Who designed the designer?

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Curious11

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If the universe requires a designer, how is it the designer doesn’t? Only logic please, no biblical passages.
 
This has been answered by the philosophers through the concept of Divine Simplicity. The philosophers do not claim that everything must have an external cause, but that any level of complexity requires an external cause. For example, consider a composition. Parts A and B are arranged in way X. But why not in way Y? Or A and C instead? If a thing has exists in any type of composed or “arranged” way, it could not have composed itself, it must have been determined by some external factor, for to have arranged itself it would have had to pre-exist itself, which is logically incoherent. For something to be the First Cause, it must therefore be absolutely simple metaphysically, without composition whatsoever, for if it wasn’t it would require an external cause to explain why it is exists in a composed state, and so therefore could not be the First Cause. God is not the most complex being, but the most metaphysically simple one.

Just remember that the claims are not “everything must have a cause” or “everything must have a designer.” The claims are along the lines of:
Anything that comes into being must have a cause.
Anything that is contingent has a cause.
Anything that is composed has a cause.
Anything that changes (or has an actualized potential) must have a cause.

Etc…

I have only quickly typed up this explanation, but with the term divine simplicity you should be able to find more.
 
God has come into being.

By your own definition, he requires a designer.
 
This universe is finite, but time is infinite, physical laws are infinite. They could account for the Big Bang
 
Because God does not exist, God is existence itself. Read up on classical theism.
 
But you claim existence is created. That would mean God was created
 
No, I did no such thing. The state of existing was made, but the concept of existence is infinite.
 
Gravity was most likely responsible for the Big Bang, physical laws predate the universe. Time exists if nothing changes, just like writing exists in absence of paper and pencils
 
I’m an amateur astronomer but even I know gravity couldn’t cause the Big Bang. Physical laws came into existence after the explosion. Nothing could tear apart a big ball of energy spontaneously.
 
Writing exists whether it’s carried out or not. A written piece of paper proves writing exists, but it’s irrelevant to the question of whether it exists or not. The concept of writing has always existed, hence why writing was discovered and not invented, we just found out about the concept
 
Ah yes. The most prestigious scientist of modern history said that an attractive force caused an explosion.
 
Wesrock said:
This has been answered by the philosophers through the concept of Divine Simplicity. The philosophers do not claim that everything must have an external cause, but that any level of complexity requires an external cause. For example, consider a composition. Parts A and B are arranged in way X. But why not in way Y? Or A and C instead? If a thing has exists in any type of composed or “arranged” way, it could not have composed itself, it must have been determined by some external factor, for to have arranged itself it would have had to pre-exist itself, which is logically incoherent. For something to be the First Cause, it must therefore be absolutely simple metaphysically, without composition whatsoever, for if it wasn’t it would require an external cause to explain why it is exists in a composed state, and so therefore could not be the First Cause. God is not the most complex being, but the most metaphysically simple one.

Just remember that the claims are not “everything must have a cause” or “everything must have a designer.” The claims are along the lines of:
Anything that comes into being must have a cause.
Anything that is contingent has a cause.
Anything that is composed has a cause.
Anything that changes (or has an actualized potential) must have a cause.

Etc…

I have only quickly typed up this explanation, but with the term divine simplicity you should be able to find more.
Click to expand...
Here’s a simple fact. Keep going back to the beginning cause of everything.

AND

God is the uncaused cause of everything.
 
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Methinks you are wearing self-imposed blinders. “Something” always existed, unless one believes in the fairy tale of everything proceeding from nothing.

The un-caused Cause.
 
Here’s how I think of it (scientist thinking not a philosopher)

God exists in multi dimensional time. In such an environment there is no beginning and no end, in the same way you can’t define the start of a sphere. This universe has only 1D time, which has a beginning and an end and flows from one to the other.

Can science prove this? No. You can either have faith that God created the universe (and associated miracles over the course of human history) or, as Hawking thought, it was quantum fluctuations in unformed space-time. Personally I don’t buy Hawking’s theory.
 
The designer can’t itself have a designer, because then this designer would need its own designer- and this would go on endlessly so that we have no first cause. That leads us to an illogical conclusion, since there necessarily must be a first cause.
 
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