Why are JWs against higher education?

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Just a note on the education thing…
I was at an assembly once in the Houston Astrodome. Anyone who’s ever been in it knows how huge it is - or was / is it still standing?
Anywho…it was full to the brim with jws. During a “talk”, someone fainted. Over the loudspeaker a call was put out for Dr. ‘so&so’. I’ve forgotten his name now.
It occured to me later that with THOUSANDS of jws in that place, there was one (1!!!) doctor. Only one. And he was a convert.
Almost every practicing “born into it” jw has only a high school education - if that.
If a jw kid wants to quit school to become a pioneer (full time field witness) they are encouaged to do so by both the society and the parents.
Sad isn’t it. 😦
 
When I’d ask the Elder a tough question, he’s go into an anti-Catholic tyrade. I would listen politely before informing him;
  1. I’m not Catholic, and not interested in hearing his beefs with the RCC.
and,
  1. The tyrade had NOTHING to do with the question I asked.
:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
I believe we have a moral [as well as a practical] reason to seek highter education. God has given us the ability to be creative. In my view, that can only really come about through a fertile mind steeped in knowledge and understanding.
 
Remember the Catholic Church in the middle ages when it burned its laity members who obtained a copy of the Bible and became learned. Has the Watchtower organization of the Jehovah’s Witnesses taken on the baton passed on to by the Catholic Church now that the Catholic Church is all powerful and capable of withstanding “intelligent and educated” people among its members?
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From the article posted by geocacher Jehovah’s Witness - Higher Education

:mad:
 
Yessian,

Being married to a JW is tough, I was for 11 years…our marriage didn’t break up because of her being a JW, but because of personality issues, and I actually got her and two of her three sons out…but it’s tough. My sympathies. If nothing else, being married to a JW made me a better Catholic.

How do you handle Holidays, etc?
 
yessisan said:
This is one question I cannot understand. Do they really want their members to be ignorant? Or are they afraid that with more education they’ll find out their religion is not the one true religion? :rolleyes:
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I am a JW and have a university degree so I can speak to this subject. I became one of JW’s while majoring in Physics & Math at my local university.

As any university graduate will tell you, it is a HUGE time commitment at the expense of almost every thing else. Between classes, studying, homework, I spent 14 hours a day of my life devoted to the goal of getting my degree. I endured all this hard work because I had traditional goals of getting a good job and making lots of money.

Having since become a follower of Jesus, I know that by spending 14 hours a day working on a secular education, I was not applying what he asked here:

(Matthew 6:33) “Keep on, then, seeking first the kingdom and his righteousness, and all these [other] things will be added to YOU.

I was not seeking God’s Kingdom first in my life. I was seeking a secular education first. And once I graduated, I ended up with a high paying, high powered job that sucked up 10-12 hours of my day…. Once again, I couldn’t honestly say I was “seeking first the Kingdom”…. I was seeking first secular and financial goals.

The Apostle Paul was a well educated man and yet, he treated this as refuse or garbage in relation to the knowledge of the Christ:

(Philippians 3:4-9) though I, if anyone, do have grounds for confidence also in the flesh. If any other man thinks he has grounds for confidence in the flesh, I the more so: 5 circumcised the eighth day, out of the family stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew [born] from Hebrews; as respects law, a Pharisee; 6 as respects zeal, persecuting the congregation; as respects righteousness that is by means of law, one who proved himself blameless. 7 Yet what things were gains to me, these I have considered loss on account of the Christ. 8 Why, for that matter, I do indeed also consider all things to be loss on account of the excelling value of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord. On account of him I have taken the loss of all things and I consider them as a lot of refuse, that I may gain Christ 9 and be found in union with him, having, not my own righteousness, which results from law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness that issues from God on the basis of faith,

When he learned the truth about Jesus, he spent his time in the field ministry and supported himself as a simple tent maker.

When Paul was counseling young Timothy, do you think he advised him to spend devote most of his waking hours focused on getting a secular education and a high paying job? Or did he encourage him to pursue his ministry?

(2 Timothy 4:5) You, though, keep your senses in all things, suffer evil, do [the] work of an evangelizer, fully accomplish your ministry.

JW’s are not anti-education. They are simply trying to follow Jesus command to “seek God’s Kingdom first”.

Anyone who thinks he is seeking God’s Kingdom first in his life, while devoting 12-14 hours to secular goals is fooling himself. I know I was.

Steve
 
Anyone who thinks he is seeking God’s Kingdom first in his life, while devoting 12-14 hours to secular goals is fooling himself. I know I was.
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This is the problem with many fundamentalist sects like the JWs.

For them, this world is not worth saving. I am glad that God did not feel that way. But the JWs do not even believe that God came down to save us but that he pawned the dirty work off on a mere angelic creature known as Michael the Archangel. (I often ask my JW friends which God loves us more–the JW god who pawned the dirty work to save us off on a mere creature or the Christian God who did the dirty work to save us Himself?)

The JWs teach that the solution to all of man’s problems is that God will someday kill all non-JWs at the Battle of Armageddon. Therefore, what JWs must do (otherwise they will be considered bloodguilty and may die at Armageddon themselves) is go from door to door and assist as many people as possible into their group in the hopes that eventually they will join them in this door to door work.

Because of this, it matters little if people are sick right now (this is why JWs do no operate hospitals), it matters little if people are hungry (this is why JWs do not operate soup kitchens or food pantries), it matters little if people need to be educated to support themselves and contribute to society (this is why the JWs do not operate schools and universities). This is why you will, unfortunately, never see people like Mother Teresa, St. Jane de Chantal, Mother Seton, St. John Bosco, or St. Vincent de Paul come from a group like the JWs.

The great irony of all this is that clearly part of being a follower of Christ includes caring for all of these needs for people (whether the person in need is a Christian or not). (See Matthew 25:35-40 and James 1:27)

The JWs suffer from an either or position. In other words, they believe that if they were to assist people as described above it would mean that they were not or could not be “no part of the world.”

In the Catholic Tradition and the constant Tradition of the Catholic Church we are to take a both/and position. We are to do what we can to care for those less fortunate than ourselves whether they are Christian or not. Jesus says when we take care of those in need we are taking care of Him. We are to care for both their physical and spiritual needs. This is why Catholics (and Protestants) operate hospitals, schools, soup kitchens, food pantries, Universities, in addition to Churches, retreat houses, adoration chapels, and other places for worship and spiritual renewal.

I can also say that I know of individuals who have received a very good university education that now serve society as doctors, lawyers, teachers, businessmen, engineers in addition to those who contribute to society as construction workers, mechanics, janitors, etc. I know of many of these individuals who spent years in training both in their secular trade and their spiritual life who build up the Kingdom of Christ even now.

As Christians we are to do what we can to contribute both to a just society now and look forward and prepare ourselves and others for the time when Christ returns and we are able to live for eternity in the “new heavens and new earth” that He has promised us.

The main reason why the leaders of the JWs discourage (and in the past have tried to forbide) a university education is two-fold:
  1. JWs who attend college tend not to spend as much time in their door to door work recruiting new members for their group.
  2. JWs who do attend college usually leave the group or at least are not as committed to the JWs as they were prior to going to college. (I attribute this to the critical thinking skills that people can develop if they are open to receiving a good liberal arts education which tends to free people from groups like the JWs.)
Jeff S.

www.catholicxjw.com
 
Yessisan posted:
As any university graduate will tell you, it is a HUGE time commitment at the expense of almost every thing else. Between classes, studying, homework, I spent 14 hours a day of my life devoted to the goal of getting my degree.
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So did I, tell me about it
 
The JW discouragement of higher education is a complex matter.
In general, they encourage their young adults to attend trade or technical schools and live with family while in school. This because they generally believe that a University Degree is basically pointless since we are so very close to “Armageddon,” and there is another factor, and in this I sympathize with their viewpoint, namely, that going away to college and living in the dorms or with other students in a house or frat, exposes the youth (and it does actually) to the incredibly increased opportunities for easily-available sexual immorality, alcohol abuse, and other things that are sins against God.
There is much I will criticize about my former religion, but they do have a point about some of their concerns regarding going away to college.

+JMJ+
Jaypeeto4
 
Daniel_Marsh said:
Your spouse is in our prayers for converison.
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Thank you!!

I am praying and praying. I actually started praying the rosary every day and dedicate it to his conversion. Hope one day God’s call to him is strong enough that he’ll hear it.

Sixtus, I didn’t post that, that was Steve. Let me tell you though, that he is a very well educated JW, but he converted after the fact…

Having graduated from college and dedicating more than 16 hrs a wk, I am more than happy to say that I did this, otherwise I wouldn’t be able to understand God the way I do.

College does result in having a highly critical mind. This will help you understand better and make decisions on your own. It sure opened up my mind to both good things and bad things, and now I’m glad to say that the good things stuck around and left the bad things behind!
 
I work for the Criminal Justice System.

My main role is to assess and direct folk with poor communication skills, poor literacy and numeracy towards provider agencies to get the required level of intevention to enable them to equally compete.

Only today, I met a man whose numeracy was so poor that he was on the level of a competent 5-year old. He said he could not take up the offer of free education as his employer would not approve. His employer were the sect known as Plymouth Brethren.

He works in one of their shops. He cannot add up, he cannot work out money, he cannot work out discounts let alone take one sum from another.

It is ironic therefore that an employer would resist educating a man for whom the primary beneficiary of the education is the employer. 😛

They must be losing a fortune, but lose they prefer rather than release their employee to get help with his profoundly poor number skills. It begs belief but that is the real world
 
I work for the Criminal Justice System.

My main role is to assess and direct folk with poor communication skills, poor literacy and numeracy towards provider agencies to get the required level of intevention to enable them to equally compete.

Only today, I met a man whose numeracy was so poor that he was on the level of a competent 5-year old. He said he could not take up the offer of free education as his employer would not approve. His employer were the sect known as Plymouth Brethren.

He works in one of their shops. He cannot add up, he cannot work out money, he cannot work out discounts let alone take one sum from another.

It is ironic therefore that an employer would resist educating a man for whom the primary beneficiary of the education is the employer. 😛

They must be losing a fortune, but lose they prefer rather than release their employee to get help with his profoundly poor number skills. It begs belief but that is the real world
 
I work for the Criminal Justice System.

My main role is to assess and direct folk with poor communication skills, poor literacy and numeracy towards provider agencies to get the required level of intevention to enable them to equally compete.

Only today, I met a man whose numeracy was so poor that he was on the level of a competent 5-year old. He said he could not take up the offer of free education as his employer would not approve. His employer were the sect known as Plymouth Brethren.

He works in one of their shops. He cannot add up, he cannot work out money, he cannot work out discounts let alone take one sum from another.

It is ironic therefore that an employer would resist educating a man for whom the primary beneficiary of the education is the employer. 😛

They must be losing a fortune, but lose they prefer rather than release their employee to get help with his profoundly poor number skills. It begs belief but that is the real world :mad: :confused:
 
I work for the Criminal Justice System.

My main role is to assess and direct folk with poor communication skills, poor literacy and numeracy towards provider agencies to get the required level of intevention to enable them to equally compete.

Only today, I met a man whose numeracy was so poor that he was on the level of a competent 5-year old. He said he could not take up the offer of free education as his employer would not approve. His employer were the sect known as Plymouth Brethren.

He works in one of their shops. He cannot add up, he cannot work out money, he cannot work out discounts let alone take one sum from another.

It is ironic therefore that an employer would resist educating a man for whom the primary beneficiary of the education is the employer. 😛

They must be losing a fortune, but lose they prefer rather than release their employee to get help with his profoundly poor number skills. It begs belief but that is the real world :mad: :confused:
 
Please let me clarify my post above.
I am NOT against Higher Education, and I think the JWs extreme discouragement of college is also not warranted and counterproductive.

I only meant to state that I understand the particular concern parents may have about their kids living in dorms or frat houses where immorality (i.e. mortal sin) is rampant.

I lived on campus at USF in Tampa in the late 1970s.
Fornication, drunkenness, and even acts of homosexuality were the norm for on-campus living. Across the street from the campus was Fontana Hall, a semi-private dormitory for people who wanted to live in a more-pampered dorm setting. We called it Orgy Hall. The name was well deserved.
And today the dorms are co-ed, which makes things even more dangerous morally.

I would recommend sending your kids to a GOOD Catholic College like Steubenville, save up for it years in advance, and get your kid (if you can) an apartment OFF campus where the moral danger is somewhat less.

In the end though, a college degree is well worth it, and people CAN serve God full-time while working towards a degree. I didn’t understand that when I was younger in my JW days. And I don’t have the time or finances to finish my degree now, I wish I did.
I would love to get a Degree in religion/theology and a catechetical certificate from the Catholic Distance University online, but in my situation this is impossible. (though I have been praying asking the Lord to make it possible if it is His Holy Will.)

God bless,
Jaypeeto4
 
You are right Jaypeeto,

College is full of sin and it is temptfull. I studied human sexuality and psychology and in those human sexuality classes, I was “taught” that sex changes, homosexuality, and contraception were right. I was “taught” that having multiple partners is not wrong as long as we played it safe.

In fact, we even had a “condom” project in which we had to use condoms to build a model of something giving a message of safe sex. Little did I know all this was against our faith…

I was also “taught” how-to’s of sodomy… we were “taught” to respect the work of escorts, prostitutes & porn stars. As informative as they can be in the educational sense (I was also taught the anatomy and other sicentific facts about humans, reproduction, etc), they can be destructive in the spiritual way.

So, yes, college can be a bad influence just as I mentioned above but I don’t think that a Catholic University would be different. I’m taking an NFP course w/a Catholic doctor and he said that they are taught and expected to prescribe the pill to respect other people’s beliefs… just the fact that information is easily available in college is what is worrisome.

So in that sense, maybe I do agree with the JWs, but then, as a Catholic, I agree to higher education regardless of the temptations. If you are well catechized, these things shouldn’t be a bump on the road.
 
I believe it is a far more accurate statement to say that Jehovah’s Witnesses recommend their members count the cost of any secular activity that demands massive amounts of time and immerses them in an environment of bad association.

Jehovah’s Witnesses main focus in life is to study the Bible and to help others learn about God’s kingdom. Any secular activity that demands 8, 10, 12, 14 hours per day and immerses a Christian in an environment of people who disregard God’s rules on immorality and drunken excess would be avoided.

One writer suggested that in order to get ahead in life a person would need a Bachelors degree. Like anything, there are advantages that come with a degree. However some of the world’s most rich people were not college graduates. For example, Bill Gates, Michael Dell, Walt Disney, Tony Robbins, and many others.

Although having a college degree will open some doors, a degree is not the be-all, end-all guarantee of success. In fact, many college graduates are never employed in the area of their studies.

I know from experience that much of what I learned at the University was completely useless in building my career.

I am very pro-education, but I don’t believe that a university education is a guarantee of success.

Steve
 
Hi BibleSteve,
this is not meant as a put down to you personally, especially because you seem very devout and refreshingly polite.

I was baptized at 21, but had been in JW bible studies since I was a child (forced to attend by my dad. I didn’t mind spending an hour a week at a six-month bible study, but my dad would go off on verbal tangeants and even drive the JW brother or sister conducting the study almost to drink, making a one hour study last three or four hours.) I also attended Kingdom Hall off and on for many years growing up, and then zealously so after I was convinced in 1980/81 that I ought to be a JW.

Steve, in all honesty, in all those years, we did not really
study THE BIBLE itself. We studied a series of 192 page Watchtower books (The “Truth” book was the most popular back then, but we also studied many others). During the home bible study, we’d study a small book and look up scripture quotes. During the Tuesday night congregation study, we would study a somewhat larger book, and look up bible quotes in the text (back then the study books were hardbound, all of them, by the way).
During the Sunday Watchtower study, we would study the watchtower article, having read and underlined the answers beforehand, and we’d comment, giving the underlined answer along with some of our own thoughts. But we never sat down with the Bible and read it in context. And while the Society would occasionally encourage us to read our bibles, it went without saying that if we began to see things differently than the Society’s stated beliefs, we were to refer to Watchtower materials and trust The Society and not our understanding.

What we all were doing Steve, was not really Bible Study in the strict sense, but an endless continuous study of the Society
“Catechism” or catechetical materials (the books, the magazines, the public talk, the weekly book study, the Watchtower Study on Sunday, reading the daily text from the Yearbook), etc. In other words, we studied Society publications and would look up the bible QUOTED VERSES supplied in the text of the publication, but that was about it.

I know you can’t begin to understand this, Steve, but when I ( and many other exJWs on this forum ) began to read the Bible by itself without consulting Watchtower study aids, we began rather quickly to notice that the basic doctrines of “Christendom” really ARE supported by the Scriptures and the basic doctrines of the Watchtower Society really are NOT. Once we saw THAT, there was no way we could ever remain with the Society and at the same time be intellectually honest and sincere.

This is not meant to be condescending to you, nor is it a put down, but I strongly hope that you will read the Holy Scriptures by themselves. Get a translation that has the Divine Name in it, if it makes you feel better, like the American Standard Version of 1901 or the Jerusalem Bible or the New Jerusalem Bible.
Steve, seriously, you WILL be very surprised at what you discover.
God bless,
Jaypeeto4
 
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