Why are guardian angels usually hidden?

[Neoplatonist]

Choosing is always an act of the will. To believe is an act of the will.
It’s assisted by the gift of God’s grace – but it is not forced by this gift.
Seeing/experiencing a miracle does not ensure faith. Judas not only saw and talked to Our Lord, but also saw His miracles. So did many of the disbelieving scribes and Pharisees.

? Do you really think you could just choose tomorrow to believe in Santa Claus? Could you just decide to start believing that abortion is nothing more than a lifestyle choice or that having all our kids in some collective military academy as in Plato’s Republic would be a great idea? I can will my body to get out of bed in order to pursue something I believe is true (like keeping a job to provide for my family is important or exercising will improve my health and reduce my stress), but I can’t “will” to believe that obesity is a sign of health and success as it once was thought.

If our faith is going work in the modern world, we need to stop clinging to the psychological theories from the Middle Ages, as they are barely more relevant than the similarly medieval theories of physiology or physics. In the modern model, we can, indeed, prefer one hypothesis to another given a set of data points, but the fewer the data points which could support a theory, and the greater the number of conflicting data points, the less feasible it is to invest our lives and our fortunes in a given hypothesis. Wondrous signs are powerful data points. (Notice I am not asking for certain knowledge. Just a little help swallowing a theory that is built on a tradition woven from a multitude of supposed miracles.)

 

[Nita]

From the Catholic Encyclopedia we find:
The wonder of the miracle is due to the fact that its cause is hidden, and an effect is expected other than what actually takes place. Hence, by comparison with the ordinary course of things, the miracle is called extraordinary. In analyzing the difference between the extraordinary character of the miracle and the ordinary course of nature, the Fathers of the Church and theologians employ the terms above, contrary to, and outside nature. These terms express the manner in which the miracle is extraordinary.

The bringing of something into being*** out of nothing*** (creating) is “contrary to” our scientific laws of physical nature; it is “outside nature”.

This is much more in keeping with what the vast majority of people mean the vast majority of the time when they use the term. In contrast, if we are to hang with the idea that everything is a miracle, then we are hard pressed to understand why Christ performed wondrous feats instead of just saying, “look around”, or “you woke up this morning, be moved to wonder.” But he didn’t. Rather, he knew what the saints and witnesses down through history have felt, and that is that a certain wondrous rarity of the event in connection to a prayer or event can serve as a great help to faith.

Almost all of Our Lord’s miracles were performed out of compassion for the physical needs of people. (medical healings; exorcisms; raising a dead person; feeding people)

Without doing a complete search of the gospels, there are **comparitively very few **that come to mind that do not fall into that category (angel appearing to Mary and later to the shepherds; John the Baptist seeing a dove and hearing the Father speak at Our Lord’s Baptism; the apostles seeing Our Lord walk on water; the transfiguration observed by Peter, James & John; Thomas seeing Our Lord’s wounds…)
It’s interesting to note those who saw these supernatural phenoma. Perhaps it was the roles those people were beiing called on to fulfill that was a factor in their receiving those special “miracles”.
(Even St. Joseph did not see angelic apparitions while he was awake; it was only in dreams.)

To answer the other point: no, I have no expectation that seeing my guardian angel would ensure my faith. If I am to believe the stories of the Bible and the saints, however, it is fair to hope it would help my faith, though.

And if it didn’t, and you rejected your faith anyway, your judgement would be more severe.
What are the possibilities that with time you might start to wonder whether it was a possible hallucination caused by…?

Most of the people in Our Lord’s time WERE NOT personal recipients of a miracle - neither did most people personally witness miracles happening to others. They just heard about the miracles/works from others. When Jesus calls on people to believe because of His “works”, He doesn’t mean only works/miracles He performed for them personally or that they witnessed. The “works” He speaks of include miracles they knew about through the reliable testimony of others. We still have that testimony in Scripture – and in addition, reliable testimony of other miracles that have occurred through God’s power in the subsequent years since Our Lord’s death.

 

[JamesCaruso]

I have read some interesting work on the hiddenness of God—some insightful and some not. Even then, though, those arguments do not seem to apply to our guardian angels as well. If their role is to watch over us and watch out for us, why would they also resist our prayerful requests for visions or visitations? Aquinas made a good argument that they can affect our senses and our dreams just as they can influence our will.

To use a couple of analogies to get talk up and going: imagine how much slower and sloppier it would be to have a babysitter or a math tutor who never spoke to you or answered any of your questions.

Every time I visit this thread, I feel the answer to your question must be easier than would appear at first glance. The question seems to be along the line of, “Why is the world the way it is?” Why, for instance, can we not walk through walls? Why can’t people fly? Why can’t we speak telepathically? Why can’t we easily see the will of God in our lives? Why can’t we regenerate a limb if one of ours becomes severed? As you can see the list can go on endlessly, and yet each one of the propositions can be seen as something that would improve our lives.

Another thing occurs to me. We can’t see God? Doesn’t that limit our ability to communicate with him? Wouldn’t it be easier to discern his will for us if we could simply speak with him face to face?

In other words, we seem to be saying, in effect, “Why does God put so many obstacles in our way?” At this point, I think I will leave it to the reader to answer the question, which to me seems all too obvious.

 

[Nita]

? Do you really think you could just choose tomorrow to believe in Santa Claus? Could you just decide to start believing that abortion is nothing more than a lifestyle choice or that having all our kids in some collective military academy as in Plato’s Republic would be a great idea? I can will my body to get out of bed in order to pursue something I believe is true (like keeping a job to provide for my family is important or exercising will improve my health and reduce my stress), but I can’t “will” to believe that obesity is a sign of health and success as it once was thought.

I’m not sure what I said that gave you the impression I thought it was possible to will something that is totally contrary to right reason. I certainly never meant to.

If our faith is going work in the modern world, we need to stop clinging to the psychological theories from the Middle Ages, as they are barely more relevant than the similarly medieval theories of physiology or physics. In the modern model, we can, indeed, prefer one hypothesis to another given a set of data points, but the fewer the data points which could support a theory, and the greater the number of conflicting data points, the less feasible it is to invest our lives and our fortunes in a given hypothesis. Wondrous signs are powerful data points. (Notice I am not asking for certain knowledge. Just a little help swallowing a theory that is built on a tradition woven from a multitude of supposed miracles.)

Personally, I have never considered that Christianity or theocracy is built on supposed miracles.

Re believing in God:
Paul’s words in Romans were obvious to my little mind long before I was aware they were in Scripture. It didn’t involve any miracle, but just the gift of reason granted to me by God.
Romans 1:19-20 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them. Ever since the creation of the world his invisible nature, namely, his eternal power and deity, has been clearly perceived in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse; To me it would require far more “blind faith” to disbelieve in the existence of God – precisely because it would be totally against the power of reason that is part of human nature. To deny the existence of God would rely on me placing total faith in the words of atheist scientists and rejecting my reason and the testimony of human history.

 

[Nita]

Can I ask Neoplatonist, just where your doubts lie?
Is it in the existence of God (which by extension would also result in doubts about Jesus)?
Or is it only in the divinity of Jesus where you are having doubts?

 

[Neoplatonist]

Personally, I have never considered that Christianity or theocracy is built on supposed miracles.

I don’t know how to express surprise but not seem snarky. I’m honestly a little boggled to hear someone say this. Maybe I’m misunderstanding your point somehow. ?]

Would Christianity and Catholicism really be the same without Christ’s resurrection? Without transubstantiation? The virgin birth? Can we take away the role that Paul played in the early church? Can we get that up and running without his conversion experience on the road to Damascus? No tongues of fire? No raising of Lazarus?

That doesn’t even begin to point back to the Old Testament on which the rest is built in fulfilment.

 

[Neoplatonist]

Can I ask Neoplatonist, just where your doubts lie?
Is it in the existence of God (which by extension would also result in doubts about Jesus)?
Or is it only in the divinity of Jesus where you are having doubts?

Great question. Not sure how to pick one thing as a cornerstone to the others. I have sincere doubts about the whole framework of miracles itself and our interpretation of them. That, in turn, undermines the credibility of claims made by those who also claimed they witnessed miracles (and interpreted them correctly).

In the way I mentioned above, experiencing anything far beyond the ordinary would add a data point of a different kind, thereby serving as a help to my faith in the claims by others to have seen other miracles, and so on. The launch of the thread was the idea that even a vision of my guardian angel would be a meaningful and helpful step. Even if it came to me in my dreams - though something would have to set it apart from any old dream.

I don’t need to touch the wounds as Thomas did. Just experiencing that there really are guardian angels for each of us would help to support a great many things that are woven into the fabric of our tradition. If it started to lightning and thunder the minute I finished this sentence, it would be moving.

 

[Nita]

I don’t know how to express surprise but not seem snarky. I’m honestly a little boggled to hear someone say this. Maybe I’m misunderstanding your point somehow. ?]

Would Christianity and Catholicism really be the same without Christ’s resurrection? Without transubstantiation? The virgin birth?

You are right about that of course; they are basic beliefs of our Catholic Christian faith.
I didn’t think you were including them in your comment, but rather were referring to all the miracles Jesus performed in His public ministry.

Can we take away the role that Paul played in the early church? Can we get that up and running without his conversion experience on the road to Damascus? No tongues of fire? No raising of Lazarus?

Of course Paul played a role in the early Church. But the Church would have existed even if Paul had not!

That doesn’t even begin to point back to the Old Testament on which the rest is built in fulfilment.

I know. An absolute marvel.

 

[Nita]

Great question. Not sure how to pick one thing as a cornerstone to the others. I have sincere doubts about the whole framework of miracles itself and our interpretation of them. That, in turn, undermines the credibility of claims made by those who also claimed they witnessed miracles (and interpreted them correctly).

In the way I mentioned above, experiencing anything far beyond the ordinary would add a data point of a different kind, thereby serving as a help to my faith in the claims by others to have seen other miracles, and so on. The launch of the thread was the idea that even a vision of my guardian angel would be a meaningful and helpful step. Even if it came to me in my dreams - though something would have to set it apart from any old dream.

I don’t need to touch the wounds as Thomas did. Just experiencing that there really are guardian angels for each of us would help to support a great many things that are woven into the fabric of our tradition. If it started to lightning and thunder the minute I finished this sentence, it would be moving.

Thanks for the reply.
It brings up another question, which you may or may not want to respond to.
Are you driven by a deep desire to know the truth? - or by something more like curiosity?