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ParkerD
Guest
Lax16,ParkerD (corrected from Dianaiad) - Well, I would bet my bottom dollar most people would choose intimate relations with people of their choice over killing their child anyday if both were pleasing to God. And not because of sinfulness, but if given the choice of hanky-panky over killing I think it’s a no-brainer.
Really, D, you can’t expect me or anyone else to think that in his plural marriages JS was changing diapers and tending to the emotional needs of his wives. I’m sure some men in plural marriages did/do that, however, from what I am hearing JS was a very busy man.
If he was starting business ventures, moving people from state to state, etc. and died at a young age, my guess is that he didn’t have much time for family life.
I think it’s a “no-brainer” in the opposite direction than what you suggest. The pertinent question becomes, “did Abraham really and truly think God had the power to resurrect his son Isaac, and have faith that he was being asked to do something by God that did not make logical sense and that he was willing to do it?”
Physical “intimate relations” is a tiny part of marriage. The issues involved in marriage and raising children together and being mutually supportive are far more complex than the kind of “intimate relations” you implied. Note also that Joseph Smith had no children by a plural marriage relationship, at all (though Brigham Young did much later).
You evidently haven’t read much about Joseph Smith’s life to assume he had no time for family life. He made time for family life, was very much involved with his children, and passionately involved with Emma and being a support to her even in the midst of doing all that he did.
And, no I do not ask questions in jest. I have learned from you to get the offical LDS teaching/opinion on things before forming my opinions. There is so much reference to the OT to support LDS teachings, that I am truly surprised. I rarely look to the OT to support Christianity (except in fulfillment) so I will always ask for clarification on the LDS view of “covenants” etc.
I would say that “yes”, he was. You can read about his having to spend four months in a dungeon in Liberty, Missouri with horrible conditions and horrible food and knowing his family was in oppressive conditions also (not in a dungeon, but having been greatly mistreated and suffering the ravages of winter), yet being able in the end to write some of the most beautiful prose in letters from that “Liberty Jail” that have ever been penned, in my opinion. He wrote from a position of great suffering, but praised God while yet questioning “where is the pavilion that covereth thy hiding place?”Was JS asked to engage in any other “difficult” tests of faith?
I would not say that the circumstance you mentioned is evidence that God wanted Emma to “witness” such, if it really happened which could be a rumor anyway as to its details. However, I really did mean that it was a test of other people’s faith, and certainly a test of Emma’s faith. She had a completely unique role in that she was the wife of a man who testified he was a prophet of God. There is no question that her faith would be sorely tested under the knowledge that any such belief as “plural marriage” was a commandment from God for her husband–also of course the aspect of a test of faith in trying to reconcile with women who had been “sealed” to her husband and she knowing that this had happened.You say JS loved his wife Emma very much - and maybe he did. But why would God want any woman to have to witness her husband literally having “a romp in the hay?” If you said God was testing the faith (and patience) of Emma Smith, not Joseph, I might agree with you.
Usually tests of faith are difficult not pleasurable.
Can you provide any examples from the OT/NT that would show God asking anyone else in the span of several thousands of years to engage in similar “tests of faith?”
Besides the Abrahamic test, one can find examples of various faith tests.Thanks!
It would have taken great faith for the people who saw the change happen to Paul (from being Saul), to accept that he ended up having a significant leadership role after having been such a persecutor of the members of the church–especially for him to be selected as an apostle.
It took great faith for Noah to spend years building an ark when everyone thought it was a ridiculous thing he was doing.
It took faith for Jacob to not walk away from the deviously schemed “I didn’t choose her” marriage to Leah after seven years of hard work, and instead to go ahead and accept his covenant marriage to her and work seven more years for his covenant marriage to Rachel.
These are examples of doing something as a test of faith that did not make logical sense given the circumstances, and required exercising faith in God and in His promises and in making covenants with God that secure the faith and show its vitality in a person’s life.