Why aren't Holy Days of Obligation the same worldwide?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Duckling
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
D

Duckling

Guest
Hi,

I just saw a thread about All Saint’s Day, people were wondering if it was a Holy Day of Obligation. People replied to say it is in certain places.

So, I was wondering, why aren’t all Holy Days of Obligation the same worldwide?
 
Okay, so why do Bishops have the power to suppress a Holy Day of obligation? They’re all so important, why would they want to suppress them?

I hope I’m not coming off as argumentative, I’m just trying to better understand. 🙂
 
Duckling said:
Okay, so why do Bishops have the power to suppress a Holy Day of obligation? They’re all so important, why would they want to suppress them?
Click to expand...
A lot of people have a hard time taking off work on different holy days, but that varies by country. In some countries, some or all of the Holy Days are also legal holidays where banks and government offices are closed. Other countries, they have no legal status at all. The bishops make a judgment based upon the circumstances on the ground in their own jurisdictions.
 
here they are moved to Sundays except 2

its a secular world
 
Last edited:
Duckling said:
Okay, so why do Bishops have the power to suppress a Holy Day of obligation? They’re all so important, why would they want to suppress them?

I hope I’m not coming off as argumentative, I’m just trying to better understand. 🙂
Click to expand...
No harm in asking.

It’s a simple matter of recognizing that we all have different cultures.

What is important in one place might not be important in another. With regard to the Holy Days, we all have the same Holy Days so they’re all important in-and-of-themselves, but it’s a question of whether or not the importance rises to the level of being a day of obligation. That can vary for any number of reasons. That is why Rome leave it up to the bishops of that country to decide for themselves (with Rome having final say)–because they know their own culture better than anyone outside of it.

It’s also a matter of recognizing that there are differences that might apply to one place but it’s the sort of thing that people in a completely different culture might not even realize.

Take California for example. One of the reasons why the bishops there dispense from the obligation on January 1 of each year is that the cultural celebrations of New Years Day make it very difficult for Catholics to attend Mass. In other cultures, Jan. 1 doesn’t mean much—for example Oriental cultures who have a different day for the new year, so they can dedicate Jan 1 to being exclusively about the Solemnity of Mary.
 
They aren’t even the same country wide.
In the United States, the Ascension is a Holy Day of Obligation in I think 6 Archdioceses; the rest have moved it to the 7th Sunday of Easter.

The holy days of obligation for Latin Catholics are indicated in canon 1246 of the 1983 Code of Canon Law:

Can. 1246. §1. Sunday, on which by apostolic tradition the paschal mystery is celebrated, must be observed in the universal Church as the primordial holy day of obligation. The following days must also be observed: the Nativity of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Epiphany, the Ascension, the Body and Blood of Christ, Holy Mary the Mother of God, her Immaculate Conception, her Assumption, Saint Joseph, Saint Peter and Saint Paul the Apostles, and All Saints.
§2. With the prior approval of the Apostolic See, however, the conference of bishops can suppress some of the holy days of obligation or transfer them to a Sunday.

So really if a countries conference of Bishops requests it be moved or not a Obligatory day, it can be not required attendance with approval of the Holy See.
 
I see that as weak. My Parish alone had a 7 p.m. vigil Mass. 7 a.m. Mass, and 7 p.m. Mass today. If you can’t get to it with that many options you have a problem .
 
FrDavid96 said:
With regard to the Holy Days, we all have the same Holy Days so they’re all important in-and-of-themselves, but it’s a question of whether or not the importance rises to the level of being a day of obligation.
Click to expand...
Does this mean that mass is usually an option on the Holy Days, but not necessarily an obligation?
 
jas84173 said:
I see that as weak. My Parish alone had a 7 p.m. vigil Mass. 7 a.m. Mass, and 7 p.m. Mass today. If you can’t get to it with that many options you have a problem .
Click to expand...
It isn’t always that simple.

Some people do work 24 hour shifts; some fire departments do that. Some even go longer than that.

In parts of California, on January 1, the streets are so clogged by the parades that even if a parish has Masses scheduled, people are completely unable to get to the church buildings.

It’s not a weak argument. It is merely the bishops making pastoral decisions as to whether or not the totality of the situation makes it difficult for Catholics to attend Mass. Sometimes the burdens are just too much to justify keeping the obligation.
 
FrDavid96 said:
40.png
jas84173:
I see that as weak. My Parish alone had a 7 p.m. vigil Mass. 7 a.m. Mass, and 7 p.m. Mass today. If you can’t get to it with that many options you have a problem .
Click to expand...
It isn’t always that simple.

Some people do work 24 hour shifts; some fire departments do that. Some even go longer than that.

In parts of California, on January 1, the streets are so clogged by the parades that even if a parish has Masses scheduled, people are completely unable to get to the church buildings.

It’s not a weak argument. It is merely the bishops making pastoral decisions as to whether or not the totality of the situation makes it difficult for Catholics to attend Mass. Sometimes the burdens are just too much to justify keeping the obligation.
Click to expand...
Thank you Fr. David.

Today was extremely hard for my family. There were no masses in 45 minutes that my husband could attend before going to work. I took my toddler by myself.

Husband planned to go to Mass at 7pm, he even headed to work early. But due to the storms in New England things at his work got rescheduled and being the first day with power his day ran long. (Do pray, there are still thousands without power…we got it back after 42ish hours, some are going on 50+ at this point)

He came in the door at 6:30pm, frustrated, starving, angry and defeated. He had time to give hugs and was shoving food in his face so he could go out. I had him sit down. It takes 25-30 minutes to get to church in good traffic. Since thousands are now on day 3 without power and town has it, it’s a zoo of people just knee deep at restaurants. It would be dangerous and foolish to try to speed to Mass, be late, and not even be able to take Communion.

It was a prudent decision we were forced to make given the circumstances. By the time 7:15 hit and we’d gotten the little one off to bed, he lamented that there wasn’t one parish within an hour (in this crazy traffic) that had an 8pm.

Life can be hard and with very, very limited options. For us it was during the workday or 7pm. (We would not attend a 7pm mass on Halloween–even if that had been an option–because little children are out in the dark and being little children they tend to be unpredictable)

Hopefully, it will be better next year.

But today, boy did we feel the burden.
 
Actually, Ascension Thursday is observed as a HDO in nearly forty American dioceses, which comprise five ecclesiastical provinces.
 
FrDavid96 said:
It isn’t always that simple.

Some people do work 24 hour shifts; some fire departments do that. Some even go longer than that.

In parts of California, on January 1, the streets are so clogged by the parades that even if a parish has Masses scheduled, people are completely unable to get to the church buildings.

It’s not a weak argument. It is merely the bishops making pastoral decisions as to whether or not the totality of the situation makes it difficult for Catholics to attend Mass. Sometimes the burdens are just too much to justify keeping the obligation.
Click to expand...
However, the obligation is presumably already abrogated for such people by the fact that they couldn’t make it to Mass because of legitimate circumstances beyond their control, much like even the Sunday obligation of a Catholic is abrogated if he, for some legitimate reason, finds himself in a situation where he truly cannot attend Mass. So there is really no need to ever suppress a Holy Day, because the requirement to attend Mass has already been abrogated for such people because of that situation.

One has to wonder about January 1. If the throngs of people who stay out late the previous night merry making are able to get up and attend cultural parades, why can’t they attend Mass? Even if the streets are “clogged by parades”, surely the suburban parishes could accommodate worshipers? If you are willing to push through the crowds to watch a parade, why not be willing to do so to get to your church? I don’t know, it just seems like a weak reason to suppress the Solemnity of the Mother of God. And if you REALLY can’t make it, well then it wasn’t your fault, and your obligation is abrogated anyway.
 
Last edited:
Thanks for the correction. I said Archdioceses which is the same as ecclesiastical region.
I thought it was 6 but you clarified it’s in fact only 5. Thanks
 
jas84173 said:
Thanks for the correction. I said Archdioceses which is the same as ecclesiastical region.
I thought it was 6 but you clarified it’s in fact only 5. Thanks
Click to expand...
Yes, sometimes the word archdiocese can be used to refer to the entire province: the archdiocese itself and the suffragan sees as a whole, which is how you used the word. Sometimes, it refers exclusively to the archdiocese. Either way works.
 
My Parish did not have a Mass, the other parish that the priest serves did but at 9:15am, right at the beginning of the work day. I believe that there was a 7pm one further afield, however by the time I had got home from work, and travelled there I would have been late.
 
FrDavid96 said:
Take California for example. One of the reasons why the bishops there dispense from the obligation on January 1 of each year is that the cultural celebrations of New Years Day make it very difficult for Catholics to attend Mass. In other cultures, Jan. 1 doesn’t mean much—for example Oriental cultures who have a different day for the new year, so they can dedicate Jan 1 to being exclusively about the Solemnity of Mary.
Click to expand...
Father,
This is interesting. This just goes to show that it comes down to a prudential judgment by the bishops. The secular celebration of New Years is very big here in Canada, yet Jan 1 is a holy day of obligation. On the other hand, the Immaculate Conception and the Assumption, while key Marian feasts, are not days of obligation. I think the Bishops figured it would be less of a burden to get to Mass at some point on a stat holiday.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top