Why Can’t Lutherans Take Catholic Communion?

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JonNC said:
No. We do not use that type of metaphysical language to express the real presence.

Jon
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Respecting the fact that Lutherans prefer not to attempt to define the manner in which Christ is truly present, is there something in particular about the doctrine of Transubstantiation with which Lutherans would flat out disagree?
 
SteveVH said:
Respecting the fact that Lutherans prefer not to attempt to define the manner in which Christ is truly present, is there something in particular about the doctrine of Transubstantiation with which Lutherans would flat out disagree?
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Speaking for myself - the doctrine of Transubstantiation is a good way of teaching for those that need an intellectual understanding of the Eucharist. Where it falls short, as I understand it, is that it creates a definition that God may agree with but He didn’t necessarily give to us.
 
benjohnson said:
Speaking for myself - the doctrine of Transubstantiation is a good way of teaching for those that need an intellectual understanding of the Eucharist. Where it falls short, as I understand it, is that it creates a definition that God may agree with but He didn’t necessarily give to us.
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This is my view, as well. Transub is a reasonable human expression of the mystery of the Eucharist. For me it is not necessarily a barrier. That said, this:

From John of Damascus: “If you enquire how this happens, it is enough for you to learn that it is through the Holy Spirit … we know nothing more than this, that the word of God is true, active, and omnipotent, but in its manner of operation unsearchable”.

Jon
 
jmcrae said:
Here is my thought:

If Lutherans want to be reunited in full Holy Communion with the Catholic Church, then they should renounce the Reformation, make appropriate preparations either through private instruction or through the Rite for Baptized Christians, and make their Profession of Faith in the Catholic Church.

It makes zero sense for a professing Lutheran to receive Holy Communion from a Catholic priest, when the whole point of Lutheranism was to renounce the Catholic Church, including the priesthood, and declare the whole thing to be “the whore of Babylon.”
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My thoughts exactly. Well said.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
Thanks for posting the writings of St Ignatius, an early Church Father who Lutherans honor on October 17; here’s the prayer of the day:

"Almighty God, we praise Your name for Ignatius of Antioch, pastor and martyr. He offered himself as grain to be ground by the teeth of wild beasts so that he might present to You the pure bread of sacrifice. Accept the willing tribute of all that we are and have and give us a portion in the pure unspotted offering of Your Son, Jesus Christ, who lives and reigns with You and the Holy Spirit, one God, now and forever. Amen"

Not sure what your point is, however since Lutherans agree a bishop is the head of the diocese/ synod as a sign of eucharistic integrity and unity.

But you asserted this yesterday:

And I asked you the following:
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By all means then, please show how your Bishop is in communion with the Pope, and thus properly ordained by those with Apostolic Succession.

I can post a million prayers about any religion, that does not mean I am in communion with them. I mean your post is pretty clear, but you seem to be focused on prayers and similarities, as such departing from your OP. I too like to focus on our similarities, but you seem to completely ignore the fact that you are not in communion with the Catholic Church, otherwise you’d be Catholic and not Lutheran.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
There seems to be a lack of any credible argument that the Catholic-Lutheran agreements don’t exist or apply.
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Is there anything in the agreements that says that Lutherans are now free to receive Holy Communion in Catholic Churches? I strongly doubt it; if there were, then we would no longer be using the word “Lutheran” - they would be Catholics and they would be under the authority of the current Bishop of Rome.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
Sometimes we lose sight that we are Christians. The papacy is leading the Church.
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He has no authority over those who reject him, and would not have the right to invite them to partake of Holy Communion, even if he wanted to - it’s not his decision to make until after they have made their Profession of Faith in the Catholic Church. Then, and only then, does he have the authority to invite them to receive the Sacrament of Confirmation and First Holy Communion in the Catholic Church.
 
jmcrae said:
Is there anything in the agreements that says that Lutherans are now free to receive Holy Communion in Catholic Churches? I strongly doubt it; if there were, then we would no longer be using the word “Lutheran” - they would be Catholics and they would be under the authority of the current Bishop of Rome.
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There is nothing in the agreements that say that Lutherans may receive Holy Communion in Catholic Churches. We have a ways to go before we reach that point. The caution placed by the Vatican on the JDDJ Joint Declaration/Doctrine of Justification makes it explicitly clear that that particular statement is not to be interpreted that there is now
to be Communion between Catholics and Lutherans in the Church that is not where they profess their Faith.

Apparently some of the Catholics in Germany were interpreting the Declaration on Justification enough to Commune in Lutheran Churches and vice versa, Lutherans in Catholic Churches…

Not the case.
 
Isaiah45_9 said:
By all means then, please show how your Bishop is in communion with the Pope, and thus properly ordained by those with Apostolic Succession.

I can post a million prayers about any religion, that does not mean I am in communion with them. I mean your post is pretty clear, but you seem to be focused on prayers and similarities, as such departing from your OP. I too like to focus on our similarities, but you seem to completely ignore the fact that you are not in communion with the Catholic Church, otherwise you’d be Catholic and not Lutheran.
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My bishop [Metro New York Synod] looks like Cardinal Dolan. Both consecrated in apostolic succession. One guides mainly small parishes; the other the archbishop of New York.
 
EvangelCatholic…your church is so beautiful and worthy to receive the Lord.

But you do not have the tabernacle of the Lord’s physical presence among you. Is that correct?
 
EvangelCatholic said:
My bishop [Metro New York Synod] looks like Cardinal Dolan. Both consecrated in apostolic succession. One guides mainly small parishes; the other the archbishop of New York.
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Beautiful Altar.

Brother, I asked “how” was your Bishop consecrated in apostolic succession.
 
KathleenGee said:
EvangelCatholic…your church is so beautiful and worthy to receive the Lord.

But you do not have the tabernacle of the Lord’s physical presence among you. Is that correct?
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Thanks but that is not my parish; I think it is a Synod mission on Long Island. I was present at this installation of a woman pastor.

The issue, btw, of reserved sacrament often means in the sacristy in really little churches.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
My bishop [Metro New York Synod] looks like Cardinal Dolan. Both consecrated in apostolic succession.
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Yes, and … ? Even if he has a documented line of Apostolic Succession that was not interrupted by the events of the Reformation, there are also many other non-Catholic churches (ie: Greek Orthodox) that do not receive Holy Communion in the Catholic Church, even though they clearly have Apostolic Succession. The reason is, they are not in union with us.
 
Isaiah45_9 said:
Beautiful Altar.

Brother, I asked “how” was your Bishop consecrated in apostolic succession.
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Bishop Mark S. Hanson, presiding national bishop of the ELCA & Bishop Mark Sisk, the Episcopal bishop of New York.
 
EvangelCatholic said:
I believe the Western Church is healing. Lutherans welcome back home as articulated in
“Lutherans and Catholics: From Conflict to Communion” Vatican Radio news.va/en/news/lutherans-and-catholics-from-conflict-to-communion
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Does that justify stealing communion by receiving it surreptitiously as the article’s author stated that he did?

How is it that he is justified in that action?

Why would a Lutheran Minister feel he is entitled to receive the Catholic Eucharist? On a few articles of faith that are similar? Some, but not all, as he himself points out?

What do you think real communion is, if it is not to be of one accord, to be one in faith?

It seems that people that steal from others feel entitled to the things that they take, and is this not the case here?
 
jmcrae said:
He has no authority over those who reject him, and would not have the right to invite them to partake of Holy Communion, even if he wanted to - it’s not his decision to make until after they have made their Profession of Faith in the Catholic Church. Then, and only then, does he have the authority to invite them to receive the Sacrament of Confirmation and First Holy Communion in the Catholic Church.
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Exactly right. 👍
 
Michael57 said:
Does that justify stealing communion by receiving it surreptitiously as the article’s author stated that he did?

How is it that he is justified in that action?

Why would a Lutheran Minister feel he is entitled to receive the Catholic Eucharist? On a few articles of faith that are similar? Some, but not all, as he himself points out?

What do you think real communion is, if it is not to be of one accord, to be one in faith?

It seems that people that steal from others feel entitled to the things that they take, and is this not the case here?
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You’ve said a mouthful, about yourself. 😦
 
EvangelCatholic said:
You’ve said a mouthful, about yourself. 😦
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If we were, in fact, of one accord and one faith, then we would all be “Catholic” and no one would be using the word “Lutheran.”

I’m not sure what it is about that that is so difficult to comprehend.
 
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