Why Can't Catholics Participate in Protestant Open Communion services?

[TrueLight]

I know that if a Catholic attends a Protestant service, he is not to receive communion. I tried to explain that to a Catholic yesterday and my answers were woefully inadequate. Can you guys help me out?

– What is the reason that a Catholic cannot receive communion at a Church with Open Communion (meaning it doesn’t matter what denomination you are - everyone is welcome)?

– If there is no valid consecration and transubstantiation anyway, why can’t a Catholic receive in the spirit of brotherhood?

The person’s priest had told her that it is okay to receive in a Protestant church that has open communion, where you are not necessarily professing, by receiving, that you adhere to their beliefs.

What I have is the following:

CCC No. 1400
Ecclesial communities derived from the Reformation and separated from the Catholic Church, “have not preserved the proper reality of the Eucharistic mystery in its fullness, especially because of the absence of the sacrament of Holy Orders.” It is for this reason that, for the Catholic Church, Eucharistic intercommunion with these communities is not possible. However these ecclesial communities, “when they commemorate the Lord’s death and resurrection in the Holy Supper…profess that it signifies life in communion with Christ and await his coming in glory.”

Anything else?

Thanks.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Same reason we as Catholics cannot admit Protestants to our communion. . .

we are not ‘in communion’ with them.

By our reception of ‘their’ communion we are in essence saying, "This Protestant communion is the same as my Catholic communion, equally valid, and thus in receiving it I am indicating that I fully agree with all the Protestant teachings as represented in this action of communion.’

Ouch. Not good.

Also, Canon Law forbids the reception of the Eucharist, by a Catholic, from **anyone other than a Catholic priest, or in certain grave situations, by a priest from one of the communities (such as the Orthodox, if they’d allow it!) which has a valid apostolic succession of priests and valid Eucharist. **

Here is the Canon Law citation

844 §1 Catholic ministers may lawfully administer the sacraments only to catholic members of Christ’s faithful, who equally may lawfully receive them only from catholic ministers, except as provided in §§2, 3 and 4 of this canon and in can. 861 §2.
§2 Whenever necessity requires or a genuine spiritual advantage commends it, and provided the danger of error or indifferentism is avoided, Christ’s faithful for whom it is physically or morally impossible to approach a catholic minister, may lawfully receive the sacraments of penance, the Eucharist and anointing of the sick from non-catholic ministers in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Part 2
§3 Catholic ministers may lawfully administer the sacraments of penance, the Eucharist and anointing of the sick to members of the eastern Churches not in full communion with the catholic Church, if they spontaneously ask for them and are properly disposed. The same applies to members of other Churches which the Apostolic See judges to be in the same position as the aforesaid eastern Churches so far as the sacraments are concerned.
§4 If there is a danger of death or if, in the judgement of the diocesan Bishop or of the Episcopal Conference, there is some other grave and pressing need, catholic ministers may lawfully administer these same sacraments to other christians not in full communion with the catholic Church, who cannot approach a minister of their own community and who spontaneously ask for them, provided that they demonstrate the catholic faith in respect of these sacraments and are properly disposed.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

part 3
§5 In respect of the cases dealt with in §§2, 3 and 4, the diocesan Bishop or the Episcopal Conference is not to issue general norms except after consultation with the competent authority, at least at the local level, of the non-catholic Church or community concerned.

 

[TrueLight]

844 §1 Catholic ministers may lawfully administer the sacraments only to catholic members of Christ’s faithful, who equally may lawfully receive them only from catholic ministers, except as provided in §§2, 3 and 4 of this canon and in can. 861 §2.

Awesome. Thanks.

Same reason we as Catholics cannot admit Protestants to our communion. . .

we are not ‘in communion’ with them.

By our reception of ‘their’ communion we are in essence saying, "This Protestant communion is the same as my Catholic communion, equally valid, and thus in receiving it I am indicating that I fully agree with all the Protestant teachings as represented in this action of communion.’

But if they are saying, “We are doing this only as a sign of community”, Is it not possible to have a sense of community with other Christians? So in that case, the communion service would mean just that, nothing else?

Is it possible to to see the Protestant communion as totally different from the “real deal” but still participate?

 

[Heuchler]

Well true light, in taking their communion, it’s more than a sign of community. It is saying that I am in communion with their teachings, I believe what you believe regarding the truth and this specific communion. To take it would be acting out a lie. We are unfortunately not in communion and our beliefs differ, we can pray for a time when we can say all christians are in communion but at this point we can’t actually be in communion.

 

[TrueLight]

Well true light, in taking their communion, it’s more than a sign of community. It is saying that I am in communion with their teachings, I believe what you believe regarding the truth and this specific communion. To take it would be acting out a lie. We are unfortunately not in communion and our beliefs differ, we can pray for a time when we can say all christians are in communion but at this point we can’t actually be in communion.

Yeah.

It was easy for me to tell her the Church forbids it, although I couldn’t quote exactly where it says that. I’m still not sure it is easy to explain to her or even to Protestants that Catholics cannot even have a kumbaya moment with bread and wine that we don’t even believe is the Eucharist.

It would be one thing if the Protestant church believed they were actually turning the bread and wine into the body and blood because then we can say that it is invalid, etc. But if they don’t believe that… I dunno.

 

[Aelred_Minor]

To just add a few thoughts into the mix, another thing to consider is that in many Protestant traditions there is indeed a traditional belief that Jesus is somehow specially present in Communion, even if many members of that Church no longer believe it. That was the case in the United Methodist Church I grew up in. Thus to receive communion in such a church could be construed as implying you accept the sacramental validity of their communion. Also the practice of open communion generally reflects an ecclesiology of the “invisible church of all believers”, and receiving this communion could be construed as support for this ecclesiology. If they know you are a Catholic that could be even more scandalous, since generally they would know you are violating the rules of your own Church to do this.

Then there’s the perspective from one’s fellow Catholics to consider. Communion may not have all the same meanings in another community as it does in your own, but that doesn’t change the fact that from a Catholic perspective to receive communion from a community implies a degree of unity with them that is not in fact there, and so again could be a source of scandal for your fellow Catholics.

 

[runningdude]

For Catholics, receiving communion is an act of worship. While appearing as bread and wine, the Host and Cup presented at mass are in fact the Body and Blood of Christ, which we rightly worship. Without transubstantiation, we risk materially worshiping simple bread and wine. This is idolatry , which violates the First Commandment.

Protestants are not guilty of idolatry, however, as many have a faulty understanding of communion, believing it to be solely a memorial feast. For Catholics however, we have been revealed the truth of the Holy Eucharist, and must publicly uphold this belief by refraining from participating deficient communion services.

 

[Jim_Dandy]

This should have been covered in your instruction before you became a Catholic.

 

[TrueLight]

This should have been covered in your instruction before you became a Catholic.

It was covered enough for me to understand I shouldn’t receive communion in a Protestant Church. However, when people start asking you specific instructions using different cases, it almost becomes a matter of apologetics. And I am very much new.

Do you have anything of value to add?

 

[ConstantineTG]

Because communion literally means “commonality, a sharing and participation in the same thing”. If we partake of the communion of Protestant communities, it means we share in their faith and belief, which we do not. So it is a lie to them and to ourselves to do so. And it is a lie to our own Communion, the Eucharist, which is the real Body and Blood of Christ.

 

[Jim_Dandy]

It was covered enough for me to understand I shouldn’t receive communion in a Protestant Church. However, when people start asking you specific instructions using different cases, it almost becomes a matter of apologetics. And I am very much new.

Do you have anything of value to add?

As a convert myself, it concerns me that – based on what you wrote – you don’t seem disposed to accept the Church’s teaching. That makes me wonder if you were properly prepared to make the required commitment: “I believe everything the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church teaches.”

I’m still not sure it is easy to explain to her or even to Protestants that Catholics cannot even have a kumbaya moment with bread and wine that we don’t even believe is the Eucharist.

It would be one thing if the Protestant church believed they were actually turning the bread and wine into the body and blood because then we can say that it is invalid, etc. But if they don’t believe that… I dunno.

Here’s Jimmy Akin’s answer to your question. Please understand that I am not questioning you personally, but I’m wondering if your preparation for entering the Church was adequate. Your entry date would indicate that you did not go through RCIA where a lot of these issues are often ironed out.

jimmyakin.org/2005/01/communion_in_no.html

I wish you peace. I apologize if my concern offended you.

 

[TrueLight]

As a convert myself, it concerns me that – based on what you wrote – you don’t seem disposed to accept the Church’s teaching. That makes me wonder if you were properly prepared to make the required commitment: “I believe everything the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church teaches.”

Here’s Jimmy Akin’s answer to your question. Please understand that I am not questioning you personally, but I’m wondering if your preparation for entering the Church was adequate. Your entry date would indicate that you did not go through RCIA where a lot of these issues are often ironed out.

jimmyakin.org/2005/01/communion_in_no.html

I wish you peace. I apologize if my concern offended you.

In case you hadn’t noticed, I am asking for help in explaining to another Catholic why she cannot receive in a Protestant setting.

What concerns me is that every time you respond to a thread of mine, it is always in a disparaging way. If you have a problem with me, or if you have feelings of jealousy that I entered the church in a different way, maybe you shouldn’t respond to my posts?

My priest felt that I was ready and that’s what matters.

Your comments are not going to dissuade me from asking questions or starting threads or whatever, so I suggest you pray about what the real issue is.

I’d appreciate it if you really try to not respond to my posts, unless your goal is to antagonize or harass me.

 

[TrueLight]

Back to our regular scheduled programming. Thanks folks for your help.

As several of you have said, I think the best approach is to explain to her that receiving communion implies she is in agreement with the Protestant church’s teaching,and then I can send her a the link to the Code of Canon law. I will talk to her within the next week or so, and will let you know how it goes. She may need a new convert with zeal to remind her of her obligations.

Thanks!

 

[SmokeRing]

This still really doesn’t make sense in some circumstances. If one went to a liturgy at a Lutheran or Episcopal parish I could see how it would be very wrong for a Catholic to receive Holy Communion in such a setting because Caatholics do not believe their have the Real Presence yet they do.

On the other hand if you went to another church that specifically said their “Lord’s supper” was 100% symbolic I don’t see the big-deal harm in shooting down a shot-glass of Welches and chomping Sara Lee cheesecake square if one was thirsty and hungry. I wouldn’t do it, but I certainly wouldn’t equate their self-described simulation as an attempt at Holy Communion.

 

[Iron_Donkey]

This still really doesn’t make sense in some circumstances. If one went to a liturgy at a Lutheran or Episcopal parish I could see how it would be very wrong for a Catholic to receive Holy Communion in such a setting because Caatholics do not believe their have the Real Presence yet they do.

On the other hand if you went to another church that specifically said their “Lord’s supper” was 100% symbolic I don’t see the big-deal harm in shooting down a shot-glass of Welches and chomping Sara Lee cheesecake square if one was thirsty and hungry. I wouldn’t do it, but I certainly wouldn’t equate their self-described simulation as an attempt at Holy Communion.

The (or at least a) problem is that, in addition to saying that it is merely symbolic, they also say it’s what Christ commanded at the last supper. We do not believe that it is what Christ instituted. If they just wanted to get together and say a prayer along for Christian unity that’d be fine. But we can not participate in something that is claimed to be something it is not and which we would not be able to participate in if it were what it was claimed.

That is, the true Eucharist is the body and blood, soul and divinity of Christ, and taking it shows communion with the Church. To participate in this other thing which claims neither of those attributes but nevertheless says it is the same thing and hence misrepresents what communion is actually supposed to be is in some sense to belittle the actual Eucharist itself. It is tantamount to admitting that this awesome gift Christ instituted at the last supper can be validly presented as little more than some sort of unity cracker.

 

[TrueLight]

It is tantamount to admitting that this awesome gift Christ instituted at the last supper can be validly presented as little more than some sort of unity cracker.

I like the way you put that. Mind if I borrow it?

 

[Jim_Roberts]

I know that if a Catholic attends a Protestant service, he is not to receive communion. I tried to explain that to a Catholic yesterday and my answers were woefully inadequate. Can you guys help me out?

– What is the reason that a Catholic cannot receive communion at a Church with Open Communion (meaning it doesn’t matter what denomination you are - everyone is welcome)?

– If there is no valid consecration and transubstantiation anyway, why can’t a Catholi
*****************************************************************************************************CaCatholics cannot rece=ve Communion from Protestant churches because they are not in union with Rome, in other words, they don’t accept Rome as being the answer; also, they do not have a consecration that is valid, Our b elifs are not the same as Protestants, so if we receive communioin at one of their churches, this is a mockery of God!!!

I am sure you can attend the service WITHOUT receiving their communion.

JESUS I TRUST IN YOU

jr

 

[pismopal]

Why should I…as a Catholic, partake of a cracker and some grape juice while knowing in my heart that it is nothing more than that? The Church has Holy Communion… the Body Blood Soul and Divinity of Christ through the miracle of the Mass and Transubstatiation. This sacrament is the centerpiece of the differences between the Church and the tens of thousands of sects who to one extend or another…call themselves Christians.
I mean no disrespect but why would I want to do that…seriously? If you are in a protestant gathering for one reason or another…just let the cracker and juice go by and say a silent prayer for those we believe do not have Holy Communion that their eyes will open…that is a better use of your time IMO. If you are Catholic and you don’t know the difference between Catholic Holy Communion and a protestant communion maybe a little prayer for yourself would be better.