Which Christian denominations support Gay Marriage?

[Stephen168]

I believe that what the Bible does tell us is concerning the nature of God and that God seeks to be expressed in human relationships…

But not in human design? just human relationships?

 

[Publisher]

And also where does your Church get the word of God if not from the BIble. I understand you do not agree with Oral Teachings but I thought you obeyed SS?

This is a two fold answer…concerning the Bible…"Friends appeciation of the Bible and other scriptures springs from our faith that there is in everyone that capacity to be open and responsive to the experience of the Divine. The possibility of that experience has been present in every place and time, even before the Bible was written, whenever and wherever people have earnestly sought communion with God and and understanding of God’s will.

The influence of the Bible upon the Society of Friends has been unique and profound…like Fox, Friends since have found the Bible to be the record of direct experiences of the Holy Spirit, serving as an important touchstone against which to test our leadings.

We do not however consider scriptures whether Hebrew or Christina or those of other faiths to be the final revelation of God’s nature and will…"

“What is Quaker faith? It is not a tidy package of words which you can capture at any given time and then repeat weekly at a worship service. It is an experience of discovery which starts the discoverer on a journey which is life long…No one is allowed to get it second hand by accepting a ready-made creed. Furthermore, the discovery points a path that demands a journey and gives you the power to make the journey.”

Faith and Practice, PYM of the Society of Friends

If we err, we are in God’s hands of mercy and grace or correction and judgement…it is not an easy faith to be a part of…we take responsibility for our own beliefs, mistakes, accomplishments and joys as we follow Christ experientially with one another.

 

[Publisher]

But not in human design? just human relationships?

He is all and in all. He can take the basest of things and make it noble…he can take water and make wine. He has designed within us the capacity to love and displays that amazing diversity in human relationships to the point that we echo…“In Christ there is neither male nor female…bond or free…gay or straight…” to paraphrase…God is at work in human design and our diversity is part of that design.

 

[rinnie]

He is all and in all. He can take the basest of things and make it noble…he can take water and make wine. He has designed within us the capacity to love and displays that amazing diversity in human relationships to the point that we echo…“In Christ there is neither male nor female…bond or free…gay or straight…” to paraphrase…God is at work in human design and our diversity is part of that design.

He can take water and make wine. How can you accept that scripture, but deny that marriage is between male and female?

 

[rinnie]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

My faith does not base itself on “sola scriptura”. We believe God is to be a Living Experience and Reality, not based on a book or a creed…but a living faith.

The writers of the gospel have Jesus quoting the Hebrew Bible on the subject of marriage…since he is not recorded about speaking about same sex marriage, I cannot turn to chapter and verse proof texts. I believe that what the Bible does tell us is concerning the nature of God and that God seeks to be expressed in human relationships…in this expression we are made in His image. Gay and Lesbian people too are made in the image of God…and the Life of God is expressed and experienced in their lives.

My faith community accepts if two people who choose to live their life in commitment to one another under the care of the Meeting may petition the Monthly Meeting to take their relationship under it’s care. A “Clearing Committee” is formed and they are interviewed and counseled concerning the responsibilities two people have toward one another who commit themselves to each other in marriage. Once the committee is satisfied that the couple understands the sacred commitment and affirm their bond in love are given permission by the Monthy Meeting to schedule a “meeting for worship for marriage”.

At the appointed time the Meeting gathers and the couple sit on the “facing bench” in front of the Meeting. Prayers, advice, short instruction concerning the responsibility of marriage…they then stand and face one another and say to each other…“In the Presence of God and these Friends, I _______ take thee,_______ to be my partner, promising with divine assistance to be unto thee a loving and faithful partner so long as we both shall live.” The couple sit and awaits whoever has “care of the Meeting” to turn to the person next to him and shakes hands…all shake hands and the Meeting is over. The couple then signs the certificate of marriage with all present adding their names to it.

[SIGN]Our understanding is based on the worth and dignity of persons which the gospel of Jesus of Nazareth calls us to. [/SIGN] Our understanding is based on the belief that God is present among us and has led us to affirm their worth.

We reached this conclusion based on years of discussion, prayer, discussion…listening to those who would bear their testimony of God’s grace and mercy in their lives and watched them live the life of Christ out before the Meeting in dignity and integrity of heart and spirit conforming themselves to gospel of Christ.

The Spirit of God has led our Monthly Meeting and Yearly Meeting to open our hearts and Meeting to their ministry to us as we are humbled by their character and kindness in a world that treats them with disdain and discrimination calling them “sick”, “perverts”, “abominations”, “defective” and “broken”…they have shown they are none of those things, but instead children of God due respect and dignity of life.

But Gen, and Matt, is not what you consider the Gospel of Jesus of Nazareth then? I do not understand?

 

[Publisher]

He can take water and make wine. How can you accept that scripture, but deny that marriage is between male and female?

Rinnie,

I accept the principle…He takes what is base and makes it noble…I do not believe Jesus turned water into wine at Cana…that is a pious, wonderul story giving us a deep inisight into the character of God and His love for us as He provides from His bounty. If you believe it…great…I’m not a literalist…Is the story about changing water into wine or is it something deeper…more profound…greater than filliing jugs with water and then doing a parlor trick?

 

[rinnie]

Rinnie,

I accept the principle…He takes what is base and makes it noble…I do not believe Jesus turned water into wine at Cana…that is a pious, wonderul story giving us a deep inisight into the character of God and His love for us as He provides from His bounty. If you believe it…great…I’m not a literalist…Is the story about changing water into wine or is it something deeper…more profound…greater than filliing jugs with water and then doing a parlor trick?

So then you would consider the Holy Eucharist a parlor trick also? Of course there is much more than the water changing into wine then just wine. IT is the body and blood of Christ which is present in the Eucharist. Did you not hear Jesus tell his Mother my time has not come yet?

 

[Publisher]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

But Gen, and Matt, is not what you consider the Gospel of Jesus of Nazareth then? I do not understand?

The Good News of the Kingdom of God is we are loved and the Rule of God is present among us. The gospel of the Kingdom is to love God and love our neighbor as ourselves. It is to show mercy and lovingkindness to our enemies…the gospel of the Kingdom calls us love one another and help the helpless in our midst…care for the needy…clothe the naked…bind up the wounded…visit those in bondage and announce they can be free…that is the gospel. That God entered our humanity and spoke His Word in our midst so that we could see and understand the Love of God lived out before us. The gospel IS NOT a book.

 

[Publisher]

So then you would consider the Holy Eucharist a parlor trick also? Of course there is much more than the water changing into wine then just wine. IT is the body and blood of Christ which is present in the Eucharist. Did you not hear Jesus tell his Mother my time has not come yet?

I do not participate in outward signs and rituals. I believe in the Real Presence as He stands in our midst each First Day…and each day in between. Each meal shared is an opportunity for Thanksgiving and communion with the Eternal One. His words are spirit and they are life.

I read what the writer of John wrote…but I “heard” something wonderful…and it wasn’t about turning water into wine.

No priest or minister offers up His broken body…He has done it once for all and we share in that each day…each moment as we share the life of Christ.

 

[rinnie]

The Good News of the Kingdom of God is we are loved and the Rule of God is present among us. The gospel of the Kingdom is to love God and love our neighbor as ourselves. It is to show mercy and lovingkindness to our enemies…the gospel of the Kingdom calls us love one another and help the helpless in our midst…care for the needy…clothe the naked…bind up the wounded…visit those in bondage and announce they can be free…that is the gospel. That God entered our humanity and spoke His Word in our midst so that we could see and understand the Love of God lived out before us. The gospel IS NOT a book.

Yes I will give you that the gospel is not a book it is a way of life. But what about sin. you just love the person and embrace the sin. I was wrong Publisher our faith has nothing in common.

Your live and let live is not going to help anyone when they are held responsible for their sins when they meet God. I do not understand this way of life and would not want to. Anyone who would welcome sin with open arms scares the hell out of me thats for sure.

I will pray for you and your people that they can see the true light and read the scripture of Jesus Christ and obey his commandments, not only the ones that they want to obey.

Love the sinner hate the sin. Not accept the sin and the sinner. That is not Gods word. Not by a long shot!

 

[Publisher]

Yes I will give you that the gospel is not a book it is a way of life. But what about sin. you just love the person and embrace the sin. I was wrong Publisher our faith has nothing in common.

Your live and let live is not going to help anyone when they are held responsible for their sins when they meet God. I do not understand this way of life and would not want to. Anyone who would welcome sin with open arms scares the hell out of me thats for sure.

I will pray for you and your people that they can see the true light and read the scripture of Jesus Christ and obey his commandments, not only the ones that they want to obey.

Love the sinner hate the sin. Not accept the sin and the sinner. That is not Gods word. Not by a long shot!

I don’t accept peoples “sin” either…I accept people…there is One who has the answers to our hurt and pain and sin…“love covers a multitude of sins” and I place those who judge and cause misery and pain in God’s hands too.

Praying for others is good…I can always use it…I’m sure those in the Meeting I attend would appreciate your prayers as well as we journey together seeking to live in the Light as He is in the Light. As I wrote earlier…your faith may not embrace me…but mine embraces you…I am responsible for my life and living His love…so you’re stuck with me whether you want to be “embraced” or not.

Jesus lived completely and extravagantly…he loved the sinner and saint…he calls us to do the same…I am far from “live and let live”…I’m pretty much of an “in your face person”…“in your face seeking to share the Love of God”…I think people would rather ‘see a sermon" than "hear a sermon’…Francis said something like…“preach the gospel at all times…and when necessary use words.”…Friends seek to “preach” with our lives…not necessarily in words.

 

[rinnie]

[SIGN][/SIGN]

I[SIGN] don’t accept peoples “sin” either…I accept people.[/SIGN]…there is One who has the answers to our hurt and pain and sin…“love covers a multitude of sins” and I place those who judge and cause misery and pain in God’s hands too.

Praying for others is good…I can always use it…I’m sure those in the Meeting I attend would appreciate your prayers as well as we journey together seeking to live in the Light as He is in the Light. As I wrote earlier…your faith may not embrace me…but mine embraces you…I am responsible for my life and living His love…so you’re stuck with me whether you want to be “embraced” or not.

Jesus lived completely and extravagantly…he loved the sinner and saint…he calls us to do the same…I am far from “live and let live”…I’m pretty much of an “in your face person”…“in your face seeking to share the Love of God”…I think people would rather ‘see a sermon" than "hear a sermon’…Francis said something like…“preach the gospel at all times…and when necessary use words.”…Friends seek to “preach” with our lives…not necessarily in words.

But you must stand up to sin Publisher. You must teach right from wrong. I embrace all of you and love you for your Love of Christ. But I cannot accept your way of ignoring what you do not want to face. Jesus did not come here for nothing. He came here to teach.

Love is a wonderful thing, but just because you love someone you must scold them, disagree with them. teach them the truth. IF you do not it causes pain for them and for many inocent people. So you teach your children to embrace sin by letting gays get married. That is what you are doing. Jesus said Man and women not I. And all the CC does is teach the truth. But if a person is Catholic the Church will not embrace their sin just because we love them.

We will accept the name calling and anger as long as we can show the truth. Jesus warned us that the truth does not want to be heard.

What did Jesus say when Peter wanted him to do things his way and not Gods. Jesus said stand behind me satan. Was he saying Peter was the devil. No he was not. But he was telling Peter you must listen to God not Man in order to enter the kingdom of heaven.

You cannot teach your truth and Gods truth also. There can only be one truth. And love cannot make a lie the truth no matter how hard you try.

 

[Justy90]

Kind of a dumb question isn’t it. You know very well that it is a serious sin and a serious crime. Is this the only response that non-Catholic, protestants have? If the Catholic Church turns out to be Christ’s one true Church, and all Christian truths are contained within Catholicism, on Judgment Day, your response to rejecting those Christian truths found in Catholicism will be pointing your finger at other human beings who have sinned. Good luck.

It’s still a big “If” even for you Jimmy.

 

[Stephen168]

He is all and in all. He can take the basest of things and make it noble…he can take water and make wine. He has designed within us the capacity to love and displays that amazing diversity in human relationships to the point that we echo…“In Christ there is neither male nor female…bond or free…gay or straight…” to paraphrase…God is at work in human design and our diversity is part of that design.

So you are OK with incest? Brothers and sisters showing their “capacity to love and display that amazing diversity in human relationships” as part of God’s design. Is it part of God’s design?

 

[Jimmy_B]

It’s still a big “If” even for you Jimmy.

Lol….I guess we’ll find out for sure when we die….Maybe you’ll see me waiving from across the great abyss or visa versa. On the other hand, we could end up standing next to each other and if that happens, I hope it’s in heaven.

 

[Publisher]

So you are OK with incest? Brothers and sisters showing their “capacity to love and display that amazing diversity in human relationships” as part of God’s design. Is it part of God’s design?

We’re are not speaking of incest. Apples and oranges. Since you accept “one man one woman” only for marriage…why wouldn’t you accept “one brother one sister”? According to the biblical literalists “one brother many sisters” is exactly what occured in Genesis, but no one advocates that form of relationship today. Our civil laws help prevent incest.

I believe two adults may share a life together. Not incestuous relationships. I see the distinction, and I dare say so do you.

We are discussing same sex marriage…if you wish to discuss incest, that would be another topic…don’t you think?

 

[rinnie]

We’re are not speaking of incest. Apples and oranges. Since you accept “one man one woman” only for marriage…why wouldn’t you accept “one brother one sister”? According to the biblical literalists “one brother many sisters” is exactly what occured in Genesis, but no one advocates that form of relationship today. Our civil laws help prevent incest.

I believe two adults may share a life together. Not incestuous relationships. I see the distinction, and I dare say so do you.

We are discussing same sex marriage…if you wish to discuss incest, that would be another topic…don’t you think?

Not really publisher, the point is trying to drive home is this. God said no brother and sister, and God said Man and women. But when God said Man and Women he pointed out not brothers and sisters the point could be Clear.

 

[Publisher]

Not really publisher, the point is trying to drive home is this. God said no brother and sister, and God said Man and women. But when God said Man and Women he pointed out not brothers and sisters the point could be Clear.

I understand your point of view(and to be clear, I understand you believe your point of view is God’s point of view so it really isn’t your point of view in your point of view bur God’s and since you believe it is God’s point of view there is no discention on the matter)…it is not a point of view I embrace(not to say I do not embrace “God’s point of view”, I do…I just don’t embrace your point of view which you believe really is God’s point of view)

 

[rinnie]

I understand your point of view(and to be clear, I understand you believe your point of view is God’s point of view so it really isn’t your point of view in your point of view bur God’s and since you believe it is God’s point of view there is no discention on the matter)…it is not a point of view I embrace(not to say I do not embrace “God’s point of view”, I do…I just don’t embrace your point of view which you believe really is God’s point of view)

I understand you do not embrace my point of view. And God’s either. If you did when he said Man and Women. And Husband and Wife you would agree with it also. But I not only showed you why I agree with God, I showed you what he said.

Now why can you not show me where God agrees with your point of view. Where does God say man and man, women and women. You see you cannot produce that because God did not say it. YOU say it, and to you what you think or do is right. But why did God not leave you the Church if this were true.

Why did God tell me to stay away from people who distort scripture to agree with them. Does the bible not warn us also about this? I understand you do not go ONLY by the Bible. But what you omit it totally? You do not accept it as the word of God?

 

[Stephen168]

We’re are not speaking of incest. Apples and oranges. Since you accept “one man one woman” only for marriage…why wouldn’t you accept “one brother one sister”? According to the biblical literalists “one brother many sisters” is exactly what occured in Genesis, but no one advocates that form of relationship today. Our civil laws help prevent incest.

No, it is all apples. Is there a limit to erotic love? You say yes and draw the line at incest, while many of us draw the line at incest and same-sex erotic love. At least we agree there is a limit.

I believe that what the Bible does tell us is concerning the nature of God and that God seeks to be expressed in human relationships…in this expression we are made in His image. Gay and Lesbian people too are made in the image of God…and the Life of God is expressed and experienced in their lives.

I know God wants a relationship with each of us and he does want us to have love relationships with each other. The love he wants us to have for each other is agape (charity) love, maybe even brotherly love but not necessarily erotic love. You also seem to be saying we are all made in Gods imagine therefore we can not sin. Are you suggesting there is no sin in the world? Adultery? Murder? Incest? Theft?
I believe God expresses himself by the way he designed the world and by looking at design we might find who we should have brotherly, charity, and/or erotic love with. You seem to think all three are synonymous. When I asked you about God expressing himself by way of design you said:

He has designed within us the capacity to love and displays that amazing diversity in human relationships to the point that we echo…“In Christ there is neither male nor female…bond or free…gay or straight…” to paraphrase…God is at work in human design and our diversity is part of that design.

All you did was re-define design as human relationship. God does express himself through our design: eyes to see, thumbs to hold, reproductive organs to reproduce. This is all part of Gods expression.