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Travesty
Guest
Gottle of Geer said:
Question for you,
how long do you think it took God to create the earth? If you are saying that 65 million years ago dinosaurs died out before man, then you don’t believe God created everything in 6 days.
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Nan_S
Guest
The Catholic Church officially takes no position in the “6 days” argument, citing as reason that we leave religious truth to the church, and archaeology to the archaeologists.
I personally subscribe to the 2 Peter 3:8 approach:
But do not ignore this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
So I don’t hold to the belief that creation had six literal 24-hour days. I’m in the camp that believes God created the universe in six phases, in an orderly fashion with a divine intent.
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Santa_Cruz
Guest
Nan S:
I’ll say AMEN to that.
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catholic2
Guest
They have found soft dinosaur tissue in partially fossilized bones.
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Gottle_of_Geer
Guest
I have no religious problems accepting that God created all things, & did most of it through evolution. Believing in a creative work of millions of years is no more of a problem for faith in a Creator God Who is infinitely Good & is a God Who exercises a Providence over every creature, visible & invisible, from the least to the most glorious, than is the knowledge that there are millions of micro-organisms underneath our feet; or that out of millions of spermatozoa, only one or two are implanted in the uterus at conception. It is not numbers that give or announce value, except in maths and the sciences - spiritually and metaphysically, mere arithmetical vastness is of no importance at all. Otherwise, the blue whale would be dearer to God than any man.
A creative process of 13 thousand million years for the universe is very inspiring, and not contrary to anything I believe. After all, whether God took six days or 4.6 thousand million years to create the earth, God remains God. Jesus Christ must be pretty important, if so many years and all their work are summed up in Him. I find evolution is a wonderful commentary on Psalm 19, for instance, and a wonderful witness to the glory of Jesus Christ, the Word through Whom it came into being. “All things” are His - including the Archaeopteryx, Plesiosaurus, Diplodocus and woolly mammoth.ISTM that acceptance of some kind of evolution can do a great deal for one’s appreciation of the greatness of God and the marvellousness of His works - & it can lead to a renewal of the sense of wonder. And that is something very necessary indeed - especially to the Christian, and to the theologian. ##
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Travesty
Guest
So you think God left everything up to random chance.
How can a God who is in control leave his creation up to random chance?
Why should we worship a God who is not in total control?
How can a God who is in control leave his creation up to random chance?
Why should we worship a God who is not in total control?
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DaMaMaXiMuS
Guest
I’m agreement with Nan S, I’ve always been thought that Leviathan was some sort of dinosaur. There’s another scripture in 2nd Esdras that mentions Leviathan also. I’m not sure if it’s chapter 6.
I also agree that we can not put a 24 hour period to the days of creation since today we determine 24 hours by the rising and setting of the Sun. Which wasn’t created until the 4th day of the creation, so we can’t say 6 days in todays length of time. I think the bottom line is we will never know for certain until we’re before the LORD. I used to apply 2nd Peter 3:8 along with a scripture in Psalms to say that the days of the creation were a thousand years in man’s time. Although this may well be the answer, I’ve just chosen to say I don’t know for sure.
My 2 cents,
Nelson
I also agree that we can not put a 24 hour period to the days of creation since today we determine 24 hours by the rising and setting of the Sun. Which wasn’t created until the 4th day of the creation, so we can’t say 6 days in todays length of time. I think the bottom line is we will never know for certain until we’re before the LORD. I used to apply 2nd Peter 3:8 along with a scripture in Psalms to say that the days of the creation were a thousand years in man’s time. Although this may well be the answer, I’ve just chosen to say I don’t know for sure.
My 2 cents,
Nelson
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catholic2
Guest
We are closer to the truth when we say we are foolish. I don’t know, I think I see pompous pride sometimes abounding in our didactical posts.
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JimG
Guest
Establishing the physical laws of the universe and the constants of nature, and knowing how it is all going to turn out, is not, I think, the same as leaving everything up to random chance. Had God not established the laws of nature, scientific inquiry would not even be possible.
In any case, in electing to give free will to us, God relinquished total control in favor of total love. If He had total control, surely we would never sin.
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catholic2
Guest
Do you think that God is not in full controll at all times? Full controll is the definition of God. He allows things to happen, but He is not “surprised” when things happen as he allows free will.
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JimG
Guest
Nothing can every “surprise” God. Free will for us means that He does not ever force us to choose for Him. Because forced love is no love at all.
If He wished to assert total control, He could have simply placed us all in heaven by force of will, and never sent His Son to die on a cross.
If He wished to assert total control, He could have simply placed us all in heaven by force of will, and never sent His Son to die on a cross.
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catholic2
Guest
JimG: You do not know the mind of God and his mysterious ways. He says you can’t understand Him; that His ways are far above ours and His thoughts as well. “As far as the Heavens are from the earth, so far are My thoughts and ways from yours.”(paraphrase)
I wouldn’t limit God by human logic.
I wouldn’t limit God by human logic.
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Della
Guest
I get the distinct feeling they believe because certain natural phenomena are not mentioned in the Bible that “proves” there is no God. A silly assumption if you ask me that any 5 year old could answer, but what it means is that you could explain all the mysteries of the universe and how God brought them about and they still wouldn’t believe. Some people don’t want to believe and so they will not believe. If that is the case, don’t waste any more time or effort on them, but do what Jesus did–let them go their own way until they come back with an open heart and mind.
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Daniel_Marsh
Guest
Hi Jaded, Leviathan is satan see rev 12, seven heads
Rev 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
Rev 12:4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
Rev 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and [to] his throne.
Rev 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred [and] threescore days.
Rev 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
Rev 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
**
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
**
Jaded who is the women in verse 1 ???
Simply, put dinos existed before recorded history. There is no reason to expect the Bible which is at least recorded history to write about dinos. In fact, the word dinosar was not even coined until around 1950.
Rev 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
Rev 12:4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
Rev 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and [to] his throne.
Rev 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred [and] threescore days.
Rev 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
Rev 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
**
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
**
Jaded who is the women in verse 1 ???
Simply, put dinos existed before recorded history. There is no reason to expect the Bible which is at least recorded history to write about dinos. In fact, the word dinosar was not even coined until around 1950.
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JimG
Guest
I agree.
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JimG
Guest
On second thought, I have to amend my answer a little.
God’s thoughts are far above our thoughts, and Gods ways are far above our ways. God cannot be encompassed by human logic.
Still, there are things that we can say about God that are true.
And there are things that we can say about God that are false.
Late in life, God told Thomas Aquinas in a vision, “You have written well of Me, Thomas.” So, He must have thought that what Thomas wrote was at least true, if not all encompassing.
But that has nothing to do with dinosaurs.
God’s thoughts are far above our thoughts, and Gods ways are far above our ways. God cannot be encompassed by human logic.
Still, there are things that we can say about God that are true.
And there are things that we can say about God that are false.
Late in life, God told Thomas Aquinas in a vision, “You have written well of Me, Thomas.” So, He must have thought that what Thomas wrote was at least true, if not all encompassing.
But that has nothing to do with dinosaurs.
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Lizzie
Guest
Dinosaurs are mentioned in the Bible. At that time they were frequenly called dragons.
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Daniel_Marsh
Guest
The word dragon is not in the Hebrew. The word translated as such refers to chaos in the OT and is revealed to be satan himself in the NT ( see rev 12 ). What dino had seven heads?
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Lizzie
Guest
Daniel Marsh:
The word dinosaur wasn’t invented until somewhere around 1841 in spite of finds of dinosaur fossils by the ancient Chinese and later by the Greeks and Romans.
Dragon/dinosaur reptiles have long captured the imagination.
Doesn’t the Greek ‘drakon’ translate as the Hebrew ‘tannin’?The word dragon is not in the Hebrew.
The word dinosaur wasn’t invented until somewhere around 1841 in spite of finds of dinosaur fossils by the ancient Chinese and later by the Greeks and Romans.
Dragon/dinosaur reptiles have long captured the imagination.
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