Who is the Rock?

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SavedbyJesus,

I implore you,
  1. Stop idolizing the bible
  2. Study, study, study, the primary source documents (i.e. The Didache, Church Fathers, etc.)
  3. Analyze the historically intended audience of the Biblical authors (i.e. just WHO IS Paul talking to in Ephesians 2:8-10?)
To study history is to no longer be a Protestant.

You coming here is evidence that God is working through you to help you find the truth, don’t let that fire burn out.

David
 
There are also non-canonical Books such as the Acts of Peter that attest to Peters Roman residency. Keep searching, the truth of Christs Church will grab you and not let go if you only let it.
 
It would be simply arrogant to think that God would appoint but a mere man to build his Church and not Jesus Christ himself to oversee it.

Sadly, it is the biggest lie to keep Catholics in bondage to a false religion system that cannot save them.

I was a born and raised Catholic and I thank God he opened my eyes to the simple truth of his salvation at age 42, some 10 years ago.

I will continue to pray for every Catholic on this board. My heart is so burdened for you.
 
SavedByJesus said:
It would be simply arrogant to think that God would appoint but a mere man to build his Church and not Jesus Christ himself to oversee it.

Sadly, it is the biggest lie to keep Catholics in bondage to a false religion system that cannot save them.

I was a born and raised Catholic and I thank God he opened my eyes to the simple truth of his salvation at age 42, some 10 years ago.

I will continue to pray for every Catholic on this board. My heart is so burdened for you.
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God Bless you brother
 
SavedByJesus said:
It would be simply arrogant to think that God would appoint but a mere man to build his Church and not Jesus Christ himself to oversee it.

Sadly, it is the biggest lie to keep Catholics in bondage to a false religion system that cannot save them.

I was a born and raised Catholic and I thank God he opened my eyes to the simple truth of his salvation at age 42, some 10 years ago.

I will continue to pray for every Catholic on this board. My heart is so burdened for you.
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Your heart is burdened by something, that’s for sure.:rolleyes: Is it possible that you do not know a darn thing about Catholics? Is it?

In Christ,
Andrew
 
Why do you suppose it was** code name **“babylon”

Because they followed the **Babylon Mystery **religion.

When Cesar decreed all to become Christians they simply subsituted Christian names for the things that already existed as Babylonian worship…thus you have Roman Catholicism.

Read the book “The Two Babylons” by Alexander Hislop and if you are so interested in reference there are so many references given in that book you could spend your lifetime following them.

If you look at the dates where Peter was said to be in Rome according to the RCC, the Bible places him elsewhere at the same time. Look it up.
 
Don’t burden yourself for us. History is on our side. It’s your weather-man-suit wearing Pastor that is fibbing to you. Study, study, study the primary source documents. Stop idolizing the bible, the truth can’t be hidden, one just has to be willing to search, recognize, and then accept it. Limiting oneself to ones bible and your Pastors personal interpretation of it is intellectual dishonest. Jesus is calling you, as evidenced by your coming to this site in the first place. Will you answer him? Jesus didn’t speak Greek, he spoke Aramaic, DON’T idolize Mathews Greek grammar, DON’T give the grammar of a book that were written down three to five decades after Jesus’s death in a different tongue then that of Jesus cloud your judgement. Jesus made Peter the Rock of the Church, everyone from 33 a.d. to today knows what he meant by that. Compare giving of the keys to Isaiah 22:22. You can sever your ties with the Protest-ant deformation any time you want. Don’t stop questioning the legitmacy of you Protest-ant Church, what year was it founded? The Catholic Church was founded in 33 a.d. If you Church was founded a year after that, it’s not the Church Jesus left for you to be a member of.

David
 
BTW I was a born and raised RC for 42 years and only by the grace of GOD that he brought me out of it. But first you must be willing to “seek the truth”. This is ONLY found in God’s word.

The truth has set me free and so it can you too.
 
SavedByJesus said:
BTW I was a born and raised RC for 42 years and only by the grace of GOD that he brought me out of it. But first you must be willing to “seek the truth”. This is ONLY found in God’s word.

The truth has set me free and so it can you too.
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:tiphat:
 
Saved,

Have you found that primary source document from the first fifteen centuries of Christianity promoting a “personal relationship with Jesus” yet? I’d be happy to see it.

David
 
SavedByJesus said:
BTW I was a born and raised RC for 42 years and only by the grace of GOD that he brought me out of it. But first you must be willing to “seek the truth”. This is ONLY found in God’s word.

The truth has set me free and so it can you too.
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Are you familiar with the term “prelest”?

In Christ,
Andrew
 
I implore you,
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  1. Stop idolizing the bible
  2. Study, study, study, the primary source documents (i.e. The Didache, Church Fathers, etc.)
  3. Analyze the historically intended audience of the Biblical authors (i.e. just WHO IS Paul talking to in Ephesians 2:8-10?)
Click to expand...
To study history is to no longer be a Protest-ant.
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In the book of** John **“In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God”
And we all know the Word became FLESH we just celebrated his birthday. So to doubt the word of God or reduce its authority is to deny HIM.

Sola Scriptura
 
SON said:
Understand that in the verse, ‘upon this rock’, the Lord emphasizes THIS, for He is speaking of Himself. Anyway; See also Matthew 18:18 where the Lord tells his 11 disciples, to include Peter, to go into the world and to preach and to do ALL things, not some, not most, ALL, that He has taught them. Ok, so where’s the confusion? If the Lord specifically tells us to do ALL things that He has taught, would there be any controversy as to what authority Peter actually had? Would Peter have been fooled into thinking that he could now change days, and doctrines? I submit that Peter, same as Paul, was a Rabbi who loved the Lord and would NOT seek to negate any of His teachings, nor the Fathers, for they are ONE.

That I know God to be the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow, His Holy Word is consistent, timely, and never changing. Motivation for the truth would be, “For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, if any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book. And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book [Revelation 22:18-19]. But scarier still is the defining of the anti-christ; “…he shall think to change times and laws:…” Daniel 7:25 I’d hate to think that our most notable of all religions on earth be guilty of that! We need to be very careful not to be disobedient, nor disrespectful to our Maker. Remember He said to us, that ‘if we love Him, we WILL KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS’, not our own, but His!

So, what laws am I speaking of and how did the Catholic Church conveniently capitalize on Kefa (Peter) some 300 years later to be their pope?

The first law to be changed; The 4th Commandment of God, The Sabbath, Gods Holiest Day. Be Blessed that you know His Holy Sabbath, the 7th Day described in His Holy Book. Many believe, while their leaders validate Sunday, the 1st day of the week, being ignorant of Bible teaching, but they should know, “Her priests have violated My Law, and have profaned Mine Holy things; they have put no difference between the Holy and profane, neither have they showed difference between the unclean and the clean, and have hid their eyes from My Sabbaths, and I am profaned among them.” Ezekiel 22:26

Are not the commandments our basis of life before the Marriage? Messiah clearly confirming the Sabbath mitzvah, “You are to observe my Shabbats; for this is a sign between Me and you through ALL your generations; so that you will know that I AM Adonai, who sets YOU apart for ME. Therefore you are to keep my Shabbats, because it is set apart for you. Everyone who treats it as ordinary must be put to death.” Does this sound any different than, murder you die, adultery you die!
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Paul wasn’t given the keys to the kindom of heaven only Peter
Peter nor any Pope has never changed any doctrines
Out of interest, no one has even been able to tell me how many doctrines there are 🤷

The Rev quote relates specifically to the book of Rev.
There is a simialr thing in Deut about taking away.

Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath
He gave binding and loosing powers to the Church
He rose again on the 3rd day - Sunday
That’s when Catholics go to Mass

Saint Justin, Martyr (100-165) First Apology

But Sunday is the day on which we all hold our common assembly, because it is the first day on which God, having wrought a change in the darkness and matter, made the world; and Jesus Christ our Saviour on the same day rose from the dead. For He was crucified on the day before that of Saturn (Saturday); and on the day after that of Saturn, which is the day of the Sun, having appeared to His apostles and disciples, He taught them these things, which we have submitted to you also for your consideration.

Matthew 28:1 And in the end of the sabbath, when it began to dawn towards the first day of the week [Sunday], came Mary Magdalen and the other Mary, to see the sepulchre.

Acts 20:7 And on the first day of the week, when we were assembled to break bread, Paul discoursed with them, being to depart on the morrow. And he continued his speech until midnight.

Col 2:16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat or in drink or in respect of a festival day or of the new moon or of the sabbaths, 17 Which are a shadow of things to come: but the body is of Christ.

1 Corinthians 16:1,2 Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye. Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

Letter of Barnabas 15:6-8, A.D. 74, “We keep the eighth day [Sunday] with joyfulness, the day also on which Jesus rose again from the dead.”

The Jewish Talmud acknowledges that Christians worship on Sunday. From Abhodah Zarah, 6a, we read: “He is called a Christian who follows the false teachings of that man [Jesus Christ], who taught them to celebrate the feast on the first day of the Sabbath, that is, to worship on the first day after the Sabbath.”
 
Does your Protest-ant pastor regularly hold classes teaching about Christian history? Does he regularly discuss primary source documents such as the Didache, Church Fathers writings, etc.? If not, why not?

If he only uses “the word of God,” is this the Word of God according to the Church for fifteen hundred years, or is this the cannablized “word of God” that Luther and Calvin redacted down to meet their own theology?

What infallible source does your Pastor use when giving his interpretation of scripture in his sermon? Does his Theological interpretation conflict with the Pastor of the same denomnation in a town 20 miles away? If so, why? If you didn’t like his teachings, could you go down the street two blocks and found a new church and teach what you want? Why? Where would you get the authority to do so?

Tell me, if I decided to bail on Catholicism, which of the 30,000 Protest-ant churches would I go to to get the “truth?” How do you know the other 29,999 Protest-ant Churches are wrong? Because you can’t all be right, the opinions on many issues are diametrically opposed, someone has to be wrong. If you’re being led by the spirit, does that mean they’re not?

Protest-ant-ism is a lie and a fraud. Tithe up though, your Pastor needs a new weather-man suit for next weeks sermon.

David
 
Are you familiar with the term “prelest”?
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And the false doctrine of Mary? Wouldn’t this fall under the heading of prelest? Don’t be so quick to cast stones.
 
SavedByJesus said:
Hello Canto,

Respectfully I need to disagree.

I have heard this argument many times but it doesn’t hold up to scripture. One either beleives the infallible word of God or does not.

If you are denying Christ as the ROCK and instead wish to give this title to Peter than you are putting your faith in the RC church’s** tradition **and of man and he cannot save you.

The** Rock **he speaks of is the fact that he JESUS…is the Messiah…Roman Catholicisn didn’t exist for another 300 years. There is **no connection **between the disciple Peter and the RCC other than the connection invented by the RCC.

This is a subject of the whole disertation from scripture if you read the entire text.
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One needs to understand scripture and history and tradition/Tradition. The Catholic Church was founded by Jesus when by His authority He changed Simon’s name to Peter (Rock) and gave Peter the keys to the kingdom. He gave the power and authority to bind and loose as Peter saw fit. This does not change any of scripture where God is referred to as rock. Remember Jesus came not to change the law but to fulfill the law. Also I encourage you to understand that even though the word catholic was not used in the early church, they were catholic none the less. The early Christians were Jews who did not know they were Christians, but practiced as Jews did, and went further and celebrated the Eucharist as Jesus told them to in the Book of John. Remember that at that time they did not have the Bible ( as we know it ) but followed the oral tradition. This is where the bible came from. Those that believe in solo scriptura can not find that in the bible. Tradition and scripture and the teaching of the Magesterium is Catholic and is from God. The Catholic Church is ONE, HOLY, CATHOLIC, and APOSTOLIC. The fullness of God resides in this church. Continue your study of scripture and you will find the truth.
 
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