who can forgive sin

[Matthew_P_Muehl]

Tweety,

Your answers don’t seem to communicate … we are not the same…Catholic worship is very different from a fundamentalist service.

I have gone to fundamentalists’ services, they are good, but they are lacking so much that before they end, I need to go the sacraments as soon as I can.

I would say that you are denying yourself Manna from Heaven.

To my understanding tweetymom teaches R.C.I.A. and rejects the teachings of the catholic church! Go figure…

Matthew

 

[Poco]

I went through all the Sacraments and felt that it was just a ritual.

Well, that pretty much says it all

“There are none so blind as those who will not see.”

**Rev. Kevin:**That friend is about as wrong as one can be. The Catholic Church is not only “a bible church” we are THEE Bible Church by virtue of the FACT that 1. We birthed the Bible 2. In a three year cycle Catholics are exposed to the ENTIRE Bible 3. We use THE ENTIRE BIBLE GOD ENTENDED [2 Tim. 3:16] TO BE USED and 4. As the Parents of the Bible we are the ONLY Curch able to share it’s Full message, and to share it in Complete Objective TRUTH, guided by the Holy Spirit.

With GREAT REASONS:

We actually have and use the Entire Bible, and apply Gods mandates [Euchrist and Confession for example] and we actually have Jesus Christ in out Midst; In PERSON. We have validly and licitly Christ Seven Sacraments. Of Course we are differnt; we are as God Founded us; Protestants are as Luther, Calvin, Smith and others have formed you.

I agree with Nicea325. Well said!

So this thread is still going, eh?

So, RK, is this still a matter of you not understanding it, understanding it and rejecting it, or understanding it, rejecting it, and trying to convince Catholics that it is incorrect?

From the first quote, I believe RK understands it but rejects it. I’m not really sure if RK is trying to convince anybody that it is “incorrect”. Maybe a little trying to convince that it is unnecessary.

 

[PJM]

=tweetymom;6592254]I am not RK, but my answer is this. I think like me he understands it just not accep;ting of it. Not trying to convince otherwise, just stating our belief. Thanks and God Bless

Interesting…“a believer in Jesus” BUT NOT is Bible.

 

[KathleenGee]

Tweety,

So what do you teach??? Maybe that is a better approach to get a better sense of what you do believe as you have been here for several months…and I read basically, ‘just the same’…‘go figure’… etc.

 

[Justin_Mee]

To my understanding tweetymom teaches R.C.I.A. and rejects the teachings of the catholic church! Go figure…

Matthew

I hope this is not true. Much more harm can be done from inside the Church than from outsiders.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

No, Tweety does work in RCIA but with the permission of the priest and she has said, consistently, that while she does not ‘personally’ believe in some teachings that when she is teaching she does give her students the ‘Catholic position.’

 

[guanophore]

We can only be held accountable by who we are and our conscience. You do not understand what the sacraments are. So you have a different grace than us.

I dont’ think it is a “different grace”. we access it differently, and we are able to benefit from the very great and precious promises of God that our separated brethren may not. However, they stand in the tradition of Apollos.

 

[hosemonkey]

I dont’ think it is a “different grace”. we access it differently, and we are able to benefit from the very great and precious promises of God that our separated brethren may not. However, they stand in the tradition of Apollos.

As I’ve said before, protestants have traded a Royal banquet for a baloney sandwich.

 

[Reuben_J]

No, Tweety does work in RCIA but with the permission of the priest and she has said, consistently, that while she does not ‘personally’ believe in some teachings that when she is teaching she does give her students the ‘Catholic position.’

Does she work for the parish as a permanent staff and under its payroll? I cannot imagine a situation where I would teach something that I do not believe myself unless I am a History teacher or doing a paid job.

I suggest it would not be to the best interest of both parties (the parish and her) to allow the situation to continue. One may be able to give an impartial teaching but unconciously one’s unbelief may show in body language and nuance, like one can be cynical about the sunject. Normally these can be picked out by the students and I don’t think that is good for the objective of the RCIA. Anyway, I have yet to see a self-declared unbeliever teaches in the RCIA.

 

[Justin_Mee]

No, Tweety does work in RCIA but with the permission of the priest and she has said, consistently, that while she does not ‘personally’ believe in some teachings that when she is teaching she does give her students the ‘Catholic position.’

How can you possible teach something that you don’t believe? Imagine a Catholic teaching a group of JW’s their faith. It is a disservice to the Church and the catechumens.

 

[hosemonkey]

Does she work for the parish as a permanent staff and under its payroll? I cannot imagine a situation where I would teach something that I do not believe myself unless I am a History teacher or doing a paid job.

I suggest it would not be to the best ineterst of both parties (the parish and her) to allow the situation to continue. One may be able to give an impartial teaching but unconciously one’s unbelief may show in body language and nuance, like one’s can be cynical about the sunject. Normally these can be picked out by the students and I don’t think that is good for the objective of the RCIA. Anyway, I have yet to see a self-declared unbeliever teaches in the RCIA.

We already have the situation of non-Catholics teaching in our parochial schools, now we have non-Catholics teaching RCIA??? What in the wide world of sports could this parish priest be thinking? It is bad enough that we have poorly catechised Catholics attempting to teach RCIA, but NON_CATHOLICS??? Be like me teaching moslem “RCIA”…yeah!!! Lemme at 'em! I’ll “teach” 'em,hehehe.

 

[Reuben_J]

We already have the situation of non-Catholics teaching in our parochial schools, now we have non-Catholics teaching RCIA??? What in the wide world of sports could this parish priest be thinking? It is bad enough that we have poorly catechised Catholics attempting to teach RCIA, but NON_CATHOLICS??? Be like me teaching moslem “RCIA”…yeah!!! Lemme at 'em! I’ll “teach” 'em,hehehe.

I like that part.

 

[Justin_Mee]

As I’ve said before, protestants have traded a Royal banquet for a baloney sandwich.

You sailors have a way of cutting right to the chase. Well said.

 

[KathleenGee]

The Rite of Christian Initiation is to prepare Catholics into the Church. I have taken professional ministry classes in RCIA, and only now am I free of raising a family to start giving my time to my parish.

If Tweetymom is doing RCIA, and gives the Catholic position when it is necessary, then what is she teaching the rest of the time???

She cannot engage in any catechetical dialogue in CAF…

Tweety…is it true? I thought it was a joke…are you really following your conscience in forming newcomers into the Catholic faith???..and then coming here to post the kind of remarks you have demonstrated? I can’t believe it.

I am preparing now to return to church ministry…for me to go into another belief system, form a Catholic only when it is necessary in their process violates my conscience. I thought the American parishes had cleaned up this…of having non-Catholics teach religion in private schools…but to do the RCIA program?

May be it is time to listen to your conscience. If this is true, I would advise you to go to a place where you can serve and prepare others of the same standards…not the double talk we have seen here.

Please…do not participate in Catholic formation. Pray and discern…I do not think it is right you do that. I do not mean to be insulting, but indeed it is like teaching RCIA with a brown bag over your head.

Yes, you do work in another grace, and it is of Apollos.

 

[Justin_Mee]

The Rite of Christian Initiation is to prepare Catholics into the Church. I have taken professional ministry classes in RCIA, and only now am I free of raising a family to start giving my time to my parish.

If Tweetymom is doing RCIA, and gives the Catholic position when it is necessary, then what is she teaching the rest of the time???

She cannot engage in any catechetical dialogue in CAF…

Tweety…is it true? I thought it was a joke…are you really following your conscience in forming newcomers into the Catholic faith???..and then coming here to post the kind of remarks you have demonstrated? I can’t believe it.

I am preparing now to return to church ministry…for me to go into another belief system, form a Catholic only when it is necessary in their process violates my conscience. I thought the American parishes had cleaned up this…of having non-Catholics teach religion in private schools…but to do the RCIA program?

May be it is time to listen to your conscience. If this is true, I would advise you to go to a place where you can serve and prepare others of the same standards…not the double talk we have seen here.

Please…do not participate in Catholic formation. Pray and discern…I do not think it is right you do that. I do not mean to be insulting, but indeed it is like teaching RCIA with a brown bag over your head.

Yes, you do work in another grace, and it is of Apollos.

If this is indeed true, we all need to pray to our Lord that He guides her away from the Catholic teaching ministry.

 

[guanophore]

Where in the Bible are the Sacraments listed?
Where in the Bible does it say they are sacred?

I find very few doctrines of the faith “listed” in scripture. That was never the intent of scripture. Where in scripture does it require that the Teachings of the Apostles must be "listed’ in it?

We believe that everything Jesus has given us is sacred.

revkev, you may hear different and sometimes disparate answers from Catholics. However, the Catholic Church has One Teaching. Jesus has given the authority to those whom He ordained the power to forgive and retain sins. they don’t do this on their own authroity, but on His. They forgive in the Person of Christ.

 

[guanophore]

So a minister can’t be concecrated? Only clergy of the CC can. Where does it say that a priest is the only one’s who can preform the Sacraments?
What is needed inorder for someone to be concecrated?

This is a very good question. I think that anyone can consecrate themselves to God, and to His service. But certain special ministries are appointed particularly by those to whom authority has been given to appoint them. For example, only the 11, under the leadership of Peter, had the authority to choose a successor for Judas. We also see in the NT where the HS chose Paul and Silas (?) or was it Barnie? for a special mission. The HS worked through the Church to consecrate them with prayer and fasting.

Only those who are appointed by the successors of the Apostles can cathect the sacraments because they are only valid when performed in unity with the successors of the Apostles.

 

[KathleenGee]

One must be chosen by Christ Himself to be a minister of His Blood…chosen and consecrated in Spirit and Truth.

All called priests know that they do not deserve this.

 

[KathleenGee]

Back to people forming people in the Catholic faith they do not believe in, and cannot articulate anything here on CAF…

I was one of those who worked behind the scenes…in a charitable way, to ensure proper faith formation with other members of our church. In my former diocese, it was all about the Generic Christ – an arbitrated Christ defined by however the group defined Him, the whittling of the hierarchy, and kids loosing their faith in God having been in Catholic schools. A priest said it was better to put them in public school and teach them yourself with other Catholics than put them in Catholic schools.

If I were in the parish she works in, I would actively work to have her replaced.

So yes, we need to pray very much for TweetyMom…the RCIA year has ended.

 

[guanophore]

What I didn’t like about going to confession was the fact that I’m telling someone who I don’t believe can do anything to forgive my sins. That its none of his business what sins I have committed, that is between me and God and I don’t need a middle man for that.

I think you give a good example here of one of the most powerful aspects of the sacrament. God knows that we have this attitude, and that it is based in shame. It is the same quality of our humanity that got Adam and Eve to hide from God in the garden.

It is the business of the priest to bring the ministry of reconciliation as an ambassador of Christ. In this capacity, it is his duty to retain or forgive sins and mediate the the healing that can come when one is reconciled to God.

With all due respect, revkev, what makes you more qualified to decide what you need than God? You are His creature, and all that He has designed for your healing is based upon His perfect knowledge of who you are. To say that you don’t “need” what He has provided is the ultimate hubris.

I can go to God in humility and a contrite heart. I don't need to show that to a priest or anyone else,

Yes, you can go in humility and a contrite heart. However, your humility is limited because you have not humbled yourself before the one God has authorized to forgive you sins.

I never recieved any counselling or guidance to do better from a priest. All I got was, "For your pennance you are to say 5 Our Fathers, and say the Rosary 3 times.

Yeah, I admit that is somewhat of a disappointment. I do them out of obedience, but I do yearn for more.

Then the “I absolve you of your sins,” I never believed he can absolve me of anything, only God can do that. I know its supost to be God saying that and a priest is a agent acting in God’s place but I have always found that hard to believe.

The fact that you have a hard time believing what God has appointed does not in any way negate the valiidity of what He has set up.