for calling my attention to this.
 
savone said:
TWhat is the language that appears under the words “Bozhestvennaya Liturgiya”?
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“Bozhestvennaya Liturgiya” is “Divine Liturgy” in Russian. Божественная литургия > Бог = Bog (God).

If the verse you transcribed above (Yako…) looks like Яко да Царя всех подымем, it’s Russian. If it looks slightly different, it’s in other Slavic language.
 
vames said:
“Bozhestvennaya Liturgiya” is “Divine Liturgy” in Russian. Божественная литургия > Бог = Bog (God).

If the verse you transcribed above (Yako…) looks like Яко да Царя всех подымем, it’s Russian. If it looks slightly different, it’s in other Slavic language.
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Now, we’re getting there. There are five columns, each a translation. They have the headings of:
  1. Божественная литургия (copied what you wrote)
  2. Bozhestvennaya Liturgiya
  3. Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom
  4. Liturgie de Saint-Jen Chrysostome
  5. Die Gottliche Liturgie Des Heiligen Johannes Chrysostomus.
So, 1) is Russian, 3) is English, 4) is French, and 5) is German. That leaves just 2). Also, someone with whom I consulted has indicated that “receive” is correct, as 5Loaves stated. Thank you. Back to the topic of the thread.
 
Oh, good, then 2) is simply the Latin transliteration of 1). I was puzzled by “vayekh” from the verse, because the Slavic “all” is “ves/vse”. So a correct translation would be “vsekh podymem” or “vsyékh podymyém”.

There are a lot of musical settings of the Liturgy. Some are adaptations from old Byzantine melodies, done by monks and priests, some are the done by composers like Gretchaninov, Rachmaninov, Tchaikovsky.
To get a good idea of this diversity, check out these versions of the Cherubic Hymn, by choirs from Belarus, Bulgaria, Romania, Ukraine, Serbia and Russia.
 
The part of the Catholic Church that I belong to is the Latin rite.
 
savone said:
Also, someone with whom I consulted has indicated that “receive” is correct, as 5Loaves stated. Thank you. Back to the topic of the thread.
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Well, we all sing it in every Divine Liturgy at the end of the Great Entrance, and the deacon says it at the altar before the Great Entrance so it’s very familiar to us who have the Liturgy in English. 🙂
 
I am a member of the Italo Greek Church, a Parish of the Byzantine Eparchy of Phoenix.
 
Transcriptions like “Bozhestvennaya Liturgiya” seem just disgusting for me. All western and some southern Slavic languages are written in Latin alphabet and use diacritisc. With a little effort (symbols for “hard” and “soft” symbols) Russian can be written in this way without terrible things like zh or worse kh for x in azbuka what would be by all Slavs writen like ch (or h if their language does not have sound h). So “Božestvennaja liturgi(j)a” for example. I realize that transcription like above is more “English” but unrespecting Slavic nature and identity of a language. And for example who transcripts German “Straße” as “Shtraahseh”?
 
I have been lurking on this forum for years, but responded as Syro-Malankara. From the active posters, I think we have two active non-Maronite West Syriacs on the forum.
 
I’m surprised, to be honest, at the number of Maronites. The number of Greeks is expected, but the Syriacs in general are higher than I thought there would be 🤷.
 
I am aware of another Coptic Catholic in CAF, and 2 Armenian Catholics, but they have not signed on to the thread.

Blessings
 
MorEphrem said:
I’m surprised, to be honest, at the number of Maronites. The number of Greeks is expected, but the Syriacs in general are higher than I thought there would be 🤷.
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Funny that you should say that, because just yesterday I was looking at the results and thinking to myself: I’m *not *surprised that the Greek Catholic family outnumbers the West-Syriac family by 2-to-1; but I *am *surprised that the East-Syriac family is so low (only 2 thus far).
 
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