Who knows Latin?

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Does anyone hear know how to speak Latin? If not fluently, does anyone know Latin responses or Latin prayers?

I attend the Tridentine Mass mostly, but I also love the Mass of Paul VI. People who attend the Tridentine Mass are obviously acquainted with Latin, but do people who only attend the Pauline Mass know any Latin?

Do you think Latin is important or necessary? Do we need to do more to preserve it or should it be done away with completely? Would you like to see more Latin in the liturgy and would you like it to be taught in our schools?

I could have posted this in the Traditional Catholicism forum but I already know the opinion of the posters there. I have posted this here because I want to know what non-traditional Catholics think. Please note, I don’t want this to turn political, I just want to have a polite discussion on this issue.

(Note to moderator: If this is in the wrong forum, please place it in the correct one. Thanks)
 
Born in 1962, I have vague recollections of the 1962 Missal. Recently I’ve gone to a few Tridentine Masses and have been impressed not just by the setting and the symbolism, but also by the mix of people there. People speaking different languages coming together to pray in one language.

I did Latin in school for two years and can hardly remember any of it, but having a translation in the Mass leaflet certainly helps. After a while the translation is used less and less.

I do think that preserving Latin is not only important but vital. I’d go so far as to say that it should be used more and more, even for the NO Mass. Since the changes to using the vernacular came in I believe (IMHO) that the Church has become more fragmented, less universal.

Latin can bind us together and bring people of, not only different backgrounds but, of different languages and cultures together and that has to be a good thing.
 
Some years ago, I attended a seminar. Might have been sponsored by Catholic Answers.

A lot of young people … around age 30.

No reason why any of them should have had any knowledge of Latin.

And one of the priests in attendance said a Mass in Latin.

And all of the young people knew the responses.

I guess you can start small with some of the easy responses.

Little words and short phrases.

Actually, as time goes by, the use of Latin seems like a better and better idea.

Latin “seems” more “majestic” and more reverent than English.

Latin seems less banal than English, which seems to lack nuance in a lot of the translations.

Latin seems more “serious” … somehow.

And while some complex thoughts require more effort to understand in Latin, most folks can figure out the short responses pretty easily.

Latin sentence structure is somewhat different than English sentence structure.

But some folks’ English lack structure and some folks’ English language spelling suggests they haven’t studied effective ways to employ English.

But basically Latin isn’t too difficult.

Start small.

Mica, mica, stella parva.
 
I’m learning how to pray the rosary in Latin and I’m hoping to be able to take Latin in college. Latin is important to me not only because I’m Catholic, but because I plan to become to doctor.

I’m all for the revival of Latin, it’s such a beautiful language. I take Spanish in school, which makes learning Latin a little bit easier. I’m still in the stages where I butcher the language though:o

Mass is said with some Latin in my parish, but normally only Kyrie is done in Latin. However we did sing Salve Regina in Latin during the feast of the Assumption. I’m pretty upset my diocese desided against offering the Tridentine mass. However, when I told my priest I was trying to learn Latin, he blessed me in Latin.
 
I attend the Ordinary Form of the Mass exclusively.
I learned Latin in high school (a public school), but as that was many years ago, I would not say I am fluent. I do still have a decent grasp of written Latin, and my verbal skills are ok.

It would be nice to have more Latin in the Mass, but I don’t think fluency in the language is a necessity for the people in the pews. It is not difficult to memorize very specific words or phrases in any language. One need not know declensions, tenses, gender, etc in order to learn that “Et cum spiritu tuo” means “and with your spirit”. The same with the prayers. We initially learn the prayers in the vernacular by rote, so I don’t see where it would be any different to learn the prayers in Latin by rote at first, and then learn what they mean.

As for the question do I believe Latin should be taught in our schools-- absolutely! Learning Latin in high school is a tremendous help in learning other languages. I have an exceptional English vocabulary, and part of the reason I do is because of learning Latin (and Spanish). When a person knows the meanings of roots, prefixes, and suffixes, one can pretty much figure out the meaning of any word.
 
Goth_Catholic said:
Mass is said with some Latin in my parish, but normally only Kyrie is done in Latin.
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Just a little nit-picking-- the Kyrie is Greek, not Latin.
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Goth_Catholic:
I’m pretty upset my diocese desided against offering the Tridentine mass. However, when I told my priest I was trying to learn Latin, he blessed me in Latin.
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I know what you mean. When Pope Benedict’s Motu Proprio was released, our Archbishop released a statement telling us that there would be no demand for the Mass in Latin, and what little demand there already was is being met by having the Latin Mass offered in 2 far regions of the archdiocese. Unfortunately, my own parish priest concurred, and told us that nobody wants it, and nobody will attend even if were to be offered.
 
Latin does nothing for me personally. I dislike events, movies, books, songs, etc. in foreign languages. I like to be able to understand everything and I get very bored when I can’t understand the words.

I respect the history of the Church and believe that for this reason, if no other, Latin masses should be offered.

I also realize that Latin is the official language of the Church, and anyone who is involved in ministry in the Catholic Church, either the priesthood, a religious vocation, or a lay ministry, should probably have knowledge of Latin.

I think that Latin should be taught in all schools, but especially Catholic schools. There is a great deal of classical literature that involves Latin. I also agree that Latin helps students better understand English grammar. I took a year of Latin in high school–hated it and don’t remember any of it, but I’m glad I took it. (Kind of like going to the dentist–I don’t like it, but it’s necessary.)
 
Dempsey1919 said:
Does anyone hear know how to speak Latin? If not fluently, does anyone know Latin responses or Latin prayers?

I attend the Tridentine Mass mostly, but I also love the Mass of Paul VI. People who attend the Tridentine Mass are obviously acquainted with Latin, but do people who only attend the Pauline Mass know any Latin?
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I was about 10 when the mass was changed to English.
As a matter of fact, I had all the latin memorized prepratory to becoming an Altar boy when the change happend. I didn’t get to serve even one Latin Mass.😦
One thing that we had back then (and would like to get ahold of again) was a card with all the Latin prayers and a phonetic pronunciation next to it. This is what I learned from. I did a quick look on the internet but couldn’t come up with one. Does anyone know of one?
As for the responses - As others have said just listen and you will pick it up. The two most common responses are of course the:
“Et cum spiritu tuo” and the “Oremus”
Do you think Latin is important or necessary? Do we need to do more to preserve it or should it be done away with completely?
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I think that the Latin is very important. For one thing, as others have said, it doesn’t change. The language is not commonly used and therefore the terms are not subject to alteration in usage. Latin is a large part of how the Church keeps the faith pure and not subject to the changing whims of society.
Would you like to see more Latin in the liturgy and would you like it to be taught in our schools?
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Not so much in grade school, but in high school yes. It is important though to recognize that Church Latin is not the same as regular Latin. I don’t know what the difference is but many people have told me that.
I do love latin in the Liturgy and would like to see it’s greater use. It is beautiful, devout and uplifting.

James
 
Since the changes to using the vernacular came in I believe (IMHO) that the Church has become more fragmented, less universal.

The Byzantine Churches, Catholic and Orthodox, have always used a multiplicity of languages and they are not fragmented.
 
Since the Pope requested it, I am now teaching my kids some prayers in Latin. I really don’t know very much at all, I just know some basic prayers and some responses.
If we used Latin more it seems it would be pretty simple to learn more, since it is the language of the Church we should all learn to at least pray some prayers in Latin.
Since the Latin we use in the Catholic Church is a special language it should be preserved and learned. As it is part of our heritage part of the shared gift we have received from our predecessors in the faith we should nurture and preserve it.
We wouldn’t throw out the Michelangelo’s Pieta and replace it with Joe Shmoe’s playdoh sculpture.
New is not always better and old doesn’t make it right, we should test everything hold on to what is good.

God Bless,
Scylla
 
feargalmac said:
Latin can bind us together and bring people of, not only different backgrounds but, of different languages and cultures together and that has to be a good thing.
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Absolutely. I know someone who recently went to Medjugorje and in one service they were praying the Rosary in multiple languages; more like the tower of Babel than Pentecost.

I also served at a funeral presided over by a Ukranian Priest. With a mixture of English that was difficult to understand and Ukranian that was impossible for any of the servers to understand, it made for an interesting experience. Most of the servers were retired gentlemen and one of them exclaimed afterwards - “This didn’t happen when we used Latin”.

I am learning Latin slowly, on my own (using Artes Latinae). I found that learning to pray the Rosary in Latin was a great way to smooth out my pronunciation. I also often find myself focussing more on what the words mean when I pray in Latin since they are words that I don’t use in ordinary speech.

I think that it’s important that we share a common language; that people from anywhere in the world can attend Mass at any Roman Catholic Church and feel right at home - at least for the Liturgy of the Eucharist.
 
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bpbasilphx said:
Since the changes to using the vernacular came in I believe (IMHO) that the Church has become more fragmented, less universal.

The Byzantine Churches, Catholic and Orthodox, have always used a multiplicity of languages and they are not fragmented.
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You seem fixed on comparing the Byzantine Rite to the Latin Rite. This isn’t the first post of yours like this I’ve seen. I’m really glad you love your rite, and I’m glad to see diversity within the Church. I hope you understand and respect that us Latin Rite Catholics love ours as well.

The multiple languages of the Byzantine churches worked for them- I’m happy for them. For whatever reason, there was a need for uniformity in language in the Latin Rite. That’s how it was for centuries, and met well the needs of the western world. It was changed very quickly, and changes that are as dramatic and quick (in everything- not just the Church) usually result in division (at least until the confusion is sorted out).
 
I’m not fluent in Latin, but I understand all of the responses as one of the languages I’ve had to study for my music studies is Italian. It is extremely close to Latin, as I believe Latin is basically old Italian. (Someone please correct me if I’m wrong on that.) Also, as a professional musician, I need to know understand and pronounce correctly any Latin I would be singing.

I have attended TLM, which I get a lot out of. I also attend NO Latin Masses and get much from that as well.

Since Latin is the official language of the Church, I believe it is very important to learn Latin. It’s a shame that it has been lost in my generation and the generations before and after me. When my husband and I have children, we want to send them to Latin classes offered at the International Institute of Culture near us. But I also want them to start learning other languages early, so that would just be another language to learn which will help them with their grammar in other languages.

My father grew up in a blue collar family, attended Catholic school which were basically made up of blue collar/middle class families. Class graduating sizes were literally 600-800 a class in highschool. They all had to learn Latin all four years, plus their foreign language requirement. I don’t know what Catholic schools stopped teaching Latin, but it was a disservice to those of us who missed out - not just for mass and our heritage, but also for our grammar in any language.
 
I’d like to add. In my school we do learn some latin roots when they give us weekly vocab tests but it’s not stressed because they test on the words not the roots.
 
I’ve been able to say most of the Rosary in Latin (with the exception of the Glory be and the Apostles Creed-I still need cheat sheets) and I’ve been able to say most of the Mass prayers in Latin (especially the Confiteor and the Credo because of the inaccuracy of the current translation–at least they’re making some headway in fixing that problem:gopray: ). However, I’ll say them to myself so as not to confuse anyone.

Incidentally, once in a while, my PV will have us sing the Sanctus and the Agnus Dei in Latin during Daily Mass. People really do sing with him and it sounds really nice. It also goes well with his practice of celebrating Mass ad orientsum.
 
Goth_Catholic said:
Mass is said with some Latin in my parish, but normally only Kyrie is done in Latin.
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I haven’t read downthread so I don’t know if anybody else has mentioned this, but the Kyrie is Greek, not Latin. It’s the only Greek remnant still present in the Latin Mass.
 
Goth_Catholic said:
I’m learning how to pray the rosary in Latin and I’m hoping to be able to take Latin in college.
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Is there a resource you could point me toward for learning the Rosary in Latin? I’m also interested in learning to pray the Rosary in Latin.
Goth_Catholic said:
I’m pretty upset my diocese desided against offering the Tridentine mass. However, when I told my priest I was trying to learn Latin, he blessed me in Latin.
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There are a couple of parishes in my diocese that offer the Tridentine Mass. I will be attending one for Christ the King. I’m not a hyper-traditional Catholic, just an orthodox Catholic. I am interested in the Latin Mass. But probably not on a weekly basis. I believe that it’s important to worship in my own parish. And my parish is not currently offering Latin Mass.
 
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