Why Be Protestant?

[Smugleaf]

Many do not appreciate the seeming lack of space for free thought in the Catholic Church and wish to congregate within a community with similar beliefs but where one is allowed to form their own opinion. Many also do not agree with the ceremonies of the Catholic Church and prefer simpler (or indeed more solemn) celebrations of their faith.

There are as many answers as there are people, and it is impossible to generalise too much. I can only say that it does not usually come as a result of ignorance, confusion or bad catechesis, but more often from lengthy soul-searching, prayer and internal dialogue.

 

[qOcOp]

Many do not appreciate the seeming lack of space for free thought in the Catholic Church and wish to congregate within a community with similar beliefs but where one is allowed to form their own opinion. Many also do not agree with the ceremonies of the Catholic Church and prefer simpler (or indeed more solemn) celebrations of their faith…

Yea I hate not being able to be a Free Thinker. This is personally why I hate Mathematics and Science since they also do not allow me to live my Free Thinking lifestyle.

There are as many answers as there are people, and it is impossible to generalise too much. I can only say that it does not usually come as a result of ignorance, confusion or bad catechesis, but more often from lengthy soul-searching, prayer and internal dialogue.

Sounds like Idolatry to me.

 

[ESMDHokie77]

you like making 2+2=3 right q?

I’ve been to some pretty solemn masses… And homilies often have a few good humor jokes in them for entertainment.

 

[waxwing]

Another great point, nonetheless as we move closer to the end, if in fact the end is even near? Then whats the right move for Gods Kingdom? To admit as human’s we don’t have all the anwsers and unite the church. No?

Its not like we are on vacation deciding over which sun screen is better for you.

God Bless, GT

Think 30 SPF is is best

In terms of your question about what the right move is for God’s Kingdom. I am not sure what the answer is.…all I know is that the Protestants aren’t going away and therefore I don’t see any unity in church in terms of structure and doctrine. The only analogy I can come up with is that of being citizens in a country, Canada in my case, is made up of people of all stripes, those on the extreme right and those on the extreme left and all those in the nuances of the middle. But we’re all Canadians, one of the first words that spring to mind when think of Canada is Tolerance…for Christianity unity I do think tolerance is important, that doesn’t mean truth falls by way side, it means what can we agree upon? Apostles Creed and Nicene Creed…great this is pretty foundational so let focus on this and tolerate each others “heresy’s”

 

[GaryTaylor]

Sounds good to me, but in your last sentence I do believe you give Homo Sapien way to much credit. He still live’s barbaric in many parts of the world today.

The fact of we have IPods and HD-TV doesn’t detract from where we were 150 years ago fighting a Civil War.

With all our wisdom we haven’t had a break in war since 2700-BC. The only thing we have become experts at is killing each other.

 

[Smugleaf]

Yea I hate not being able to be a Free Thinker. This is personally why I hate Mathematics and Science since they also do not allow me to live my Free Thinking lifestyle.

Why do I bother? Science is not the same as faith because it relies on evidence that is not entirely spiritual. You cannot make a formula for God. People will have different ideas of what God is.

Sounds like Idolatry to me.

Please elaborate.

 

[Randy_Carson]

Many do not appreciate the seeming lack of space for free thought in the Catholic Church and wish to congregate within a community with similar beliefs but where one is allowed to form their own opinion.

Some people say that Catholics don’t get to think for themselves and simply accept what their priests or the pope says. Others love to quote dissident theologians who disagree with official Church teaching as evidence of the lack of unity within Catholicism. So…which is it? Sheesh.

But I digress.

 

[Randy_Carson]

all I know is that the Protestants aren’t going away

Actually, they are. According to the church census data that comes out every year, most mainline Protestant denominations are losing members at an alarming rate. Meanwhile, the Catholic Church continues to grow.

But I digress.

 

[Smugleaf]

Some people say that Catholics don’t get to think for themselves and simply accept what their priests or the pope says. Others love to quote dissident theologians who disagree with official Church teaching as evidence of the lack of unity within Catholicism. So…which is it? Sheesh.

But I digress.

And I’m not trying to get into an argument by making a statement that would no doubt come across as controversial on this forum. I am simply saying, this is one reason for switching denominations. If your conscience does not agree with a religion, it’s debatable whether the conscience or the organised religion should be trusted (though I’m sure many here will disagree).

 

[qOcOp]

Why do I bother? Science is not the same as faith because it relies on evidence that is not entirely spiritual. You cannot make a formula for God. People will have different ideas of what God is…

What I’m getting at Leaf is since Truth is not subjective (as we can see in Mathematics or Science) then this means its nature is objective. Now if it is objective in Mathematics and Science then it will be objective when it comes to Religion. If it wasnt it would be a contradiction and therefore would not be the truth. Since we know that truth is objective this therefore means there is One True Faith out there and that following your subjective opinion as your guide to this objective Truth is the fastest way to not find it. Faith doesn’t only rely on evidence that is entirely spiritual. It also relies on Logic and Reason.

please elaborate

Yes when someone follows their subjective opinion rather than the objective truth, they make themselves out to be their own god. Making yourself God when you know your not God is called idolatry. Basically they love their own opinion over the Truth

 

[qOcOp]

 

[waxwing]

Actually, they are. According to the church census data that comes out every year, most mainline Protestant denominations are losing members at an alarming rate. Meanwhile, the Catholic Church continues to grow.

But I digress.

Mainline are losing members, but I think they going to the Non Denominational churches and some to the Catholic Church. But Protestantism is not going away…Evolving, Yes!!..Protestants be it the Mainline’s, the Evangelicals or the ND’s are here to stay.

 

[Randy_Carson]

Mainline are losing members, but I think they going to the Non Denominational churches and some to the Catholic Church. But Protestantism is not going away…Evolving, Yes!!..Protestants be it the Mainline’s, the Evangelicals or the ND’s are here to stay.

CATHOLICISM is here to stay.

As for the others…let’s chat again in 1500 years.

 

[Smugleaf]

What I’m getting at Leaf is since Truth is not subjective (as we can see in Mathematics or Science) then this means its nature is objective. Now if it is objective in Mathematics and Science then it will be objective when it comes to Religion. If it wasnt it would be a contradiction and therefore would not be the truth. Since we know that truth is objective this therefore means there is One True Faith out there and that following your subjective opinion as your guide to this objective Truth is the fastest way to not find it.

Of course, but you are forgetting that many aren’t at all sure that the Catholic Church is the one that has the objective truth. The objective truth is something that by definition is practically impossible to determine, and what one person (or church, or organisation, or belief system) believes to be the objective truth is in fact still their subjective view of truth in the eyes of others. It remains an opinion, and regardless of what evidence, empirical or spiritual, is presented, it remains incomplete. I appreciate that members of a faith believe it to be the one truth, but not everybody will agree, and people will leave.

Yes when someone follows their subjective opinion rather than the objective truth, then this person makes themself their own god. Making yourself God when you know your not God is called idolatry. Basically they love their own opinion over the Truth.

I beg to differ. Seeking God does not always involve pride and idolising oneself. It is usually just that: seeking God. Seeking the objective truth, if you wish.

 

[waxwing]

CATHOLICISM is here to stay.

As for the others…let’s chat again in 1500 years.

Catholicism is here to stay, no disagreement here…yep we’ll need to chat in 1500 years to see how the Christian Landscape has changed

 

[GaryTaylor]

Theres many very good points here now. But I could say this for sure. While one would think CAF would be a very good simulation of reality compared to the real world.

I see a much greater effort with Protestants and Catholics to put aside difference and work on common bonds in the community today.

I don’t know if its youth, or city/country is a factor. But I see a difference from the community to here. I really see the adults making an effort to get along today. We have some major issues confronting us. I never see doctrine comments or differences like this but here.

I make it a point to talk weekly with a childhood friend who runs a very well attended Baptist Church here. I can assure you we don’t see much different. Its not the Christians we are worried about, its everything else when you come right down to it.

God Bless, Gary

 

[SteveVH]

Well, there is much to be said for sticking with the original.

I sense you are being purposely provocative with your question, so I hope my response is not impertinent. Arguably, your version of the Creed, with the filioque imperiously added, is a manifestation of the very problem that many Protestants and Orthodox see in Rome.

Is your new, improved version of the Creed sufficiently better that one should leave the Orthodox Catholic Church and cause a schism? Protestantism never arose in the areas of the Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church that didn’t change the Creed. Perhaps if Rome didn’t innovate, Protestantism would have been necessary.

I wasn’t aware that the Anglican Church split do to the wording of the Creed. I thought it was more along the lines of King Henry, VIII wanting a divorce.

Just saying…

 

[GaryTaylor]

I wasn’t aware that the Anglican Church split do to the wording of the Creed. I thought it was more along the lines of King Henry, VIII wanting a divorce.

Just saying…

Amazing how History becomes blurred

 

[SteveVH]

Of course, but you are forgetting that many aren’t at all sure that the Catholic Church is the one that has the objective truth. The objective truth is something that by definition is practically impossible to determine, and what one person (or church, or organisation, or belief system) believes to be the objective truth is in fact still their subjective view of truth in the eyes of others. It remains an opinion, and regardless of what evidence, empirical or spiritual, is presented, it remains incomplete. I appreciate that members of a faith believe it to be the one truth, but not everybody will agree, and people will leave.I beg to differ. Seeking God does not always involve pride and idolising oneself. It is usually just that: seeking God. Seeking the objective truth, if you wish.

I believe the “Truth” that the Catholic Church claims to possess is “revealed truth” rather than “objective truth”.

 

[waxwing]

Theres many very good points here now. But I could say this for sure. While one would think CAF would be a very good simulation of reality compared to the real world.

I see a much greater effort with Protestants and Catholics to put aside difference and work on common bonds in the community today.

I don’t know if its youth, or city/country is a factor. But I see a difference from the community to here. I really see the adults making an effort to get along today. We have some major issues confronting us. I never see doctrine comments or differences like this but here.

I make it a point to talk weekly with a childhood friend who runs a very well attended Baptist Church here. I can assure you we don’t see much different. Its not the Christians we are worried about, its everything else when you come right down to it.

God Bless, Gary

Completely Agree with this !