Who Were the Disciples

[ChristianSurfer]

Based off of the great commission in Matthew 28:19,20

Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, 20 and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you.

Quick question- How do we become a disciple in todays world?

[context]
A pastor ran through this and asked me if I had baptized others and made disciples of others (which he defined that I had to completely teach someone everything and always call them to make sure they stay on path)

Which I replied… No

Then he said I’m not a Christian =disciple=saved.

What ever happened to becoming more like Christ or learning everything about the bible before I go around teaching?

 

[TheQuestioner]

I gotta tell ya, the things some protestants come up with…

 

[nicaetinismo]

the answer lies in to whom Jesus was speaking:

Jesus spoke to his closest friends, not the masses. Thus, he was speaking to those who knew him well, not necessarily everyone who knew him. So Jesus cannot be telling EVERYONE to “go out and baptize.”
lets take this in a form of an example:

a math student at elementary school level cannot go out and start teaching calculus merely because he has begun to study math. We cannot teach what we do not know.
you ARE a christian if you teach that which you know of the word of GOD. But remember, speaking the Word is not everything, you must LIVE the Word. I think St. Anthony of Padua said it best: “Always preach the Gospel, and sometimes use words.”

as for the baptism part of the quote, again we look at who Jess was speaking to: his apostles. As Catholics, we know that, through apostolic succession, the apostles were the equivalent of the first bishops, and priests. Jesus was not telling EVERYONE to baptize, only his priests. Now, granted, everyone can baptize another given the proper circumstances (proper form and necessity), but in most situations only Priests or (if given the proper dispensation) deacons can baptize.

I hope this helps, and i hope and pray that i didn’t say anything that was erroneous, if i did, please, someone more knowledgeable than I, point it out and correct me (I have just as much to learn about our amazing faith as anyone else)

God bless!!!
Nicaetinismo

 

[Nita]

the answer lies in to whom Jesus was speaking:

 

[chaunceygardner]

It sounds like a pyramid scheme, where we would all eventually be running around baptizing each other. Some are called to minister, to teach, to preach, to baptize, to bring the Word to others. But Jesus is not saying that ONLY those who do all of these are true disciples. As nicaetinismo posts, Jesus is not telling everyone that they must go out and baptize; those are specific instructions to his core followers.

Here are a few examples of what Jesus DID say about who are His disciples:

As I have loved you, so you also should love one another.
This is how all will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another. - John 13

If you remain in my word, you will truly be my disciples. - John 8

Whoever does not carry his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple. - Luke 14

There is much more that Jesus says and demonstrates about true discipleship, in reality a great part of what He says and does in the Gospels. For example, Jesus tells those who demonstrate great faith and trust in Him that they “are not far from the Kingdom of God.” He does not tell them they must first preach and baptize others.

Not to impugn the intent or integrity of the pastor, but it almost appears that this person is saying “I baptize and teach so I am saved, and you’re not.” Appears a little self-serving and presumptuous.

Based on your story and description this pastor is not a good example of a true disciple.

 

[ChristianSurfer]

It sounds like a pyramid scheme, where we would all eventually be running around baptizing each other. Some are called to minister, to teach, to preach, to baptize, to bring the Word to others. But Jesus is not saying that ONLY those who do all of these are true disciples. As nicaetinismo posts, Jesus is not telling everyone that they must go out and baptize; those are specific instructions to his core followers.

Thats exactly what he showed me. He showed me a piece of paper stating that if one baptized another, and so on, in 13 years almost the entire population will be baptized.

There is much more that Jesus says and demonstrates about true discipleship, in reality a great part of what He says and does in the Gospels. For example, Jesus tells those who demonstrate great faith and trust in Him that they “are not far from the Kingdom of God.” He does not tell them they must first preach and baptize others.

Good reply

Not to impugn the intent or integrity of the pastor, but it almost appears that this person is saying “I baptize and teach so I am saved, and you’re not.” Appears a little self-serving and presumptuous.

Based on your story and description this pastor is not a good example of a true disciple.

Well actually yeah, He stated that all the other ministries on campus are not making true disciples and based off of the great comission hes the only one doing what jesus spoke.
After that he invite me “under his wing” to make true disciples.
Not the most humble pastor ive ran into.

 

[ChristianSurfer]

the answer lies in to whom Jesus was speaking:

Jesus spoke to his closest friends, not the masses. Thus, he was speaking to those who knew him well, not necessarily everyone who knew him. So Jesus cannot be telling EVERYONE to “go out and baptize.”
lets take this in a form of an example:

a math student at elementary school level cannot go out and start teaching calculus merely because he has begun to study math. We cannot teach what we do not know.
you ARE a christian if you teach that which you know of the word of GOD. But remember, speaking the Word is not everything, you must LIVE the Word. I think St. Anthony of Padua said it best: “Always preach the Gospel, and sometimes use words.”

as for the baptism part of the quote, again we look at who Jess was speaking to: his apostles. As Catholics, we know that, through apostolic succession, the apostles were the equivalent of the first bishops, and priests. Jesus was not telling EVERYONE to baptize, only his priests. Now, granted, everyone can baptize another given the proper circumstances (proper form and necessity), but in most situations only Priests or (if given the proper dispensation) deacons can baptize.

This is true, in the bible study he asked “Who was Jesus speaking to” I replied the 11 disciple like it says in the previous verse

Then the eleven disciples went to Galilee, to the mountain where Jesus had told them to go.

He said no all of his disciples (who are christians) like you or me. I should of stuck to my original answer.

Very good reply I tried stating these ideas that very day and He just went back to the great comission and stated see this is what you have to do to be a Christian. I didn’t accept what he was saying but it looks like I need not be so movable in my views and be more “rock like”

I hope this helps, and i hope and pray that i didn’t say anything that was erroneous, if i did, please, someone more knowledgeable than I, point it out and correct me (I have just as much to learn about our amazing faith as anyone else)

God bless!!!
Nicaetinismo

Very good this helped alot thanks!

 

[ChristianSurfer]

Soo wait… Im still a little confused about what it means to be a disiple. Could someone give me a spectrum of how to be a disiple in today’s world because I know its not just one person so maybe paint the picture for me?

 

[davidv]

Soo wait… Im still a little confused about what it means to be a disiple. Could someone give me a spectrum of how to be a disiple in today’s world because I know its not just one person so maybe paint the picture for me?

1533 Baptism, Confirmation, and Eucharist are sacraments of Christian initiation. They ground the common vocation of all Christ’s disciples, a vocation to holiness and to the mission of evangelizing the world. They confer the graces needed for the life according to the Spirit during this life as pilgrims on the march towards the homeland.

1816 The disciple of Christ must not only keep the faith and live on it, but also profess it, confidently bear witness to it, and spread it: "All however must be prepared to confess Christ before men and to follow him along the way of the Cross, amidst the persecutions which the Church never lacks."82 Service of and witness to the faith are necessary for salvation: “So every one who acknowledges me before men, I also will acknowledge before my Father who is in heaven; but whoever denies me before men, I also will deny before my Father who is in heaven.”

Become holy and lead others to Christ.

562 Christ’s disciples are to conform themselves to him until he is formed in them (cf. *Gal *4:19). “For this reason we, who have been made like to him, who have died with him and risen with him, are taken up into the mysteries of his life, until we reign together with him” (*LG *7 § 4).

Conform youself to Christ.

 

[ChristianSurfer]

Become holy and lead others to Christ.

Conform youself to Christ.

Well put.

In the second part, lead others to Christ, how do we fulfill that?

Im trying to get an idea here… Does that mean:

standing on a sidewalk preaching or

being a good example for others and teaching in natural conversation (like hey how has your day been… later, do you know Jesus [begin teaching]) or

having that be your main point in a conversation ( do you know Jesus?[begin teaching]) or

being a good example and through that teach (Hey how come you have good morals, are so happy? etc… well I have Jesus [begin teaching]).

I often thing of the last example is being the right choice unless you called for the others. I am seeing if I have a good idea of who a disciple would be in today’s world.

Preach the Gospel at all times and when necessary use words.

 

[davidv]

Well put.

In the second part, lead others to Christ, how do we fulfill that?

Im trying to get an idea here… Does that mean:

standing on a sidewalk preaching or

Maybe, if this is your vocation from God.

being a good example for others and teaching in natural conversation (like hey how has your day been… later, do you know Jesus [begin teaching]) or

Maybe, with someone you have developed a relationship and the topic naturally leads you to it.

having that be your main point in a conversation ( do you know Jesus?[begin teaching]) or

Not usually, and not unless it is the original point of the conversation, e.g. posting on this forum.

being a good example and through that teach (Hey how come you have good morals, are so happy? etc… well I have Jesus [begin teaching]).

Always.

I often thing of the last example is being the right choice unless you called for the others. I am seeing if I have a good idea of who a disciple would be in today’s world.

 

[ChristianSurfer]

Maybe, if this is your vocation from God.

Maybe, with someone you have developed a relationship and the topic naturally leads you to it.

Not usually, and not unless it is the original point of the conversation, e.g. posting on this forum.

Always.

Many thanks DavidV, I have a better understanding of a disciple and this is very important ,

thanks :tiphat:

 

[ChristianSurfer]

Okay last question im still confused,

what is the relationship between the two:

priests discipleship and laity discipleship?

So there are times when he speaks to just the 12/11 so this would be instructions for the leaders/priests?

If so how do we as the laity fulfill our discipleship role?

P.S. This is pertaining to scripture.

 

[ChristianSurfer]

 

[ChristianSurfer]

Somebody wrote this on another thread can anyone expand:

When Jesus spoke to the crowds - he spoke to all of us. When he spoke to his Apostles - he spoke to the heads of the Church.

Or just point me in the right direction???

 

[davidv]

Okay last question im still confused,

what is the relationship between the two:

priests discipleship and laity discipleship?

So there are times when he speaks to just the 12/11 so this would be instructions for the leaders/priests?

If so how do we as the laity fulfill our discipleship role?

P.S. This is pertaining to scripture.

To be a disciple is to learn from, and follow, the teacher. In Christianity our teacher is Jesus.
In many repects, priestly and lay discipleship are the same. Independent of our vocation we are to learn from, and follow, Jesus.