Whom does the Holy Spirit guide?

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paarsurrey

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Hi

Sorry guys to disturb you. I was just reading a thread here, and I came across a dialogue which proceeds like thus:

**Protestant:**If I were to come across a passage of Scripture that taught me a Pope will come to us, and be recognized as an infallible being and that i should receive scriptural interpretation from him, than maybe I would. But until then, Im gonna go ahead and let the Holy Spirit be my teacher and counselor.

Catholic:That every other Christian who disagrees with your view of Scripture is wrong but you’re right because what you know came from the Holy Spirit.
If the Holy Spirit was leading you guys don’t you think there would be some sort of unity?

Paarsurrey: I just want to know my friends as to how a Catholic, a Protestant or a JW knows that the Holy Spirit is guiding him while they are all (30000 plus denominations) pitched against one another having tenets opposing one another.

It is a scenario of misguidance rather than guidance from the Holy Spirit.

How do you reconcile with it?

Any thoughts anybody, please

Thanks
 
paarsurrey said:
Paarsurrey: I just want to know my friends as to how a Catholic, a Protestant or a JW knows that the Holy Spirit is guiding him while they are all (30000 plus denominations) pitched against one another having tenets opposing one another.

It is a scenario of misguidance rather than guidance from the Holy Spirit.

How do you reconcile with it?

Any thoughts anybody, please

Thanks
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Well, Catholics recognize that the Holy Spirit guides the Church through the magistrium, Scripture, and Sacred Tradition. It’s been that way for 2000 years and will be that way until the end. I cannot speak for the other Churches you mentioned.
 
Paar,

This is another interesting question from you. I think that you are getting to the heart of the matter. If I may, however, I would like to change your basic assertions.

Protestant (not all, but some): I can read the scriptures myself and the Holy Spirit will guide me to the truth. My personal beliefs based on my interpretation of scripture are as valid as anyone elses.

Catholic: I can read the scriptures myself but the Holy Spirit will guide the Church to all truth. I must beleive what the Church teaches and see scripture in that light.

Now, I am not saying that Catholics do not beleive that the Holy Spirit will guide individuals. I am saying that it was the Church that was promised him as a guide by Christ. Jesus did not write anything nor did he say “go and give the scriptures.” He said to go and teach. The early Church was all oral tradition. Catholics feel that the Church is guided by the Holy Spirit. If each individual was, why are there multiple denominations? Individuals hear what they want to hear and read into things what they want to read.
 
ralphinal said:
Catholics feel that the Church is guided by the Holy Spirit. If each individual was, why are there multiple denominations? Individuals hear what they want to hear and read into things what they want to read.
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Hi

I undersand that the Holy Spirit made a first appearance at the beginning of Jesus’s ministry when he was baptized in the Jordan River by John the Baptist (Matthew 3:13-17, Mark 1:9-11, Luke 3:21-22, John 1:31-33). In these accounts, the incorporeal Holy Spirit is described as descending upon Jesus ‘like’ or ‘as’ a dove.

So the HolySpirit descends as a dove as stated. Now we have members here from different denominations, Catholics, Protestants , JWs etc. Would you kindly express your personal opinion of HolySpirit descending upon you? We want a distinct appearance which could be noticed and understood by others, please. Please mention name of the faith you belong to so that others could form a clear opinion.

Thanks
 
ralphinal said:
Paar,

This is another interesting question from you. I think that you are getting to the heart of the matter. If I may, however, I would like to change your basic assertions.

Protestant (not all, but some): I can read the scriptures myself and the Holy Spirit will guide me to the truth. My personal beliefs based on my interpretation of scripture are as valid as anyone elses.

Catholic: I can read the scriptures myself but the Holy Spirit will guide the Church to all truth. I must beleive what the Church teaches and see scripture in that light.
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I think ralphinal hit the nail on the head here. As for personal experience…by the way I’m Roman Catholic :)…
When our Holy Father John Paul II passed away, I think he personally sent the Holy Spirit to me. I had not been attending Mass regularly AND my children had not been baptized. When I heard of his death, “something” hit me like a rock (nice throw St. Peter!!) I was never so emotional (good emotions) I immediately called my “favorite” parish, had hubby enroll in RCIA (his choice) and we had our children baptized. I had lost my way and his death set me on the right path. To me, he was such a good and holy man. Every time I saw him I felt “comforted”. When The Church lost him I knew that God was speaking to me… He basically said, “I cannot lose you and your babies, too. Bring them to Me, come to Me and I will give you rest”. I know my explanation may sound a little strange, but I never felt such a powerful pull on my soul as I did that day. I think the Holy Spirit guides The Church as a whole and guides individuals according to His Will and what they need to see, hear, feel, etc.

Asalam Alaykoum, my friend!
 
The Holy Spirit guides every human being on the planet. But it’s up to us to listen with a loving heart.
 
StBenMom said:
I think ralphinal hit the nail on the head here. As for personal experience…by the way I’m Roman Catholic :)…
When our Holy Father John Paul II passed away, I think he personally sent the Holy Spirit to me.
I think the **Holy Spirit guides The Church **as a whole and guides individuals according to **His Will **and what they need to see, hear, feel, etc.
Asalam Alaykoum, my friend!
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Hi

Wa Ulaikumus Salam

Please don’t mind, please treat it a sort of informal survey; we (and of course the Protestants and JWs members here also if the like to participate) would be a little analyzing your experience here to understand it more closely.
  1. The HolySpirit came to you but not in the shape of a dove, you have forgotten to mention it. Could you describe its visible form?
  2. How were you so sure that it was a HolySpirit?
  3. It did not say to you or it did say to you in clear audible words something.
  4. Was this experience in a dream while you were sleeping? Or sort of a vision while you were awake.
  5. How do you say that it was he the Holy Father John Paul II who personally sent the HolySpirit to you?
  6. Do you think that the HolySpirit has to obey the commands of Holy Father John Paul II?
Please don’t get embarrassed in any way. We are just sharing your experience to know it better. My thousand apologies

Thanks for you (name removed by moderator)ut
 
1.The HolySpirit came to you but not in the shape of a dove, you have forgotten to mention it. Could you describe its visible form?

I see the Holy Spirit everywhere. I see it in the faces of my children, my brothers and sisters in Christ, my priest, etc. The “visible” form takes many shapes to me. That day the Holy Spirit shown through JPII

2.How were you so sure that it was a HolySpirit?

I have never felt a more pure love and comfort. I am not so sure Satan could make my heart that light

3.It did not say to you or it did say to you in clear audible words something.

It wasn’t clear, “audible” words. God spoke to me through my prayers and my heart.

4.Was this experience in a dream while you were sleeping? Or sort of a vision while you were awake.

I was wide awake. I was watching the news of JPII’s death and his laying in state.

5.How do you say that it was he the Holy Father John Paul II who personally sent the HolySpirit to you?

No, I did not say that. God sent the Holy Spirit. He is the only one to do that. He showed me the Spirit through the face of JPII.

6.Do you think that the HolySpirit has to obey the commands of Holy Father John Paul II?

Don’t take this the wrong way, but…HARDLY!!! Thats heresy to me. The Holy Father obeys the commands of the Holy Spirit. Just the opposite of what you implied.

Please don’t get embarrassed in any way. We are just sharing your experience to know it better. My thousand apologies

I am happy to share my personal experience and faith with you, Paar. Anytime! Like I have said before, when I “meet” a Muslim like you, it makes me glad. Two different faiths trying to learn from one another without malice or ill intent. You have always, in my opinion, asked thoughtful, genuine questions that deserve thoughtful answers. Thanks!!
 
paarsurrey said:
Hi

I undersand that the Holy Spirit made a first appearance at the beginning of Jesus’s ministry when he was baptized in the Jordan River by John the Baptist (Matthew 3:13-17, Mark 1:9-11, Luke 3:21-22, John 1:31-33). In these accounts, the incorporeal Holy Spirit is described as descending upon Jesus ‘like’ or ‘as’ a dove.

.

Thanks
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He appeared even earlier when Mary became with child.
The Spirit shows up in the Old Testament (OT), especially in the prophets’ books.

  1. *]The OT does not use nepesh (soul of earthly beings) to describe God. It uses ruach.
    *]The OT does not present *ruach *as the mediator between God and humans. The Spirit is God at work, not a go-between. The word *ruach *is a movement of air (wind, breath)
    *]There are ‘general’ references to the Spirit of God, such as in Gen 44:38 on the lips of a non-believer. When that happens, the term may have been used to mean ‘divine spirit’, a recognition that a god (whomever the god is) is at work, that some sort of power or authority beyond the usual is rather obviously causing things to happen.
    *]The Messiah is said by Isaiah to be specially endowed with the Spirit : Isaiah 11:2; 42:1; 61:1.
    *]The Spirit is seen as God’s presence in the hearts of each believer : Psalm 51:11; Psalm 139:7.
    *]In Ezekiel (37:9) and Isaiah (34:16; 48:16; 63:10), there is a hint of personality, unlike in the rest of the Hebrew Scriptures.
    In the main OT Jewish way of looking at it, the Spirit was a life force or energy of God, the operational side of what a Christian would term “the Father”, rather than a Person in the Trinitarian sense. A psalmist speaks of God’s ‘Spirit’ acting in a personal way (Psalm 143:10), but the use of ‘spirit’ there is probably another way to say ‘God’ (Hebrew poetry uses many ways to say the same or similar things). Isaiah and Ezekiel give hints toward envisioning the person-ness of the Spirit, but it is not until the writings between the testaments that this vision takes on a clearer shape, and not until Christ that it is given its full dimension.
 
StBenMom said:
I see the Holy Spirit everywhere. I see it in the faces of my children, my brothers and sisters in Christ, my priest, etc. The “visible” form takes many shapes to me. That day the Holy Spirit shown through JPII
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Hi

Thank you for sharing your experience of HolySpirit with us. Likewise, I would appreciate if other Catholics, Protestants, Jews, JWs also share their experience of the HolySpirit with us. I would also like their comments on your experience as stated by you in your post . This is just to form our concept of the HolySpirit on rational and realistic footings.

Thanks and regards
 
What is your experience regarding the Holy Spirit? Thank you for sharing.
 
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