Why are we paying taxes?

[Pope_Noah_I]

If abortion is murder, and the American government sanctions it, why are we paying taxes? Why are we paying tribute to a nation that condones it? Would be pay taxes in Nazi Germany or in a nation that permitted the killing of Christians, or of anyone for that matter? It doesn’t make sense to me. We decry the atrocity and abombination that is infanticide, we march, and yet, we fund and support the same corrupt government we denounce every day. If a government allows the murder of innocents, I would think that we would be obligated to have nothing to do with it. I for one am more than willing to sit in jail if it means I am not cooperating with a infanticidal institution. Am I wrong?

 

[LilyM]

Well, it’s not like the government spends every penny of your taxes on abortion. They do spend it on things like roads, schools, military defence of your country, and genuine healthcare as well, which are of benefit to you.

If you want to withold PART of your taxes (proportional to the % of the budget the government spends funding abortions) you’d be within your rights, absolutely.

 

[mlchance]

I pay my taxes to avoid nomination for a cabinet position.

– Mark L. Chance.

 

[edjco]

I pay my taxes to avoid nomination for a cabinet position.

– Mark L. Chance.

Too funny! But seriously, I have been having the exact same thoughts lately about paying taxes to support abortion. I think you are dead on.
I wonder what would happen if all Catholics (and indeed all Christians) stopped paying taxes in protest…Interesting.
Let’s start a grassroots campaign!

 

[cdfost]

Not paying taxes for resisting a government’s view did not work out too well for Thoreau, but instead, it is best to think of the government as a collective whole working towards the betterment of its people. Just because parts of the government believe something, does not mean that it’s the universal consensus nor is it in total alignment with every member of the populace. To paraphrase scripture, Give to God what is God’s and to Caesar what is Caesar’s. Pay taxes because it’s your duty to your government, and defend the personal beliefs towards abortion. Be glad you are not in a different system of government where this type of thing could result in your murder for treason.

 

[The_Stig]

Because otherwise they’ll lock us up and there’s no beer in prison.

In this way, prison is a lot like Hell.

 

[wasmit]

If abortion is murder, and the American government sanctions it, why are we paying taxes? Why are we paying tribute to a nation that condones it? Would be pay taxes in Nazi Germany or in a nation that permitted the killing of Christians, or of anyone for that matter? It doesn’t make sense to me. We decry the atrocity and abombination that is infanticide, we march, and yet, we fund and support the same corrupt government we denounce every day. If a government allows the murder of innocents, I would think that we would be obligated to have nothing to do with it. I for one am more than willing to sit in jail if it means I am not cooperating with a infanticidal institution. Am I wrong?

have you considered moving to another country? You wouldn’t have to pay taxes to your current government if you lived in another country.

 

[LilyM]

Not paying taxes for resisting a government’s view did not work out too well for Thoreau, but instead, it is best to think of the government as a collective whole working towards the betterment of its people. Just because parts of the government believe something, does not mean that it’s the universal consensus nor is it in total alignment with every member of the populace. To paraphrase scripture, Give to God what is God’s and to Caesar what is Caesar’s. Pay taxes because it’s your duty to your government, and defend the personal beliefs towards abortion. Be glad you are not in a different system of government where this type of thing could result in your murder for treason.

I was just thinking of the ‘give to Caesar what is Caesar’s’ saying. It seems to me that Jesus indicated that it is a duty regardless of whether or not you agree with every policy of that government - I’m sure neither He nor His hearers approved of most of what Caesar did, no?

 

[06convert]

Because it’s our obligation. We are paying the government taxes so that they can function. Not paying taxes is a violation of law and could be a sin itself. We are only responsible for what we directly support and pay for. We can’t be held responsible for what people do with our money after it leaves our hands.

Giving to Planned Parenthood is our problem. Paying taxes and the government giving some of it to Planned Parenthood is not.

That being said. It’s about our intention. Do you pay tax because you want it to go to good things, or do you pay your tax because you’re hoping it will go to abortion clinics? If you said good things, you’re ok.

 

[Jolly_Joe]

Well, I’ve done a bit of history reading. And taxes have been an age old thing. And governments doing evil things have been an age old thing and I have yet to see the Catholic Church say don’t pay your taxes. Not to be confused with the Church not paying taxes.

If someone knows of such a situation historically, I’d appreciate a reference.

Even Jesus, when challenged on the taxes paid to Rome, and if you don’t think Rome was using those taxes to kill people, and do some rather unholy things, well our readings of history would vary. But anyway, even when Jesus was challenged, he said to render unto Ceasar that which is Ceasar’s.

I really find no basis in the Bible, nor in the history of the Catholic Church to say since the government is spending a small portion of it’s revenue on something I disagree with or even is outright evil that I will withold my taxes.

I believe the historical Catholic method of dealing with something like this would be to join an order, take a vow of poverty and give over all your property and income to the Church. That would reduce your taxes significantly.

 

[pprimeau1976]

If abortion is murder, and the American government sanctions it, why are we paying taxes? Why are we paying tribute to a nation that condones it? Would be pay taxes in Nazi Germany or in a nation that permitted the killing of Christians, or of anyone for that matter? It doesn’t make sense to me. We decry the atrocity and abombination that is infanticide, we march, and yet, we fund and support the same corrupt government we denounce every day. If a government allows the murder of innocents, I would think that we would be obligated to have nothing to do with it. I for one am more than willing to sit in jail if it means I am not cooperating with a infanticidal institution. Am I wrong?

We know how the ancient Romans were, yes? Yet, Jesus even said to give unto Caesar what is Caesars. So, I don’t think it would be sinful to pay taxes.

If you don’t pay taxes, and get convicted of a felony, your voting rights would be taken away and then you wouldn’t be able to vote for a pro-life politician. So, think hard before you decide to not pay your taxes.

 

[Arclight]

You pay taxes into a general fund. Tax dollars are not specifically allocated unless the tax is specifically for something. Tax dodgers have already tried and failed at this scheme.

This would be a big Fail, but men and women of conscience like the posters on this thread should try it, right? You’re just not talking about it, right?

 

[Pope_Noah_I]

Thanks for the responses, but, I’m just wondering, at what point are we allowed to rebel against the standing government because its supporting evil? Would Catholics in Nazi Germany still be morally obligated to pay tribute to the government, irregardless of what they were doing? Catholic moral theology makes exceptions for killing for the greater good or in self-defense, but, we cannot refuse to keep feeding a machine that legalizes infanticide? If the government said it was legal to kill me, I’m sorry, I’m not paying taxes. The unborn can’t speak out for themselves or partake in civil disobedience. We are the only ones that can speak up on their behalf, and I’m starting to question whether or not waiting for the majority vote to overturn Roe v. Wade is morally acceptable. It reminds me of the Catholic hierarchy’s appalling unwillingness to take a public role in the Civil Rights movement. But, understand, this is just a knee-jerk reaction from someone with barely any theological knowledge. If you find errors in this, by all means, tear me apart. I just want to understand what Christ would have us do in response to this continuing abomination…

 

[tonyrog]

If you complain about those taxes the pro choice group can complain about paying property taxes that support all religious organiztions in the country.Should they have some say as to which church is defferred or not.

Food for thought

 

[Soutane]

have you considered moving to another country? You wouldn’t have to pay taxes to your current government if you lived in another country.

Are you saying “Love it or leave it”?I thought we left that particular sentiment back in the '60’s

 

[Church_Militant]

If abortion is murder, and the American government sanctions it, why are we paying taxes? Why are we paying tribute to a nation that condones it? Would be pay taxes in Nazi Germany or in a nation that permitted the killing of Christians, or of anyone for that matter? It doesn’t make sense to me. We decry the atrocity and abombination that is infanticide, we march, and yet, we fund and support the same corrupt government we denounce every day. If a government allows the murder of innocents, I would think that we would be obligated to have nothing to do with it. I for one am more than willing to sit in jail if it means I am not cooperating with a infanticidal institution. Am I wrong?

You seem to have missed the straight up teaching that Jesus offered on this very question.

Matthew 22:15 Then the Pharisees going, consulted among themselves how to insnare him in his speech. 16 And they sent to him their disciples with the Herodians, saying: Master, we know that thou art a true speaker, and teachest the way of God in truth, neither carest thou for any man: for thou dost not regard the person of men. 17 Tell us therefore what dost thou think, is it lawful to give tribute to Caesar, or not? 18 But Jesus knowing their wickedness, said: Why do you tempt me, ye hypocrites? 19 Show me the coin of the tribute. And they offered him a penny. 20 And Jesus saith to them: Whose image and inscription is this? 21 They say to him: Caesar’s. Then he saith to them: Render therefore to Caesar the things that are Caesar’s; and to God, the things that are God’s.

Were the Romans any less brutal and unrighteous than our current governments?

 

[buffalo]

If Catholics just stopped paying taxes they would have to build some pretty big prisons. Maybe that will get us out of the recession.

 

[Church_Militant]

If Catholics just stopped paying taxes they would have to build some pretty big prisons. Maybe that will get us out of the recession.

Nah, they’d just jam us in there with the rest of the currently overcrowded inmates.

 

[buffalo]

Nah, they’d just jam us in there with the rest of the currently overcrowded inmates.

Yeah, but talkin’ about a bunch of Catholics no longer paying taxes because we are in prison.

Do they have EWTN and the forums in prison?

 

[edjco]

Thanks for the responses, but, I’m just wondering, at what point are we allowed to rebel against the standing government because its supporting evil? Would Catholics in Nazi Germany still be morally obligated to pay tribute to the government, irregardless of what they were doing?

I think a lot of you skipped that particular post. I’m wondering the same thing.
Ok, let’s take it a step or two further.
Suppose for the sake of argument that the US government decided that in order to help stop “global warming”, that all citizens, on their daily commute in to work, must provide a ride to a pregnant woman seeking an abortion in order to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. Would you do that?

Here’s another question. I seem to remember that as Catholics, we cannot materially participate nor assist in mortal sin, or we ourselves are also guilty of mortal sin. I don’t remember the exact language, but we use it all the time when talking about voting for pro abortion candidates. How do we not follow the same logic when we are required to pay taxes which “materially participate” in mortal sin? I know “some” of our taxes go to feed the hungry, clothe the naked, etc., but…

Ooh, ooh, ooh, here’s another one: Suppose the US Government completely outlawed Catholicism, and was using our tax money to opress Catholics. Do I still have to pay? I know some will say that’s exactly what the Romans did, but… Was Jesus telling us to pay tribute to whatever evil power happens to be in charge, or was he really telling us that God is always the most important thing, not governments?

And now, I’m really scared, because for the first time I have said something sort of contrary to ChurchMilitant, (who I’ve always looked up to), and I think he’s about to kick my tail…

One more thing and I’ll shut up. Tonyrog, exactly what property taxes do the pro choicer’s pay that “support” religious organizations?