Why are non-Catholics sometimes allowed to receive communion?

[Engineer4God]

I know and accept the Church’s teaching that, under limited grave circumstances and permission from the bishop, a non-Catholic (ie protestant) may be allowed to receive holy communion if he believes in the true presence. I do not, however, understand why and how the Church can allow this. Why wouldn’t he, instead, be required to first express his desire to become Catholic? I have a sedevacantist friend who is objecting to this provision of Vatican II. How should I answer her objection?

 

[Gorgias]

I I do not, however, understand why and how the Church can allow this. Why wouldn’t he, instead, be required to first express his desire to become Catholic?

“Hi. You’re a Catholic, right? I think that I believe what you believe about the Eucharist. I’m in danger of death. But, I was wondering whether you knew how I could join your parish’s RCIA program, so that I could enter into the Church next Easter. I mean, I might be dead by then and all, but it’d be more important to go through the process than to receive Our Lord in the Eucharist before I die, right?”

I have a sedevacantist friend who is objecting to this provision of Vatican II. How should I answer her objection?

Remind her that it’s not a “provision of Vatican II.” (Rather, it’s part of the 1983 Code of Canon Law.) Then ask her if she’s read Matthew 9:

many tax collectors and sinners came and sat with Jesus and his disciples.

The Pharisees saw this and said to his disciples, “Why does your teacher* eat with tax collectors and sinners?”

He heard this and said, “Those who are well do not need a physician, but the sick do.*

Go and learn the meaning of the words, ‘I desire mercy, not sacrifice.’* I did not come to call the righteous but sinners.”

 

[Don_Ruggero]

I know and accept the Church’s teaching that, under limited grave circumstances and permission from the bishop, a non-Catholic (ie protestant) may be allowed to receive holy communion if he believes in the true presence. I do not, however, understand why and how the Church can allow this. Why wouldn’t he, instead, be required to first express his desire to become Catholic? I have a sedevacantist friend who is objecting to this provision of Vatican II. How should I answer her objection?

First, why do you use “i.e.”? You do know that not all non-Catholics are Protestants? In fact, this provision primarily applies to non-Catholics who are not Protestant in any way, shape or form.

Second, the practice predates the Second Vatican Council.

Third, the explanation of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops forms an excellent foundation…

We welcome our fellow Christians to this celebration of the Eucharist as our brothers and sisters. We pray that our common baptism and the action of the Holy Spirit in this Eucharist will draw us closer to one another and begin to dispel the sad divisions which separate us. We pray that these will lessen and finally disappear, in keeping with Christ’s prayer for us “that they may all be one” (Jn 17:21).

Because Catholics believe that the celebration of the Eucharist is a sign of the reality of the oneness of faith, life, and worship, members of those churches with whom we are not yet fully united are ordinarily not admitted to Holy Communion. Eucharistic sharing in exceptional circumstances by other Christians requires permission according to the directives of the diocesan bishop and the provisions of canon law (canon 844 §4). Members of the Orthodox Churches, the Assyrian Church of the East, and the Polish National Catholic Church are urged to respect the discipline of their own Churches. According to Roman Catholic discipline, the Code of Canon Law does not object to the reception of Communion by Christians of these Churches (canon 844 §3).

One would add that the latter Churches, listed at the end, have sacraments that are valid. The discipline by which these Christians may receive the sacraments from a Catholic minister is an expression of the reality of an ecclesiological truth, just as when I am with a priest of these Churches, I am with a brother priest who shares the ontological character I myself received in Ordination…when I am with a bishop of these Churches, I am in the presence of a Successor to the Apostles.

 

[Eric_Hyom]

Jesus said, take this all of you and eat of it, and Judas was amongst them.

 

[Rosebud77]

I know and accept the Church’s teaching that, under limited grave circumstances and permission from the bishop, a non-Catholic (ie protestant) may be allowed to receive holy communion if he believes in the true presence. I do not, however, understand why and how the Church can allow this. Why wouldn’t he, instead, be required to first express his desire to become Catholic? I have a sedevacantist friend who is objecting to this provision of Vatican II. How should I answer her objection?

As I have posted before, when I came to Mayo, rural Ireland, as an Anglican, I was welcomed at mass and for communion in every church I attended. With the full knowledge and welcome/ permission of every priest and monastic priest. Especially the Franciscans.

I did not have to ask or answer questions.

 

[DignumEtJustum]

I know and accept the Church’s teaching that, under limited grave circumstances and permission from the bishop, a non-Catholic (ie protestant) may be allowed to receive holy communion if he believes in the true presence. I do not, however, understand why and how the Church can allow this. Why wouldn’t he, instead, be required to first express his desire to become Catholic? I have a sedevacantist friend who is objecting to this provision of Vatican II. How should I answer her objection?

I’m not sure what you’re talking about. Even a Catholic in a state of mortal sin can’t receive so how could a non-Catholic in any circumstance? If you’ve been told something different, it is not in line with Catholic teaching or practice and anything said by the priest who said otherwise needs to be taken with a grain of salt in future.

?
Other christian churches besides catholic also have communion. You don’t need to be catholic to take communion.

.

And they don’t even believe their “communion” is anything more than bread which us Catholics agree with them on. Our priests, on the other hand, consecrate bread and wine into the body, blood, soul, and divinity of Jesus Christ just as He did at his Last Supper and anyone in disagreeance with this truth, non-Catholics, and Catholics in a state of mortal sin (ie. needing a trip to confession) indeed CANNOT receive communion at a Catholic Mass. I’ve never understood your presence on these forums as you contribute nothing to to further the mission of the Church. If you must make a response, at least make one that is truthful (though that must be impossible for a follower of Jediism).

 

[DignumEtJustum]

I know and accept the Church’s teaching that, under limited grave circumstances and permission from the bishop, a non-Catholic (ie protestant) may be allowed to receive holy communion if he believes in the true presence. I do not, however, understand why and how the Church can allow this. Why wouldn’t he, instead, be required to first express his desire to become Catholic? I have a sedevacantist friend who is objecting to this provision of Vatican II. How should I answer her objection?

I’m not sure what you’re talking about. Perhaps there are some rare exceptions and rules that may even be abused in this area. Generally speaking though, even a Catholic in a state of mortal sin can’t receive so how could a non-Catholic in any circumstance? If you’ve been told something different, I do not believe it is line with Catholic teaching or practice and anything said by the priest who said otherwise should be taken with a grain of salt in future.

?
Other christian churches besides catholic also have communion. You don’t need to be catholic to take communion.

.

And they don’t even believe their “communion” is anything more than bread which us Catholics agree with them on. Our priests, on the other hand, consecrate bread and wine into the body, blood, soul, and divinity of Jesus Christ just as He did at his Last Supper and anyone in disagreeance with this truth, non-Catholics, and Catholics in a state of mortal sin (ie. needing a trip to confession) indeed CANNOT receive communion at a Catholic Mass.

As I have posted before, when I came to Mayo, rural Ireland, as an Anglican, I was welcomed at mass and for communion in every church I attended. With the full knowledge and welcome/ permission of every priest and monastic priest. Especially the Franciscans.

I did not have to ask or answer questions.

That is not particularly surprising given the state of the Church today in Ireland.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

The priest at our wedding gave Communion to my Presbyterian husband. He knew my husband was Presbyterian as he had been doing the pre-wedding counseling for us. He was an older priest who was very smart (had a PhD) and very stern and holy. I think he may have asked my husband something like “do you believe in the presence of God” earlier in the counseling or that day and husband said “yes” but we didn’t know he was going to be offered communion.

Everybody there including my husband was surprised but we figured it was just something that was allowed at weddings, as our priest was the type who would have checked, or gotten permission, or done whatever was necessary for it to be correct. This was back in the early 90s.

 

[DeniseNY]

First, why do you use “i.e.”? You do know that not all non-Catholics are Protestants? In fact, this provision primarily applies to non-Catholics who are not Protestant in any way, shape or form.

Second, the practice predates the Second Vatican Council.

Third, the explanation of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops forms an excellent foundation…

One would add that the latter Churches, listed at the end, have sacraments that are valid. The discipline by which these Christians may receive the sacraments from a Catholic minister is an expression of the reality of an ecclesiological truth, just as when I am with a priest of these Churches, I am with a brother priest who shares the ontological character I myself received in Ordination…when I am with a bishop of these Churches, I am in the presence of a Successor to the Apostles.

Thank you, Father.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

Jesus said, take this all of you and eat of it, and Judas was amongst them.

Protestants who have the level of belief to want to receive Catholic Communion are hardly “Judas”. Just stop already.

 

[Eric_Hyom]

Protestants who have the level of belief to want to receive Catholic Communion are hardly “Judas”. Just stop already.

I think you may have missed my point. In no way am I comparing non Catholics to Judas. Jesus did not refuse Judas, so who are we to refuse anyone?

 

[Rosebud77]

Protestants who have the level of belief to want to receive Catholic Communion are hardly “Judas”. Just stop already.

Thank you

 

[Rosebud77]

Originally Posted by Rosebud77 View Post
As I have posted before, when I came to Mayo, rural Ireland, as an Anglican, I was welcomed at mass and for communion in every church I attended. With the full knowledge and welcome/ permission of every priest and monastic priest. Especially the Franciscans.

I did not have to ask or answer questions.

That is not particularly surprising given the state of the Church today in Ireland.

Padre Pio often knowingly gave non-Catholics and in one case an atheist communion . There are times. And discernment.

Often the Rule of Rule needs to cede to the Rule of Love.

 

[randirhoades]

In all my Catechism teachings since childhood, (I’m 62) I’ve never heard that non Catholics may partake of the Holy Eucharist. I also remember a news article that Obama had gone to a Catholic Mass and partook of Holy Communion. I also read there was an uproar about it.

Protestants do not believe that the Eucharist is the Body and Blood of Christ and I know my Protestant friends shun the idea.

I am homebound and receive Communion in my home. My Non Catholic Caregivers go somewhere else when the Catholic Ministers arrive at my house.

If Non Catholics can receive our communion, I’d be glad to listen.

 

[Tis_Bearself]

I think you may have missed my point. In no way am I comparing non Catholics to Judas. Jesus did not refuse Judas, so who are we to refuse anyone?

OK, if that’s what you meant. It sounded like a slag on Protestants who receive.

The Church does end up refusing some people though if they do not meet the criteria established…still, they may be good people even if we cannot invite them to Holy Communion.

 

[MtnDwellar]

Originally Posted by Rosebud77 View Post
As I have posted before, when I came to Mayo, rural Ireland, as an Anglican, I was welcomed at mass and for communion in every church I attended. With the full knowledge and welcome/ permission of every priest and monastic priest. Especially the Franciscans.

I did not have to ask or answer questions.

That is not particularly surprising given the state of the Church today in Ireland.

Padre Pio often knowingly gave non-Catholics and in one case an atheist communion . There are times. And discernment.

Often the Rule of Rule needs to cede to the Rule of Love.

I have never read that Padre Pio knowingly gave communion to non-Catholics and also an atheist. What were the circumstances? Can you provide a reference?

Denying Communion is an act of love. Those who eat the body of Christ and drink His blood, eat and drink judgment upon themselves.

 

[MtnDwellar]

I have never read that Padre Pio knowingly gave communion to non-Catholics and also an atheist. What were the circumstances? Can you provide a reference?

Denying Communion is an act of love. Those who eat the body of Christ and drink His blood, eat and drink judgment upon themselves.

Oooops

I meant to write: Those who eat the body of Christ and drink His blood unworthily, eat and drink judgment upon themselves

 

[Engineer4God]

First, why do you use “i.e.”? You do know that not all non-Catholics are Protestants? In fact, this provision primarily applies to non-Catholics who are not Protestant in any way, shape or form.

Second, the practice predates the Second Vatican Council.

Third, the explanation of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops forms an excellent foundation…

One would add that the latter Churches, listed at the end, have sacraments that are valid. The discipline by which these Christians may receive the sacraments from a Catholic minister is an expression of the reality of an ecclesiological truth, just as when I am with a priest of these Churches, I am with a brother priest who shares the ontological character I myself received in Ordination…when I am with a bishop of these Churches, I am in the presence of a Successor to the Apostles.

"§3. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick licitly to members of Eastern Churches which do not have full communion with the Catholic Church if they seek such on their own accord and are properly disposed. This is also valid for members of other Churches which in the judgment of the Apostolic See are in the same condition in regard to the sacraments as these Eastern Churches.

§4. If the danger of death is present or if, in the judgment of the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops, some other grave necessity urges it, Catholic ministers administer these same sacraments licitly also to other Christians not having full communion with the Catholic Church, who cannot approach a minister of their own community and who seek such on their own accord, provided that they manifest Catholic faith in respect to these sacraments and are properly disposed."

The clause you’re referring to is §3 which deals with those who are not protestant.
It appears that §4 deals with protestants. My question is mainly in regard to protestants which is why I said “ie” to differentiate from Eastern Churches. I know priests are not allowed to decide to let any non-Catholic receive communion without the bishop’s permission so I know there are a lot of abuses when it comes to non-catholics going to Catholic weddings and such.

But back to my question- is the practice mentioned in §4 also to be found in the old 1917 code of cannon law? But what I don’t get is why the person isn’t required to desire to become fully Catholic. Why wouldn’t giving communion to them when they simultaneously reject the Catholic faith in all other matters, make them think it’s okay for them to have their cake and eat it too? And I will state again as a reminder that I’m not rejecting this teaching- I’m just asking why it is so.

Also, my Sedevacantist friend claims that JPII once gave communion to a Zen Budhist. I’m not sure if this is actually true but if he did, I’m sure it must have been in accord to §4 right? It seems so absurd to think anyone would think of St. JP the Great as being a heretic

 

[Rosebud77]

Ҥ3.
ey manifest Catholic faith in respect to these sacraments and are properly disposed.”

The clause you’re referring to is §3 which deals with those who are not protestant.
It appears that §4 deals with protestants. My question is mainly in regard to protestants which is why I said “ie” to differentiate from Eastern Churches. I know priests are not allowed to decide to let any non-Catholic receive communion without the bishop’s permission so I know there are a lot of abuses when it comes to non-catholics going to Catholic weddings and such.

But back to my question- is the practice mentioned in §4 also to be found in the old 1917 code of cannon law? But what I don’t get is why the person isn’t required to desire to become fully Catholic. Why wouldn’t giving communion to them when they simultaneously reject the Catholic faith in all other matters, make them think it’s okay for them to have their cake and eat it too? And I will state again as a reminder that I’m not rejecting this teaching- I’m just asking why it is so.

Also, my Sedevacantist friend claims that JPII once gave communion to a Zen Budhist. I’m not sure if this is actually true but if he did, I’m sure it must have been in accord to §4 right? It seems so absurd to think anyone would think of St. JP the Great as being a heretic

If you will excuse my saying so that is a terrible comparison to make. Made me wince. As does the thinking behind it.

So why do you think Padre Pio often gave communion to those he knew were not Catholic? And to an atheist?

Can you not see this? The value and validity of it?

Oh and Pope John Paul 2 also gave Br Roger, the Lutheran non-ordained founder of Taize, communion; he singled him out to come forward before everyone else

I was at the time I came here to Ireland a hermit in the Anglican tradtiion and this was honoured and blessed by the Parish Priest where I first lived and then by other priests. He was an older man. home from the missions after a life dealing with great need and poverty. It had taught him grace and compassion.

I met one of the Bishops too and he was kindness and welcome personified

 

[Engineer4God]

If you will excuse my saying so that is a terrible comparison to make. Made me wince. As does the thinking behind it.

So why do you think Padre Pio often gave communion to those he knew were not Catholic? And to an atheist?

Can you not see this? The value and validity of it?

Oh and Pope John Paul 2 also gave Br Roger, the Lutheran non-ordained founder of Taize, communion; he singled him out to come forward before everyone else

I was at the time I came here to Ireland a hermit in the Anglican tradtiion and this was honoured and blessed by the Parish Priest where I first lived and then by other priests. He was an older man. home from the missions after a life dealing with great need and poverty. It had taught him grace and compassion.

I met one of the Bishops too and he was kindness and welcome personified

Oh sorry, I didn’t see your post until now. As far as comparisons go, I don’t know what comparison you’re referring to because I did not intend to make any. I’m thoroughly confused what you mean by this

Your examples sound good and I never claimed to deny them. Examples are all well and good, but my question doesn’t really focus on examples. All I’m trying to find out is what the Church teaches and why. I honestly mean no rudeness by this at all. I just don’t get it. I’m just confused- that’s all.