Who were the Nephites?

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Frankenfurter

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Just wondering, has anyone explored the American people called Nephites (in the book of Mormon)? They seem to have a rich history from the book of Mormon.

As a Catholic, I am a bit perplexed as to the existence of these people.

It is a beautiful image to see Jesus visiting the Americas. I am open to the possibility.

But where does this notion of the Nephites come from? Even the name?

I am not asking for proof. I am sure that things existed that cannot be proven. (Like, I saw a shooting star and nobody else saw it…)

I’m just wondering, were these Nephites something that exists outside of one man’s imagination or not?

🙂
 
The Nephites are descendants of Nephi, son of Lehi who I believe was of the tribe of Ephriam. After the Assyrian conquest of Israel (the Northern Kingdom) Lehi led a group of his tribesmen to a new home in the Western Hemisphere. They crossed the Atlantic in a submarine shaped ship (if memory serves). I believe there were three other groups as well but the main contenders in the Book of Mormon were the Nephites and the Lamanites. The war like Lamanites ultimately wiped out the more gentle Nephites and became what we recognize as the American Indians. You won’t find any of this in the Bible but it is all in the Book of Mormon.
 
In the Mormon sense, the Nephites are made up.

There were no Nephite people in America. It’s all fiction.

It’s like reading a story from the Onion. The Book of Mormon is bunk.
 
OK. So we have lots of historical knowledge of the ancient Jews and Christians.

Just wondering if the Nephites have left us anything?

And I am open to the possibility that they were wiped out.

Just wondering.
 
Frankenfurter said:
Just wondering, has anyone explored the American people called Nephites (in the book of Mormon)? They seem to have a rich history from the book of Mormon.

As a Catholic, I am a bit perplexed as to the existence of these people.

It is a beautiful image to see Jesus visiting the Americas. I am open to the possibility.

But where does this notion of the Nephites come from? Even the name?

I am not asking for proof. I am sure that things existed that cannot be proven. (Like, I saw a shooting star and nobody else saw it…)

I’m just wondering, were these Nephites something that exists outside of one man’s imagination or not?

🙂
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Hi, Frankenfurter,

The Nephites descended primarily from the tribe of Manasseh through their father, Lehi, who left Jerusalem with his family in 600 BC, before it was conquered. Nephi was the son of Lehi, and was guided to build a ship and they embarked on an ocean voyage after having traveled from Jerusalem south and southeast and finally embarking through the Red Sea into the Indian Ocean (our language, not theirs), and traveling to somewhere in the Americas. They were a small group, and eventually had infighting among their descendants that resulted in their entire destruction in the 300’s AD, but a small remnant of some of Lehi’s descendants (described as “Lamanites”) weren’t totally wiped out so there are some of their descendants alive today just as remnants of all the tribes of Israel are alive today, but they don’t have all their family history all the way back to 600 BC to know of their ancestral connections.

Because there was an extreme sense of “revenge” and of the infighters wanting to destroy any evidence of the Nephite group (such as has happened among other groups in history), it would be implausible to expect to find “Nephite” artifacts, but perhaps some “Lamanite” artifacts although it would not be clear what one would look for as a “Lamanite” artifact, nor would it be clear where those might be.

Those groups had their own languages and cultures, but were among other language groups and the many cultures within the continents of North and South America.
 
Nothing, not even a trace of their culture (Jewish in the Americas) or civilization…metal bows, swords and plows, windows, horses (again, in the Americas), etc…the list of missing items mentioned in the BoM is long. Writings, in their so-called Reformed Egyptian. Nothing.
 
ParkerD said:
Hi, Frankenfurter,

The Nephites descended primarily from the tribe of Manasseh . . . .
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I stand corrected. But didn’t the tribe of Ephriam play an important part in the Jewish settlement of the Americas?
 
I’m not at all familiar with the Book of Mormon, but I am a bit familiar with the concept of historicity.

Any significant population will have left evidence of there existence behind. I live in an area where hundreds of arrow heads have been found by the edge of the lake. Most of the roads in my town started off as Indian trails. Town records date back to when the land was purchased from the Indians. All this bits of evidence lead to a very solid conclusion that there were Native Americans in my area long ago.

Now when it comes to the Nephites, we would expect to find evidence of them. Evidence of Jewish artifacts identical or nearly identical to wherever they came from. We expect the oral histories of several known tribes to describe a transatlantic voyage from a common area. We’d expect evidence of settlements.

This is the first time I have heard of a “Nephite” people, and it is probably only referenced in the Book of Mormon, which was written in the 1800’s. Without any written mention of such a people, or a similar people recorded from Native American sources, or sources from the supposed area of origin, I think we could only conclude that the Nephites are at best fictional.
 
Has anyone actually seriously looked into this - did the Nephites perhaps actually exist - with an open mind?
 
Zenas said:
I stand corrected. But didn’t the tribe of Ephriam play an important part in the Jewish settlement of the Americas?
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Zenas,

I don’t know what you are referring to as regards either the “tribe of Ephraim play an important part” or the “Jewish settlement of the Americas”. Do you mean modern Jews coming to America?

The tribe of Ephraim is considered by Latter-day Saints to play a prominent role within the gathering of Israel, not associated with the Lamanites or Nephites other than bringing the gospel to descendants of some of the Lamanites; they most likely had descendants who have become Latter-day Saints in England and other parts of Europe. These have nothing to do with a “Jewish settlement of the Americas”.
 
Frankenfurter said:
Has anyone actually seriously looked into this - did the Nephites perhaps actually exist - with an open mind?
Click to expand...
I don’t see where an “open mind” comes to play here. The only reference to this people is in the holy book of a non-Catholic religion. Unless other collaborative evidence is discovered, then we can only assume they are fictional or allegorical.
 
ParkerD said:
Zenas,

I don’t know what you are referring to as regards either the “tribe of Ephraim play an important part” or the “Jewish settlement of the Americas”. Do you mean modern Jews coming to America?

The tribe of Ephraim is considered by Latter-day Saints to play a prominent role within the gathering of Israel, not associated with the Lamanites or Nephites other than bringing the gospel to descendants of some of the Lamanites; they most likely had descendants who have become Latter-day Saints in England and other parts of Europe. These have nothing to do with a “Jewish settlement of the Americas”.
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No, I’m talking about ancient Jews settling pre-Columbian America. I have heard that the Ephriamites played a prominent role in the Book of Mormon but I guess I’m wrong. I must have got them confused with the tribe of Manasseh.
 
Frankenfurter:

PLEASE do yourself a favor: do a search for a book “No Man Knows My History” by Fawn Brodie, buy it and read it. She was approached by the LDS hierarchy to write the biography of Joseph Smith. Her efforts were so excellent she won a Alfred Knoph award but on the other hand, the “tolerant” elders of the LDS Church kicked her out of it (I suspect into what the LDS call outer darkness; isn’t that right Parker:eek:) Anyway, I had a LDS boss after me to convert FOR YEARS & was that book ever an eye opener 👍 Also, see Utah Lighthouse Ministry. Sandra Tanner is Brigham Young’s great, great granddaughter or something like that - has EXQUISITE documentation of this fraud perpetrated on innocent, ignorant folk throughout nearly 200 years.

The Smithsonian has been approached for years re: the existence of the “nephites” in North America. There is NO PROOF that this particular civilization lived in USA centuries ago. Find me a PHD somewhere in USA, who is not LDS who will commit to existence of ancient so-called ‘nephites’ in USA - it’s taught @ BYU but is existence & evidence of “nephites” taught anywhere else? It would be big news if it ACTUALLY HAPPENED! IF there was proof of this it would be in every textbook. Period. Smithsonian had a form letter they have sent out for decades because of the many requests. Google up the Smithsonian & ask them! Tragically, it’s pure fiction, American folklore at it’s worst. So much of what LDS believe hinges on what 1 man Joseph Smith stated with no evidence for it, just the say so of one convicted glass-looker.

Bottom line Frankenfurter:
Sadly, no matter what the LDS believe “truth” to be, nephites & all, their eternal, eschatological goal is GODHOOD (very disturbing belief) which isn’t exactly a CHRISTIAN CONCEPT; yes, they believe in the end they will be as gods (see the snake in the garden in Genesis); nephites or any of their man-made beliefs has nothing to do with TRUTH: the Bible, the Sacraments, the Eucharist, Christ Jesus and the Trinity.
 
Read I and II Maccabees of our own Deuterocanon (King James here sacrednamebible.com/kjvapocrypha/index.htm), and you will see much the same content and features as the Book of Mormon. Sandra Tanner also did an excellent analysis of I Nephi and our book of Judith. You will also find many parallels with Snorre Sturlason’s Heimskringla (just the first part, because the second wasn’t yet available in translation), Francesco Clavigero’s History of Mexico, and Geoffrey of Monmouth’s History of the Kings of England, and the works of William Shakespeare. And of course, there is Solomon Spalding, but with the rest of the parallels, it becomes almost irrelevant.

There is nothing unique about the Book of Mormon.
 
Yes, that theory is total bunk - it’s simply a fabrication used to support / validate the preposterous claims of the founder…
…Seriously, the ancient alien theory holds more water than that of the Mormons.
 
Frankenfurter said:
Has anyone actually seriously looked into this - did the Nephites perhaps actually exist - with an open mind?
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Mormon sources look for Lamanite civilizations all the time, focusing lately on Myans. While all the time, they won’t excavate their own religious site, the Hill Cummorah, where Smith claims to have received a record of the Nephites on gold plates. Mormons own the property, and you’d think there would be an interest in finding out what else is buried there.

Outside of Mormonism, no, it would be like trying to find Hobbits and the Shire. No one is going to waste their time.
 
RebeccaJ said:
Outside of Mormonism, no, it would be like trying to find Hobbits and the Shire. No one is going to waste their time.
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Why read trash fiction when you can read fiction with an inspirational message?

Hill Cumorah:

(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
 
Frankenfurter said:
Has anyone actually seriously looked into this - did the Nephites perhaps actually exist - with an open mind?
Click to expand...
Lots of research has been done. I became interested in Mormon beliefs while living in Boise Idaho … Lots of Mormons live there. My daughter dated a Mormon off and on for a couple of years.

There are, if I remember correctly, at least two documentaries on Youtube
that explore a variety of the assertions made by the Mormon Church. Scientists/Historians/Cartographers/Archeologists (including Mormon’s) are asked of their experience, research and professional evaluation of the claims of the LDS Church.
Here is one of them
youtube.com/watch?v=G1mFdO1wB08

As to your question regarding the Nephites … This should help to answer …

Native Americans, DNA and the Mormon Church …

genealogy.about.com/b/2004/09/14/native-americans-dna-and-the-mormon-church.htm
 
Frankenfurter said:
I’m just wondering, were these Nephites something that exists outside of one man’s imagination or not?
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No, they definitely do not exist outside of one man’s imagination. They exist within several million people’s imagination at this point.
 
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