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grannymh
Guest
Such a simple answer; yet, so completely complex.
Would it be possible to pick one or a handful of doctrines which surround the Second Person of the Holy Trinity?
Which Catholic doctrines are currently being challenged by emerging christianity?
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Would it be possible to pick one or a handful of doctrines which surround the Second Person of the Holy Trinity?
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ProdglArchitect
Guest
Referencing that site here is akin to using wikipedia for your thesis paperncronline.org/news/faith-parish/unformed-future
I was googling and came across this, quite interesting and it gives a taste of what the “emerging church” is about.
Hope it is helpful in your research.
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simpleas
Guest
We do that all the time when we quote a saint, pope etc. Someone has told us who God is, finding him for oneself can be a life time commitment, and having an opinion seems to be uncomfortable and wrong for some. But if we never challenge what we are taught we can never gain our own relationship with God, IMO
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grannymh
Guest
Stepping aside, there are a few interesting gems. For example, if the mind needs “communion” over “answers”, that opens up the possibility of chaos. If answers give one a sense of control, then what happens when there are people with different answers in communion with each other. Are we suppose to put answers on the back burner? Because the soul is intellective, wouldn’t there be a natural curiosity for answers?Referencing that site here is akin to using wikipedia for your thesis paper
From referenced *National Catholic Reporter *ncronline.org/news/faith-parish/unformed-future
Rohr said Rahner believed “the mind’s deepest need is not for answers, but for communion. That might seem surprising and maybe even soft theology,” he said, “but the mind and ego want answers, answers, answers because it gives you a sense of control. The soul doesn’t want answers, it wants meaning.”
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ProdglArchitect
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I’m afraid I don’t follow your question here, or what you’re trying to get at. My comment was aimed at the fact that the National Catholic Reporter is a known heterodox publication not in communion with the Catholic Church on several major issues. They are not a good source from which to derive what the Church believes and teaches.
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Darryl_B
Guest
“Emerging Christianity” is a polite way of saying “diverging Christianity”.
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grannymh
Guest
Good description. One of the first ideas that I read implies that a “diverging Christianity” is or should be acceptable within the Catholic Church.
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grannymh
Guest
Thank you for asking for a clarification.
Yes, I know about the National Catholic Reporter being a known heterodox publication not in communion with the Catholic Church. Therefore, that would be a good background source for some of the current attacks on Catholic doctrines.
Recently, I have been reading some rather strange personal observations about the Catholic Church. In the spirit of investigative journalism, I did some research and cross-checking references. The National Catholic Reporter article is a pure gift because I recognized the language that looks appealing, but in reality there is the permission that lay people can downgrade or set aside doctrines at their discretion. There is the implication that doctrines as “answers” are not what is really needed in a church.
Please take a look at the link’s paragraph which begins with
“I hope whatever emerging Christianity is,” said Franciscan Fr. Richard Rohr, a featured speaker at the conference, “it’s going to be much more practice-based than doctrine-based. …
In my childhood neighborhood, “more practice-based” meant taking civil responsibility seriously. This meant that the first Catholic ran for a major position in the local government. Today, it can mean getting public shelter for the homeless in winter. Getting "more practice-based is a good thing. What is not good is the hint that some doctrines should lose their importance because they seem irrelevant to the practice-based needs.
What I sense is that there is a loss of the balance of *both *practice and doctrines.
This thread’s title is a question because I would like to know if other people are seeing the same dangers of the “big tent” that I am seeing. Most likely other people would be able to describe the dangers in more understandable ways. I hope people will continue with post 21.
I feel bad that I probably did not give a good explanation as to why we need to look at
heterodox writings wherever they appear so that “understanding” them will help us defend our beliefs.
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simpleas
Guest
Were you able to watch/listen to the video from post #13?
Is the Priest to be regarded as a bona fide heretic in this day and age? What I hear from him is a refreshing way to understand our faith.
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grannymh
Guest
Calling someone a bona fide heretic is not allowed here.
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grannymh
Guest
For further information, please read the beginning of the Catholic Answers Tract
The Great Heresies
catholic.com/tracts/the-great-heresies
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grannymh
Guest
I started the video and then stopped, because my mind was cluttered with questions coming from the video’s title “Alternative Orthodoxy”.
What is he proposing? Are his proposals connected with another priest I read about a few years back? Is he proposing an acceptable understanding or is he creating a proposal in tune with our “modern” obsession to update, that is, alter some Catholic doctrines?
Your “What I hear from him is a refreshing way to understand our faith” is having a calming effect on my cluttered mind. Refreshing our faith sounds great!
“Refreshing” sounds great until one reads the title of the conference in the article from the National Catholic Reporter. ncronline.org/news/faith-parish/unformed-future
The conference title is “Emerging Christianity: How We Get There Determines Where We Arrive.” And a featured speaker is Father Richard Rohr.
Everyone – Stop what you are thinking about the connection. Please keep an open mind.
Most likely, there can be plenty of good truths in Father Rohr’s talk at the conference. I am sure that some are urgently needed because we live in a secular world which puts Christianity per se on the back burner. Most of us need to get off our arse.
That being said, in addition we need to discern which Catholic doctrines are possibly being sidestepped and/or challenged.
Because of the Sacrament of Holy Orders, we respect our priests. Unfortunately, the reality is that priests, like ourselves, can fail in a variety of ways. As we pray for ourselves, we need to add prayers for our priests, including the one who serves as our diocesan Bishop and the one who serves as our Pope.
While we are on our knees, we should spend a bit of time with our eyes open.
P.S. I will get back to the video in post 13.
P.P.S. I think I now know what the title of the conference means --maybe.
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simpleas
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simpleas
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Thanks.
Yes you will need listen to the video in order for you to take from it what you will. I think he is trying to bring an understanding of the cross and what it means, especially for people who may think of God as an angry deity that demanded the sacrifice of Jesus.
The term “Jesus became the Christ” was something I’d missed along the way. Granted I’ve never had teachings on our Catholic faith as in study, but learnt some from Mass and my own readings.
The internet has opened up so much information, one can get carried away!
I look forward to your opinion/comments on the video.
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grannymh
Guest
That is exactly why I made a general statement with no reference to a particular person or a particular article.
I simply answered your question with a serious caution. The caution is appropriate on CAF.
The link catholic.com/tracts/the-great-heresies
comes from another thread which is discussing heresies. Years ago, I attended a brief workshop on how old heresies are adapted today. As this thread develops, we may discover some old heresies which never seem to die. Personally speaking, some form of Arianism is an easy one to spot.
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grannymh
Guest
Aside from the video, and going by the comments I have seen since landing on CAF, the way some people can handle the truths surrounding Original Sin is to claim that God is an awful [human] father.Thanks.
Yes you will need listen to the video in order for you to take from it what you will. I think he is trying to bring an understanding of the cross and what it means, especially for people who may think of God as an angry deity that demanded the sacrifice of Jesus.
The term “Jesus became the Christ” was something I’d missed along the way. Granted I’ve never had teachings on our Catholic faith as in study, but learnt some from Mass and my own readings.
The internet has opened up so much information, one can get carried away!
I look forward to your opinion/comments on the video.
Going back to post 5, Steve b comments that from what he has read, Emerging Christianity is a Protestant movement. Since some, not all, Protestant faiths no longer require the reality of a first founder of the human species, I doubt that they would be interested in the Catholic teachings on that first founder’s Original mortal Sin. On the other hand, some of the ideas of Emerging Christianity can be seen in those Catholic “movements” to update Catholicism.
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grannymh
Guest
While there are definitely Protestant promoters of Emerging Christianity, have you ever come across some of the ideas in Catholic writings?
Since you said that there is no expiration date to 2 Peter, chapter 1,
it is definitely a good idea to re-read it.
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steve_b
Guest
Do you have examples for what you mean by “some of the ideas”?
g:
There is no expiration to what Peter said there… Education in the faith is to be ever increasing as are the other attributes he mentions…Since you said that there is no expiration date to 2 Peter, chapter 1,
it is definitely a good idea to re-read it.
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weller2
Guest
Does the Spirit come from Father and Son?
Catholic: Of course!
Orthodox: No way!
Emergent: Who cares?
Catholic: Of course!
Orthodox: No way!
Emergent: Who cares?
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Michael19682
Guest
Yes. All doctrine surrounds the Second Person, as he is the center of everything and there is nothing which does not surround him. For various reasons, all doctrine unique to the Roman Catholic Church, which is one holy, catholic and apostolic church, and has been called the Petrine Ministry, have been used as a points of entry in an assault on what I will call the Petrine Infrastructure, its people.
E.g. Jesus said that his purpose was to not lose any of what his father won for him. The assault uses “memory” of personal sin, which latter is forgiven through confession, to steal away members whom are not secure in their faith. They replace genuine absolution with a version of their own, and in this way call themselves truly catholic. The error hinges on a simple misunderstanding of what Jesus intended to Peter.
Once the person joins tent Church, which admittedly is still about the fundamentals of Jesus and cannot be called unholy, his conversion is not complete until he renounces his Catholicism, which if he did not renounce, would create problems for the theme that holds together the tent – anti catholicism. After all, so the detract-ionists reason goes, “If you are lost-with-us, then we are all lost by implication and never belonged to him.” You can see the problem for that doctrine. You are either with-us or against-us; which is true enough; but where are we to be found.
I personally think part of it is historical. The Catholic Church has been through the crusades and a long history of greatness in time. Some other congregations are a few years old, and possibly hunger for what they imagine are the earthly benefits of faith?
All the movies of knights in shining armor and the glory days of Rome (which had ended by the time of the conversion of Constantine?), the depictions of Roman soldiers in ancient times etc., have the power like all of history to provoke sensual fantasy.
The entire anti catholic movement is like a devil perpetuated hypnosis. It’s difficult to blame people who are unconscious of their motives.
True unity involves waking up.
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