Why are the New Age movement and other exotic ideas so attractive?

[ronin67]

I have to agree with some of the other posts. Nothing “New Age” about divination, necromancy, and the desire for humans to desire powers that our Father has clearly stated we must avoid. Extending yourself in this world, opens yourself up for all types of spirit influence (none good). I have seen quite a bit when I was in the military and now as a civilian serving in the military. Wicca seems to be the big thing. It is the whole idea that you can wield some special power outside normal human dimensions. I had a young lady who was in my platoon, when I was a platoon sergeant, who was big into Wicca. In fact she came from a very evangelical Christian background (or so she told me). She often told me that she would see spirits and was able to communicate with them. She had a very dead look in her eyes (always). It is a dangerous place these people but themselves in. The worst thing you can do is to talk to them like you are correcting a child and that you are from any position of superiority. With the compassion of Christ, you have to break it down for them (this is where a Catholic with good biblical knowledge is important) as to why this is dangerous and how dabbling in the occult can take you out of the grace of our Father’s protection. Please trend carefully my friend and show compassion towards her. See what your parish priest can do to help. I started reading the book “The Rite” and many of the cases of possession deal with people who dabbled in the occult. This is not to scare you my friend, just my concern for you and her. May God bless you and deliver her.

Ed

 

[AntiTheist]

Just because something is a value, it does not mean it is not a fact.

Actually, that’s exactly what it means. Values are preferences made by individuals, not facts about the world that can be verified. Take, for example, the following claims:

1. There is a peanut butter and jelly sandwich on the table.
2. Peanut butter and jelly sandwiches taste good.

The first of these claims is a fact; the second is a value or preference, and even if that value is held by the vast majority of people, it doesn’t make it any less of a preference.

Really, when people talk about “a priori knowldge,” they’re talking about things like axioms, definitions, logical absolutes, and a host of other things that don’t fall into the category of what we’re talking about on this thread and don’t really count as knowledge in the sense that I’m talking about here.

God is not something that can be proved by observation, but is made necessary becuse of the nature of existence, as St. Thomas articulates in the Summa

No. Playing word games doesn’t make a being so, any more than the ontological argument can define beings into existence. Beings that exist independently of people’s minds need to be demonstrated through evidence. They don’t necessarily need to be directly observed, but they need to manifest in some way that is measurable and distinguishable from nothing.

 

[GEddie]

It’s probably time to shut this thread down, given it has become a tug-of-war between atheism and theism, rather than a discussion of the ‘new age.’

Why do you atheists try so hard to convert everybody?? You’d think your beliefs were a religion or something of that sort.

Sayonara, God Bless, and ICXC NIKA.

 

[StTommyMore]

Actually, that’s exactly what it means. Values are preferences made by individuals, not facts about the world that can be verified. Take, for example, the following claims:

1. There is a peanut butter and jelly sandwich on the table.
2. Peanut butter and jelly sandwiches taste good.

The first of these claims is a fact; the second is a value or preference, and even if that value is held by the vast majority of people, it doesn’t make it any less of a preference.

Really, when people talk about “a priori knowldge,” they’re talking about things like axioms, definitions, logical absolutes, and a host of other things that don’t fall into the category of what we’re talking about on this thread and don’t really count as knowledge in the sense that I’m talking about here.

No. Playing word games doesn’t make a being so, any more than the ontological argument can define beings into existence. Beings that exist independently of people’s minds need to be demonstrated through evidence. They don’t necessarily need to be directly observed, but they need to manifest in some way that is measurable and distinguishable from nothing.

What is your evidence for this assertion? If everything requires evidence, this includes your own assumption.

 

[TEPO]

It’s probably time to shut this thread down, given it has become a tug-of-war between atheism and theism, rather than a discussion of the ‘new age.’

Why do you atheists try so hard to convert everybody?? You’d think your beliefs were a religion or something of that sort.

Sayonara, God Bless, and ICXC NIKA.

Because we keep giving them attention. I know that debate can be fun, but sometimes it’s just a waste of time and energy.

 

[Samuel63]

It is time to move on.

I am gratified in this age we can witness the followers of Christ confronting the pagan world and winning. Our ancestors that were sent to the Roman Coliseum are probably sitting in the bleachers in heaven cheering and doing the wave - the heavenly wave.

We have the logic, history, and philosophy/theology on our side. This is great!

These are certainly good times. Lets keep on fighting the good fight.

Happy Easter to all.

 

[fluffalope]

I think we should remember that many so-called “new age” practices and beliefs are ancient and older that Catholicism.

 

[StTommyMore]

I think we should remember that many so-called “new age” practices and beliefs are ancient and older that Catholicism.

Not really. They are modernized versions of romanticized ideals of religions that died long ago. A prime example of this are so-called “druids” which in the modern incarnation, are disaffected tree-huggers.

 

[Tyuiop411]

Not really. They are modernized versions of romanticized ideals of religions that died long ago. A prime example of this are so-called “druids” which in the modern incarnation, are disaffected tree-huggers.

I think the only European pagan religion that can claim to actually be a true reconstruction of the old pagan religion is Norse Paganism; since Norse Paganism died out rather late and they actually wrote most of their beliefs and practices down in the Eddas. Druidism is much more suspect since they wrote absolutely nothing down and we know very little about them from archaeology.

 

[fluffalope]

Not really. They are modernized versions of romanticized ideals of religions that died long ago. A prime example of this are so-called “druids” which in the modern incarnation, are disaffected tree-huggers.

Hinduism is not long gone. Buddhism is not long gone.

 

[StTommyMore]

Hinduism is not long gone. Buddhism is not long gone.

Neither are they truly “Pagan”. They are distinct.

 

[Anna_Scott]

Not sure if this is the correct forum, but here we go. The question I’m posing has really struck me for some time. I’ve wondered why all of these crazy ideas proposed by New Age “leaders” (for lack of a better word) and their followers are so attractive to people. I guess it’s true that in a way this reveals a great hunger in people for Truth and their purpose in life.

The last item that I emphasized here is truly affecting my sister. She’s been driving herself further and further away from the teachings of the Catholic faith and immersing herself into these New Age ideas. I guess I’m not even sure how deeply she is into this but I know that she’s always wondering about what her purpose is, that she is trying to find her “inner self”, and other stuff like that. She claims of having premonitions, visions, hauntings by demonic beings in her dreams, having a past life, belief in reincarnation, etc. etc.

I’ve been praying for her, but this is quite frustrating as she no longer has the desire to attend Mass. I don’t know what happened to cause her and her husband to no longer attend. Long story, but I thought I could start this discussion by asking the question I posed in this thread’s title.

spiritualwrrior,
I’m so sorry to hear this is happening with your sister. The New Age Movement is strong—we are seeing a modern resurgence of paganism. It seems that “spirituality” goes in and out of fashion along with shoes and designer clothes; and Hollywood stars make things like reincarnation look attractive. The Dalai Lama is more popular than a rock star.

I’m shocked by the number of Christians who have statues of Buddha in their gardens and use Feng shui to design their homes.

This is spiritual warfare spilling out into the open.

Anna

 

[Sufjon]

spiritualwrrior,

This is spiritual warfare spilling out into the open.

Anna

Who in your estimation are you having spiritual warfare with?

Your friend,
Sufjon

 

[praxising]

The last item that I emphasized here is truly affecting my sister. She’s been driving herself further and further away from the teachings of the Catholic faith and immersing herself into these New Age ideas. I guess I’m not even sure how deeply she is into this but I know that she’s always wondering about what her purpose is, that she is trying to find her “inner self”, and other stuff like that. She claims of having premonitions, visions, hauntings by demonic beings in her dreams, having a past life, belief in reincarnation, etc. etc. .

I wonder if your sister is having premonitions or visions or dreams of demonic beings? I wonder if she found New Age people or websites attractive because she found someone to listen to her, take her seriously, and not roll their eyes or just tell her to go to Church or pronounce their judgment of her experience.

In your case, I suggest more and more respectful contact with your sister. Take her to lunch, apologize for not being a very good listener, ask her what’s been happening for her and then, really listen. And ask questions. Not argumentative ones, real ones that help her define her own experience. Outside of what someone else said, what does she think it means? Where does she think it’s coming from? More talk, close contact, keep her in touch with and trusting you, as a person of faith.

This way, if and when she decides to look for an answer in the Church or change her mind, she’ll have a conduit, someone to come to and not be embarrassed to give up her previous positions. Just listen without judgment. Your response to “do you believe me?” is, “Well, I can’t get inside your head and know what happened, but I don’t think you’d lie to me. I can’t say I really understand it, but I’m glad you told me about this.”

 

[TheAtheist]

Who in your estimation are you having spiritual warfare with?

Your friend,
Sufjon

An interesting question.

On this issue, i’m often surprised by the almost lack of unity amongst Catholics upon defining what gets “dumped” into the category of “New Age.”

Anna’s statement alone:

Hollywood stars make things like reincarnation look attractive. The Dalai Lama is more popular than a rock star.

I’m shocked by the number of Christians who have statues of Buddha in their gardens and use Feng shui to design their homes.

Such a statement of “alarm” is a very Western-centric viewpoint in the sense that I can fly to China/Korea/Japan and inquire amongst Catholics living in those areas if they feel under threat or pressure from any “New Age” groups - the answer has been a resounding “no.”

Because the traditional Buddhist, Hindu, and Daoist institutions in those areas bear little resemblance to New Age groups in the West.

In my own estimate, New Age groups are the watered-down versions of those 3 religions plus Kabbalistic mysticism - smashed/mushed together by the interpreter in whatever way deemed appropriate. A common underlying thread I’ve always seen is the complete removal of anything deemed “hard” which runs along the lines of:

*Strict moral/ethical discipline training (esp. true for Budhism)

*Age/Gender restrictions (this is esp. true for Kabbalah)

I can (and have) take the concise versions of these “Hollywood Spiritualities” and walk them back to the point of origin to ask the serious practitioners if they do the same thing.

More often than not i’m greeted by something that looks like this ----> .

What concerns me as a person sitting on the sidelines of the great religious intramural is that at least from this end of the spectrum, it seems there’s a kind of lack of discernment amongst the Catholic laity that those in the Vatican possess.

Its all well and good that despite controversial statements, the current reigning pontiff can make such distinctions between an “auto-erotic spirituality” practiced by Westerners who have expropriated Buddhism (in this particular example) for their own ends vs. trad. practitioners back in Asia.

But it is of little comfort of course, that 1 man might know such a difference and the rest of the flock does not. Esp. if that flock is angry…

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

I’m shocked by the number of Christians who have statues of Buddha in their gardens and use Feng shui to design their homes.

This is spiritual warfare spilling out into the open.

Er, not to be nitpicky, but I wouldn’t put the two in the same boat.
I find Feng Shui naturally stupid. I personally arrange my things purely based on what seems most convenient and not on some obscure Chinese spirituality.

On the other hand, having a statue of Buddha in your home does not necessarily mean you are a Buddhist. Otherwise, the Vatican might be guilty of paganism as it houses plenty of statues of Greek and Roman gods.

 

[praxising]

I find Feng Shui naturally stupid. I personally arrange my things purely based on what seems most convenient and not on some obscure Chinese spirituality.

Feng Shui is great and you don’t have to deal with “obscure spirituality.” You may not believe in the principles or apparently know them, but I find that when I apply it, it works quite well. I really don’t care why it works as long as it does. And I’ve always wanted a little laughing Buddha for my desktop. Makes me smile when I see one. He wasn’t a pagan god, you know, why not a bit of Buddha to brighten your day? I bet you wouldn’t refuse to get a Valentine’s card just because it had a Cupid on it and he was a pagan god. Or godlet. .

 

[Denise1957]

Not sure if this is the correct forum, but here we go. The question I’m posing has really struck me for some time. I’ve wondered why all of these crazy ideas proposed by New Age “leaders” (for lack of a better word) and their followers are so attractive to people. I guess it’s true that in a way this reveals a great hunger in people for Truth and their purpose in life.

The last item that I emphasized here is truly affecting my sister. She’s been driving herself further and further away from the teachings of the Catholic faith and immersing herself into these New Age ideas. I guess I’m not even sure how deeply she is into this but I know that she’s always wondering about what her purpose is, that she is trying to find her “inner self”, and other stuff like that. She claims of having premonitions, visions, hauntings by demonic beings in her dreams, having a past life, belief in reincarnation, etc. etc.

I’ve been praying for her, but this is quite frustrating as she no longer has the desire to attend Mass. I don’t know what happened to cause her and her husband to no longer attend. Long story, but I thought I could start this discussion by asking the question I posed in this thread’s title.

It’s really good that you are praying for your sister. It’s disturbing that she’s having problems with premonitions, visions, etc. I would recommend that you read a book called: Ransomed From Darkness: The New Age, Christian Faith, and the Battle for Souls, by Moira Noonan. As she is a former New Ager who experienced some of the same problems as your sister before her conversion to Catholicism, the book may serve to put the situation into perspective. I would caution, however, that while her assessment of the New Age is with good, Ms. Noonan also supports the Medjugorje movement, which is, IMO, highly problematic. However, her other insights still make it a good source. Here’s a link that describes the book:

newoxfordreview.org/briefly.jsp?did=0309-briefly

I was a New-Ager myself many years ago. I have sympathy for those who are still caught up in this deception. Most of them are sincerely looking for truth…but in the wrong places. We humans have an inborn need to seek out the spiritual, but we need, also, to seek out that which will deal with our fallen human nature, which only Catholicism addresses properly.

 

[CHRISTINE77]

I think someone may have already said this, but New Age adherents are really looking for secret knowledge, like the Gnostics. For example, Astrology claims to hold the keys to understanding people’s characteristics and even what will happen to them because of the way the stars were aligned at their birth. People who use crystals are believing that the crystals have certain powers, and I suppose this applies to Wiccans and thier “spells”.

It’s a way to think one is imbued with special powers and knowledge and can influence things by using them. It implyies that one has Godlike powers.

When a person realizes that only God has the ulitmate power, and that we are in his hands,I don’t think that he/she no longer feels the need for New Age “powers” and “spirtuality”.

And I do think some forms of the “New Age” spirituality is an invitation to Satan.

 

[Lost_Wanderer]

Feng Shui is great and you don’t have to deal with “obscure spirituality.” You may not believe in the principles or apparently know them, but I find that when I apply it, it works quite well. I really don’t care why it works as long as it does.

Apparently I don’t know much, just New Age stuff I see being marketed. I’ve just never seen much science behind it you know?

And I’ve always wanted a little laughing Buddha for my desktop. Makes me smile when I see one. He wasn’t a pagan god, you know, why not a bit of Buddha to brighten your day?

I’m more into the mythical imagery of Taoism with the dragons and monkeys flying on jet clouds. I’m a fantasy nerd with a fascination for power after all. I wouldn’t mind having my own Great Stone Dragon.

I bet you wouldn’t refuse to get a Valentine’s card just because it had a Cupid on it and he was a pagan god. Or godlet. .

Of course not… I’d even love it if it was given to me by a cute lil Japanese shrine maiden. (Pagan or not, cute is cute!! )