Who Else Saw The Plates Besides Smith?

[pnewton]

MISSING BOOKS OF THE BIBLE - PART TWO

These are not books of the Bible and not all are missing. The Bible can reference a commonally know source other than Scripture you know.

Where in the Bible does it say every allusion can only be from Scripture?

Baptism is taught in the Didache. It is not part of the New Testament canon because the Church from day one did not see it necessary to put details like that in the canon of Scripture. Why? Because some details are subject to change.

 

[ricko]

Here, the writer of the BOM states he is better than Christ:

I have more to boast of than ever any man had.
I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam.
A large majority of the whole have stood by me.
Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it.
I boast that no man ever did such a work as I.

2 Timothy 3: 1-5
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
For men shall be LOVERS OF THEIR OWN SELVES, COVETOUS, BOASTERS, PROUD, BLASPHEMERS, disobedient to parents, unthankful, UNHOLY,
WITHOUT NATURAL AFFECTION, truce-breakers, FALSE ACCUSERS, INCONTINENT, FIERCE, DESPISERS OF THOSE THAT ARE GOOD, TRAITORS, HEADY, HIGH MINDED, LOVERS OF PLEASURES MORE THAN LOVERS OF GOD;
Having a form of godliness but denying the power thereof: FROM SUCH TURN AWAY.

The Bible says that if you boast, boast of the Lord. But Joseph Smith boasts of himself being better than Christ. More proof the BOM is not of God.

 

[PaulDupre]

We actual know the location of a Nephite camp that was last used in the final battle. No one has asked to see it.

I’m asking to see it. Give me the location and I will travel there to see it for myself.

Thanks in advance,
Paul

 

[BOMC]

These are not books of the Bible and not all are missing. The Bible can reference a commonally know source other than Scripture you know.

All I needed to show was one, and that was done.

Baptism is taught in the Didache. It is not part of the New Testament canon because the Church from day one did not see it necessary to put details like that in the canon of Scripture. Why? Because some details are subject to change.

Excuses. Those sacraments are not subject to change and the Didache does not instruct who can administer them or receive them.

 

[pnewton]

. Those sacraments are not subject to change.

So, where in the Bible does it say that?

 

[BOMC]

So, where in the Bible does it say that?

For I am the Lord, I change not; (Malachi 3:6)

Why put the cart before the horse, show where the instructions are for the sacraments in THE BIBLE.

.

 

[pnewton]

show where the instructions are for the sacraments in THE BIBLE.

.

Why? You’ve given no reason.

Malachi refers to the Lord, not Sacrament, which did not exist. In fact, you have proved the opposite. They did not exist then, and they did in a few hundred years: a change.

 

[BOMC]

Why? You’ve given no reason.

Malachi refers to the Lord, not Sacrament, which did not exist. In fact, you have proved the opposite. They did not exist then, and they did in a few hundred years: a change.

Right! Just as The Sacred Book of Mormon said - The great and abominable church took them out, and The Holy Book of Mormon put them back in. You’re finally catching on!

 

[why_me]

Here, the writer of the BOM states he is better than Christ:

The Bible says that if you boast, boast of the Lord. But Joseph Smith boasts of himself being better than Christ. More proof the BOM is not of God.

Quote:
I have more to boast of than ever any man had.
I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam.
A large majority of the whole have stood by me.
Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it.
I boast that no man ever did such a work as I.

Quote:
2 Timothy 3: 1-5
This know also, that in the last days perilous times shall come.
For men shall be LOVERS OF THEIR OWN SELVES, COVETOUS, BOASTERS, PROUD, BLASPHEMERS, disobedient to parents, unthankful, UNHOLY,
WITHOUT NATURAL AFFECTION, truce-breakers, FALSE ACCUSERS, INCONTINENT, FIERCE, DESPISERS OF THOSE THAT ARE GOOD, TRAITORS, HEADY, HIGH MINDED, LOVERS OF PLEASURES MORE THAN LOVERS OF GOD;
Having a form of godliness but denying the power thereof: FROM SUCH TURN AWAY

I am rather surprised to see this quotation again by Joseph Smith. Of course the quotation is taken out of context. If you would look it up, you would see that it was said just months before he was murdered. And still, if you would look at where Paul is also boasting you would see that JS modeled his own sermon after 2 Cor 11:17-29

 

[ricko]

I am rather surprised to see this quotation again by Joseph Smith. Of course the quotation is taken out of context. If you would look it up, you would see that it was said just months before he was murdered. And still, if you would look at where Paul is also boasting you would see that JS modeled his own sermon after 2 Cor 11:17-29

Just saying something is taken out of context is not acceptable. You must show how it is taken out of context and I don’t see how that could be as the quote pretty much stands as is. By proving “taken out of context” I submit a JW favorite that they use to “prove” that blood should not be taken and that is Acts 16:20. When they use that verse they are taking it out of context. I will not show how it is taken out of context as I assume you know why. If not then let me know and I will show you. Back to JS, I don’t see that 2 Cor has anything to do with JS’s quote, Paul did not say he was better than Jesus.

 

[PaulDupre]

"BOMC:

We actual know the location of a Nephite camp that was last used in the final battle. No one has asked to see it.

I’m asking to see it. Give me the location and I will travel there to see it for myself.

Thanks in advance,
Paul

BOMC,
I’m still waiting for the exact location of the Nephite camp. I’m really serious, I want to see it.

Paul

 

[BOMC]

BOMC,
I’m still waiting for the exact location of the Nephite camp. I’m really serious, I want to see it. Paul

It is not for curiosity seekers.

 

[Bill_Pick]

BOMC,
I’m still waiting for the exact location of the Nephite camp. I’m really serious, I want to see it.

Paul

Paul I,m going to bet you never get a location. smile

 

[MGLechner]

But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world (Book of Mormon) to confound the wise (Modern day Pharisees); and God hath chosen the weak things of the world (Joseph of Egypt and Joseph of NY) to confound the things which are mighty; (Those who mock.) (1 Corinthians 1: 27)

You have taken that passage of scripture completely out of context! To read the Book of Mormon into the words of St. Paul is absurd! Your freelancing spirit isn’t even in line with the official teachings of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. Just what denomination do you belong to? Do you consider yourself a: Book of Mormon Christian (hence, BOMC)? Or a Book of Mormon Catholic? Which is heretical to the extreme!

 

[RebeccaJ]

It is not for curiosity seekers.

[SIGN] BS [/SIGN]

 

[dianaiad]

China was closed to all the world for a 1000 years.

Please provide historical proof for your claim.

The “silk road” (as a term, that is) has been a going concern since 117 or so BC, Rebecca. As well, jade and other minerals were being traded between Europe and China from the 2nd millenium BC.

We also have the Tarim mummies, caucasoid peoples who settled in China as early as 1600 BC. The linguistic evidences are pretty clear here, as well; though the sino-Tibetan language tree diverges very early on from the Indo-european (the tree from which Greek, Latin and English derive) there is enough cross contamination to indicate contact; lots of it, by traders.

Alexander the Great may have been stopped in India, but his forces (and his traders) made it to China. The Caesars that followed him also had trade routes to that area.In fact, China did its own exploring, sending traders and armies into central Asia for horses and other trade items. In fact, there is a report of one Han dynasty expedition meeting…and defeating…a Roman legion sent by Anthony to invade Parthia. The Chinese had crossbows. The Romans didn’t.

There was at least one Chinese controled “silk route” that operated out of what is now VietNam, that reached Egypt, India, and the coast of the Red Sea.

The Hoa Hanshu records of CHINA record that there were Roman embassies to Hong Kong an other areas of China in 166 AD.

However, the height of the silk road trade to China, the most intense relationship, was during the Byzantine era; there was a great deal of intercourse, cultural, linguistic and trade, during that time.

In fact, this trade did not STOP until the end of the Mongol Empire, in the 1400’s. In fact, have you forgotten that the original purpose of Columbus’s voyage was to find ANOTHER silk route to China???

I figure, especially with the Byzantine influence, that is sufficient evidence for the idea that Christianity was known in China for a very long time. It may not have taken great hold there, but that it was TAUGHT and available?

Oh, yes. It most certainly was.

 

[dianaiad]

It is not for curiosity seekers.

BMOC you are not helping. If you know the site, tell us. If it is 'not for curiosity seekers," then you shouldn’t have mentioned it in the first place; doing so smacks of an elementary school “I’ve got a secret…nya, nya, nya…”

Personally, I know of no such confirmed site–not that my not knowing means anything, of course.

Mind you, I’m also aware that an atheist could find a properly carbon dated freeway offramp sign saying “Zarahemla next three exits” written in Reformed Egyptian, next to a burial site full of horses, cumoms and honey combs and nobody who didn’t already have a testimony of the truthfulness of the Book of Mormon would believe it.

 

[ricko]

BMOC you are not helping. If you know the site, tell us. If it is 'not for curiosity seekers," then you shouldn’t have mentioned it in the first place; doing so smacks of an elementary school “I’ve got a secret…nya, nya, nya…”

Personally, I know of no such confirmed site–not that my not knowing means anything, of course.

Mind you, I’m also aware that an atheist could find a properly carbon dated freeway offramp sign saying “Zarahemla next three exits” written in Reformed Egyptian, next to a burial site full of horses, cumoms and honey combs and nobody who didn’t already have a testimony of the truthfulness of the Book of Mormon would believe it.

I can’t speak for an atheist, but if I saw such a sign with such things in a burial site and carbon dating, I would believe it because as BMOC would say “the God of Reason” would have to prevail. However to come back to Earth, such a site has not come to light.

 

[dianaiad]

I can’t speak for an atheist, but if I saw such a sign with such things in a burial site and carbon dating, I would believe it because as BMOC would say “the God of Reason” would have to prevail. However to come back to Earth, such a site has not come to light.

Perhaps you would, Ricko.

Perhaps not. You have to remember that I live in a town that is not only the home of the first astronauts and is at the forefront of scientific achievement in many ways, but is also the center for the Flat Earth Society.

I have never underestimated the capacity of people to believe what they want to believe.

 

[PaulDupre]

It is not for curiosity seekers.

Thought so. Tell me this, at least: How do you know about this site? Was it revealed to you by God? Did you see it with “the eyes of faith” like the BOM witnesses saw the plates?

Come on now, you opened up this little can of worms. Tell us how you know or we will have to discount you as a Joseph Smith-style fraud.

You do think you’re a prophet, don’t you? A real prophet would declare himself as such.