Why can't Catholics get married outdoors?

[Suspicious_Mind]

Suspicious Mind:
Since I did not use several different colors (only one) nor several different sizes or fonts, your post attempting to demonstrate the ‘annoyance’ my post gave you (in which you used several colors, sizes and fonts) makes no sense.

Actually I wanted you to hit the quote button and see the garble of code that pops up, do it.

It seems you didn’t hit the quote button and directly respond, why not? Had trouble?

 

[Danny_Clover]

Suspicious Mind:
Since I did not use several different colors (only one) nor several different sizes or fonts, your post attempting then would it make sense to you to ask you not to mix your own words in with mine and then attribute them to me? to demonstrate the ‘annoyance’ my post gave you (in which you used several colors, sizes and fonts) makes no sense.

 

[Suspicious_Mind]

Anyways, guys and gals…I think this has run its course, it’s obviously a sign that we’ve run out of what else to say here.

Good work on the discussion, lets hope we all took something positive away from it.

See you guys later! and gals.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Actually I wanted you to hit the quote button and see the garble of code that pops up, do it.

It seems you didn’t hit the quote button and directly respond, why not? Had trouble?

With respect, perhaps it’s your machine? I see no ‘garble of code’. When one responds with the quote, everybody gets a ‘code’ marker for ‘quote’ so all that pops up with my one color is an extra little marker for ‘blue’. Hardly a problem.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Surely we can agree that the Catholic Church (as its members understand) has the right to function according to the teachings of that Church.

 

[Danny_Clover]

Anyways, guys and gals…I think this has run its course, it’s obviously a sign that we’ve run out of what else to say here.

Good work on the discussion, lets hope we all took something positive away from it.

See you guys later! and gals.

Agreed. There would be nothing wise in continuing in this thread.

 

[agapewolf]

The authority given to the disciples were to spread the word of God, not make up things. They taught others as Jesus had taught them. Why weren’t they going around and saying pray to Mary? That’s one of the things.

Sinful humans is a given, we are all sinful. It’s not the sinfulness, but the hypocrisy specifically.

How can you teach your child to avert sexual immorality when you yourself can’t? Bishops being caught with child pornography, the Pope being involved in it as well is not a sign of anything good.

The authority was given that whatever is bound on earth shall be bound in heaven and the Holy Spirit will protect the church from teaching error.

They sure did pray to mary…she was there, do you think they didn’t talk to Jesus’ mom?

If every person is sinful, then the issue is you don’t believe that God has the power to prevent his church from teaching error.

Yes, indeed, a sinful person can teach truth.

 

[the_phoenix]

With all due respect, to use Biblical verses when the “exterior” is bad is being used metaphorially to prove that weddings shouldn’t be outside is deceptive.

There is nothing there at all that indicates Jesus was against marriages happening outside.

Methinks you missed the last part of my previous post:

"And what’s this? Being excluded from a wedding for not having enough oil in a lamp, or for being late, or for not meeting a dress code? Some may feel Jesus is being harsh here … what He is doing is upholding the importance and respect due to rightful authority and legitimate tradition. It’s not just “anything goes” or “everybody make up your own mind how to behave based on your feelings.”

There is then, something in the Bible that indicates Jesus is in favor of respecting legitimate authority when it comes to marriage customs … and that covers such things as having oil in your lamp, arriving on time before the doors are shut, wearing proper wedding attire, and in our own day, holding weddings normally inside a church building.

As I said previously, I offered the Bible verses from Matthew as examples, finding it quite interesting how the symbolism of inside/outside ties in with our discussion. Whether it can be taken as proof or not, I think the symbolism is well worth thinking about. And since the Catholic Church has the power to bind and loose, if the Church were to declare that marriages happening outside were to be the new norm, then that would be the new norm. Until then, I am happy to obey the current norm.

~~ the phoenix

 

[agapewolf]

Given your behavior and the accusations you’re making about me, I feel I’ve been very respectful to you.

I haven’t “behaved” any way, nor accused you. Yet you’ve deleted context from my posts and made patronizing statements implying I wasn’t saying I read what I said I did. This is not respectful.

This started with one question was made about why the church has certain rules about a specific practice. It comes down to some basic reasonings, but also that the church has the ability to define how they want to practice its own sacraments, just as the state does.

This is a seperate issue from infallibility as it is a discipline.

But as very typical of most “Debates”, some how sex abuse, and other teachings make their way in to distract from the original point. It goes nowhere and is quite sad actually.

 

[Lycorth]

Erm, I was asking if that was the verse he meant, I didn’t imply anything more than that

I know, but that’s clearly become the tone of the thread - Sola Scriptura. Might as well just stop beating around the bush.

As for the Sola Scripture, I believe if we all go into depth with that now, that will derail the thread further.

Sure, but it’s already derailed. The cat’s out of the bag and the thread is now touching on something bigger than the original topic.

Not really, I want to know why having a wedding outdoors is so wrong.

It’s already been answered.

Man-made teachings is a good one, when have we made anything up that is outside scripture?

Sola Scriptura, for one. That’s not anywhere in the Scriptures.

 

[Suspicious_Mind]

Methinks you missed the last part of my previous post:

"And what’s this? Being excluded from a wedding for not having enough oil in a lamp, or for being late, or for not meeting a dress code? Some may feel Jesus is being harsh here … what He is doing is upholding the importance and respect due to rightful authority and legitimate tradition. It’s not just “anything goes” or “everybody make up your own mind how to behave based on your feelings.”

It’s not that I missed it, I didn’t feel there was much to respond to.

Very well, if a wedding guest actually turns up late for your wedding, turn them away then - This is the reason I didn’t really bother responding to it, get it now? You are mixing up metaphors with the literal.

This still has nothing to do with a marriage outdoors.

There is then, something in the Bible that indicates Jesus is in favor of respecting legitimate authority when it comes to marriage customs … and that covers such things as having oil in your lamp, arriving on time before the doors are shut, wearing proper wedding attire, and in our own day, holding weddings normally inside a church building.

“Normally” inside a church building, why not all the time? I think the main difference here is because these are things which are a part of good sense and also respect for the marriage. If people turned up in pyjamas, it’s obviously disrespect, having oil in the lamp is perhaps something that was significant in the day, we don’t have weddings with all the lights turned off in the dark.

This still has nothing against having a wedding outside.

As I said previously, I offered the Bible verses from Matthew as examples, finding it quite interesting how the symbolism of inside/outside ties in with our discussion. Whether it can be taken as proof or not, I think the symbolism is well worth thinking about. And since the Catholic Church has the power to bind and loose, if the Church were to declare that marriages happening outside were to be the new norm, then that would be the new norm. Until then, I am happy to obey the current norm.

~~ the phoenix

I think it’s an interesting point phoenix, but I don’t really feel this is very substantial in a case against marriage outdoors, it firstly is very metaphorical, especially in terms of the punishments. We obviously don’t cast out late comers and subject them to hellfire, or have them in darkness of the exterior.

Anyways, cheers!

 

[the_phoenix]

“Normally” inside a church building, why not all the time?

I’ll answer your question with information straight from the US Conference of Catholic Bishops.

nccbuscc.org/laity/marriage/marriagefaqs.shtml

1. Why does a Catholic wedding have to take place in a church?

For Catholics, marriage is not just a social or family event, but a church event. For this reason, the Church prefers that marriages between Catholics, or between Catholics and other Christians, be celebrated in the parish church of one of the spouses. Only the local bishop can permit a marriage to be celebrated in another suitable place.

1. If a Catholic wishes to marry in a place outside the Catholic church, how can he or she be sure that the marriage is recognized by the Catholic Church as valid?

The local bishop can permit a wedding in another church, or in another suitable place, for a sufficient reason. For example, a Catholic seeks to marry a Baptist whose father is the pastor of the local Baptist church. The father wants to officiate at the wedding. In these circumstances, the bishop could permit the couple to marry in the Baptist church. The permission in these instances is called a “dispensation from canonical form.”

Return cheers!

~~ the phoenix

 

[Lycorth]

Well said, phoenix!

Chaos ensues when order and discipline are not enforced. That is the logic behind any such ruling as this; we can only imagine the wacky abuses that would happen if Catholics were permitted to celebrate the holy sacraments anywhere we wanted and however we liked.

Funerals are performed in churches. Baptisms are performed in churches. Holy Orders are given in churches. Thus, it follows that marriages are performed in churches, also - this is the normal place for the sacraments. Naturally, there can be and are exceptions to the rule, and the bishop can and does give permission when one comes up - and of course there is Extreme Unction, which by necessity is performed wherever the near-death person is.

Normally, the sacraments are performed in church, where Jesus resides in the Blessed Sacrament. This should not be strange to anyone.

 

[the_phoenix]

Well said, phoenix!

Hail and well met, Lycorth!

Thanks, actually my last post was basically just quoting the Bishops’ website directly. You did a great job of expanding on the quotes, so return kudos to you are in order.

~~ the phoenix