Why can't Mormons have caffinated drinks?

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Prince_Hal said:
Continued.

Can you just see a foreign magazine with a mock up of the president in his temple clothes with the Stars and Stripes and a mormon temple behind him, perhaps with a rifle in his hands if there is a conflict going on. This could ridicule the nation.

Yes the mormons are getting excited. If Romney wins then this was God confirming to the world that mormonism was the true religion. People are concerned that he will take orders from Salt Lake. But is this more concerning than a devout catholic taking orders from Rome ? Probably. If he wins, he will be the first non Christian president in history of the US. How does the pledge of allegiance work. I am not american. Any mention of God by the prewsident would be reference to a non christian god - an evil spirit - though oif course mormons would disagree.

no to clinton for me, no to romney, and guliani appears not to be trustworthy. Truelly we need God’s blessing.

Hal from California

now
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Thomas Jefferson could hardly be called a Christian. Several of our other Presidents were Unitarian. We don’t base our vote just on the denomination someone professes.
 
ralphinal said:
Not to change the subject, but Eisenhower was a JW
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His mother was.

I believe he settled into Presbyterianism…

What his own personal beliefs were, I can’t say. Obviously the JW tenants about military service and pledging allegiance to governments didn’t seem to play a big part of Gen. Eisenhower’s beliefs.

From: “Dwight D. Eisenhower” article on Wikipedia.com website (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dwight_D._Eisenhower; viewed 1 December 2005):
Eisenhower’s family originally belonged to the local River Brethren sect of the Mennonites. However, when Ike was five years old, his parents became followers of the WatchTower Society, whose members later took the name Jehovah’s Witnesses. The Eisenhower home served as the local WatchTower meeting Hall from 1896 to 1915, when Eisenhower’s father stopped regularly associating due to the WatchTower’s failed prophesies that Armageddon would occur in October 1914 and 1915. Ike’s father received a WatchTower funeral when he died in the 1940s. Ike’s mother continued as an active Jehovah’s Witness until her death. Ike and his brothers also stopped associating regularly after 1915. Ike enjoyed a close relationship with his mother throughout their lifetimes, and he even used a WatchTower printed Bible for his second Presidential Inauguration. In later years, Eisenhower was baptized, confirmed, and became a communicant in the Presbyterian church in a single ceremony on February 1, 1953, just weeks after his first inauguration as president. In his retirement years, he was a member of the Gettysburg Presbyterian Church in Gettysburg, Pennsylvania.
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Prince_Hal said:
Just a few thoughts regarding the previous posts. As many of you know, I am a Mormon bishop converting to Catholicism. I have been a Mormon for 20 odd years (no pun intended).
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Wow, that’s great to hear! 👍

Prayers and petitions on your journey,
Alexius
 
ASimpleSinner said:
This is very un-PC of me to say, so I will offer a caveat - this is just a theory a Catholic priest I know advanced. He believes the true root of this discipline has more to do with social control and strictures that set people apart for the sake of keeping them “in”. Dietary strictures in cults are very common… It is a way to show obedience and set yourself apart.
  1. “we have secret knowledge” (Book of Mormon)
  2. “we have secret ceremonies” (Temple)
  3. “we have special dietary laws” (Caffiene/alcohol ban)
These things from a purely sociological & pragmatic standpoint help to foster an “us” versus “them” sort of mentality. “We are the initiated.”
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Your “Catholic Priest” was obviously very shallow, superficial, and short-sighted. This is something that can be said of any religion, including yours; you just don’t think of it that way because they happen to be your method of “social control and strictures that set people apart for the sake of keeping them “in””.

The Jews were notorious for their detailed dietary laws and intricate religious rituals. Was not their religion established by God?

A Hindu looking at your religion can say the same things:
  1. “we have secret knowledge” (The Bible)
  2. “we have mysterious ceremonies” (The Sacraments; turning bread and wine into flesh and blood)
  3. “we have special dietary laws” (abstain from “meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled” (Acts 15:29))
These things from a purely sociological & pragmatic standpoint help to foster an “us” versus “them” sort of mentality. “We are the initiated.”

zerinus
 
At times I have to agree with Zerinus. Anyone on the outside looking in will see exclusion. I do not feel that it is a good course of conversation. I will say, though, that we should ask if those on the inside looking out always feel persicuted or that they should exclude those on the outside. That may be a more telling sign.
 
zerinus said:
Your “Catholic Priest” was obviously very shallow, superficial, and short-sighted. This is something that can be said of any religion, including yours; you just don’t think of it that way because they happen to be your method of “social control and strictures that set people apart for the sake of keeping them “in””.

The Jews were notorious for their detailed dietary laws and intricate religious rituals. Was not their religion established by God?

A Hindu looking at your religion can say the same things:
  1. “we have secret knowledge” (The Bible)
  2. “we have mysterious ceremonies” (The Sacraments; turning bread and wine into flesh and blood)
  3. “we have special dietary laws” (abstain from “meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled” (Acts 15:29))
These things from a purely sociological & pragmatic standpoint help to foster an “us” versus “them” sort of mentality. “We are the initiated.”

zerinus
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Why do you put “Catholic priest” in quotes?

You note it as “shallow, superficial, and short-sighted” and then illustrate how this is a sort of truism for Christianity in general otherwise. Interesting.

Maybe you can share with us why Mormons can’t have caffinated drinks?
 
Mormons consider caffeine a drug, and they do not believe in putting any type of drug into their bodies.
 
there is none. there is also no LDS prohibition against using medicines either. The prohibition is against “strong drink” (defined as alcohol), “hot drinks” (defined as tea and coffee). Modern developments include illegal drugs and abuse of legal drugs. (defined as taking without prescription and/or exceeding prescribed dosage). That same scripture though also says to eat meat sparingly even stating they should only consumed in times of cold or famine. funny how LDS have quibled over caffeine (is sanka okay? what about Dr. Pepper?) and yet have no problem consuming large quantities of meat year round? it just seems inconsistent. originally it wasn’t a commandment though…just advice. Brigham Young made it law…course that didn’t stop him from running distillery, winery, brewery, trying to grow tea and coffee in utah, and trading tobacco for fun and profit.
 
ASimpleSinner said:
In turn why should you?

It seems to suggest that you mocking the office.

A Catholic priest is Catholic priest not a “Catholic priest”.
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I also put “social control and strictures that set people apart for the sake of keeping them “in”” in quotes. Do you think that means that I was “mocking you”?

zerinus
 
zerinus said:
I also put “social control and strictures that set people apart for the sake of keeping them “in”” in quotes. Do you think that means that I was “mocking you”?

zerinus
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“social control and strictures that set people apart for the sake of keeping them “in”” was a direct quote, it belonged in quotations. “Catholic priest” does not.

So I think you may have been mocking me.

Maybe you could directly answer the question -

Why do you put “Catholic priest” in quotes?
 
ASimpleSinner said:
“social control and strictures that set people apart for the sake of keeping them “in”” was a direct quote, it belonged in quotations. “Catholic priest” does not.
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Why not? “Catholic priest” was as much a direct quote from you as was “social control and strictures that set people apart for the sake of keeping them “in””. What was the difference?

zerinus
 
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