Why cant priests marry when Peter, the first Pope, was married?

[nute]

One of the mysteries of faith is that God gives us the grace to handle what he calls us to do.

Are we asking too much of priests to ask them to be celibate? Well, God is asking this of them and he is gracing them heavily as well. The calling to the priesthood is not a calling of men, but one from God the high priest.

I feel for women at times, priests can be very attractive. The priest should not be pursued romantically. Be friends with him and take him to a meal, but don’t flirt. If a priest is unhappy in his vocation and vulnerable to the temptation to dump it, pray for him and seek professional help for him. Connect him with his bishop.

I don’t know a lot about the discernment process for religious life. I do know that celibacy is a free choice for religious. The priest’s vocation can be strengthened by the community around him the same way a community can strengthen a married couple.

 

[Elizium23]

thats a good question. frankly this whole celibacy thing is just ridiculous. the eastern church where it is allowed for priests to marry have no scandals.
bring back married priests now!

O RLY? What is your source and evidence for this outlandish assertion?

 

[loverofdebates]

Jesus who is our High priest, never married and fasted in the desert for 40 days just before he was crucified, we can at least give up meat on Friday to pray like him and feel like he felt.

Is your qoute biblical teachings? Does jesus says if you become priest dont marry or follow me not to marry. The answer is no. But instead its happen, The teachings in 1 tim 4.1:3 is a definite true.

 

[Sandra_M]

Thank you for your thoughts on this issue of should a priest be allowed to marry and various pros and cons on this subject. I joined the Catholic church in 2009 and I was confused and all of you have given me information I so appreciate and again thank you as I am still learning. I wanted to address this with our pastor of my Catholic church but could not for whatever reason I am not certain,. Sandra M

 

[Robyn_p]

but you have to admit that youd probably feel safer leaving your child unattended with a married men who has an active sex life with his wife. as opposed to this:
meet Harry, Harry is 40 years old and says he has never touched a woman. he also says he LOVES kids. Harry would like to babysit for you this weekend. would you give him a job lol?

and there are many other good reasons why priests should be allowed to marry. look at the dwindling number of vocations. I think it might have something to do with the ban on marriage lol. its unfair to ask someone to choose between priesthood and married life. much more people would like to be priests if they could marry. i for one would like to be a priest, but i want to marry and have children even more.
so this rule has to change in my opinion. the deacon at my church is married and he gives great sermons sometimes, even better than the priests!

You make it sound like if someone’s not having sex they have some problem and they have to find some release so therefore they will rape a kid. Huh?!? That’s insulting to those of us who are remaining chaste! If there’s a guy who has enough discipline and self-control to give up marriage for the sake of Christ, I would actually trust him just as much as a married man, maybe even more. Celibacy doesn’t cause rape, it’s a perverted view of the human person - where people exist solely for your own pleasure - that leads to rape.
And the data does not add up to what you were saying either. Sadly, the group with the highest percentage of child abusers is family members: Fathers, mothers, step-mothers, step-fathers, uncles and aunts. And these people are usually married. There’s tons of saints who were celibates who lived great holy lives. (Mother Teresa anyone?) And there’s lots of married saints as well, it’s whatever God calls you too.

Also, theres no reason to think that the drop in vocations has anything to do with celibacy. If celibacy was something new and right when that came around there was a shortage of priests, then maybe you are right, but that’s simply not the case. It’s because people have lost the knowledge of the awesomeness of Catholicism and the priesthood that there’s a shortage. They dont think religion even matters, so why would they even consider priesthood? Celibacy is a convenient scapegoat but its only ignoring the real problem, in that our people aren’t being catechized properly. Getting rid of celibacy will not fix that whatsoever. But actually the tide is turning and there’s a whole new wave of young vibrant priests coming in who are in love with Christ and his church, I know a few.

Finally, celibacy is a beautiful gift to the Church. It’s a sign that there’s more to this life than pleasure and God is the one who matters most. This doesn’t degrade marriage, but as St. Paul himself said, “he who marries does well, but he who does not marry does better.”

 

[Karen107]

St Paul said Imitate me as I imitate Christ. St Paul didn’t marry and was also celibate as Jesus was, because he devoted himself to Christ and built up the church as the great evangelizer.

1 Corinthians 11:1 Be imitators of me, as I am of Christ.

To answer your question. St. Paul was probably paying attention to what Jesus said on this matter.

Matthew 19:10 The disciples said to him, “If such is the case of a man with his wife, it is not expedient to marry.” 11 But he said to them, “Not all men can receive this precept, but only those to whom it is given. 12 For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. He who is able to receive this, let him receive it.”

eunich by definition in wiki

A eunuch (pron.: /ˈjuːnək/; Greek: Ευνούχος) is a man who (by the common definition of the term) may have been castrated, typically early enough in his life for this change to have major hormonal consequences. Less commonly, in translations of ancient texts, “eunuch” may refer to a man who is not castrated but who is impotent, celibate or otherwise not inclined to marry and procreate.

 

[guanophore]

My main concern is are we expecting too much from our priest?

We do, but it is not about expectations of sexual continence.

OUr priests need our emotional and spiritual support. They need prayer, and friends. They need to be surrounded by a loving community.

We also fail to understand that the duty of the priest is to equip the faithful for the work of the ministry, but the work of the ministry is OURS (laypeople). Too many expect the ordained to do all the work.

 

[guanophore]

Your reasons are mere opinion.

It seems that you have confused the teachings of the Apostles for mere opinions of humans. This is an error.

The doctrines handed down once for all are a matter of divine revelation, not personal opinion.

Catholic authority yes forbid to marry and it is the law implemented.

No, loverofdebates, this is incorrect. Marriage is not forbidden by the Catholic Church. However, since you assert that it is, please produce a Catholic document that will verify what you are claiming.

I can save you some time. You will not find one, because it does not exist.

The fact that the Latin Rite prefers to choose from among those called to be eunuchs for the Kingdom of heaven to serve as priests has nothing to do with “law implemented” (whatever that means)? It is a pastoral discipline.

Does the bible teaches all clergy not to marry,

No. And since the Bible is a Catholic book, written by, for and about Catholics, there is nothing in it that is not Catholic. Neither can there be any contradiction between the Scirpture and the Church teaching, since both come from the same Source.

 yes there is in the bible qoutes better not to marry in order not to divide attentio in serving the church but teaching not to marry as a law is a demonic teaching.

Exactly! The Latin Rite chooses from among those who do not have divided attentions to serve as priests!

There are no laws in the CC against marriage.

The food in other translation is meat. Catholic authority order that in every friday of lenten, all catholics faithful to observe abstinence of eating meat.

Yes, but this is a temporary fast, in honor of the fact that Jesus gave His flesh for us on the cross. When the fasting is over, we no longer abstain from meat.

Matt 9:15-16
15 And Jesus said to them, "The wedding guests cannot mourn as long as the bridegroom is with them, can they? The days will come when the bridegroom is taken away from them, and then they will fast.

Does your religious belief forbid fasting?

 

[guanophore]

thats a good question. frankly this whole celibacy thing is just ridiculous. the eastern church where it is allowed for priests to marry have no scandals.
bring back married priests now!

Priests in the Eastern Church are not allowed to marry either.

There are plenty of scandals everywhere, so don’t think that because the violations of Latin Rite priests are popular in the American media there are not problems elsewhere.

The Latin Church desperately needs the godly fire that burns in those who are called to celibacy.

 

[guanophore]

but you have to admit that youd probably feel safer leaving your child unattended with a married men who has an active sex life with his wife.  as opposed to this:

meet Harry, Harry is 40 years old and says he has never touched a woman. he also says he LOVES kids. Harry would like to babysit for you this weekend. would you give him a job lol?

Certainly it is difficult not to be suspicious, and parents should exercise caution in protecting their children. However, the duty of the priest is to bring the sacraments to the faithful, not provide babysitting.

and there are many other good reasons why priests should be allowed to marry. look at the dwindling number of vocations.

Actually vocations are on the rise, especially in very traditional parishes and programs. the so called “vocation crisis” has nothing to do with the discipline of celibacy. Most priests come from large Catholic families, which are really what is dwindling. The majority of priests are between the 3-5 born child. How many families do you know that have 3-5 children? This is more a crisis of marriage, and specifically birth control, than the fact that people answer the call to serve. If a person is aborted, they will never be able to become a priest.

I think it might have something to do with the ban on marriage lol.

When was the last time you encouraged a young man to think about the priesthood? Do you know ANYONE who has ever encouraged a young man to discern this vocation? Do you pray to the Lord of the Harvest to send workers into the field? Do you know anyone who does?

its unfair to ask someone to choose between priesthood and married life.

Why?

Who makes the rules for “fair”?

Was it “unfair” for Jesus to have to give His life for us?

Was it “unfair” to ask His Apostles to sacrifice everything?

Mark 10:28

28 Peter began to say to him, “Look, we have left everything and followed you.”

Besides, it is not a matter of the person “choosing between the priesthood and married life”. Both of these are full time vocations. God calls people according to His own design, and it is incumbent upon us to answer the call. Who are we, the created, to say to the Creator “its not fair!”

Young men don’t just “choose” the priesthood as one chooses a major in college or some other job or career. They must participate in a rigorous discernment process, and most of them realize that the priesthood is not for them. Some, the church decides not to enlist in this service.

much more people would like to be priests if they could marry.

Really? Do you have any evidence to support this claim?

i for one would like to be a priest, but i want to marry and have children even more.

I recommend some study of the faith, reading and writing first.

so this rule has to change in my opinion.

A position that clearly indicates you are not a good candidate for the priesthood.

the deacon at my church is married and he gives great sermons sometimes, even better than the priests!

Perhaps, after you spend some time with the catechism, and working on your literary skills, you could investigate the diaconate?

 

[guanophore]

Is your qoute biblical teachings? Does jesus says if you become priest dont marry or follow me not to marry. The answer is no. But instead its happen,

Matt 19:12
12 For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by others, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let anyone accept this who can."

No, each person has their own gift. Those who have been given the gift of celibacy should accept the gift. Those who have recieved this gift that are called by the Church to serve as priests should accept that too.

The teachings in 1 tim 4.1:3 is a definite true.

Not sure which verses you are referring to here. Your method of citation is somewhat …unique.

The Catholic church does not forbid marriage to anyone. Those who serve as priests enter into a vow of celibacy of their own free will.

 

[loverofdebates]

You make it sound like if someone’s not having sex they have some problem and they have to find some release so therefore they will rape a kid. Huh?!? That’s insulting to those of us who are remaining chaste! If there’s a guy who has enough discipline and self-control to give up marriage for the sake of Christ, I would actually trust him just as much as a married man, maybe even more. Celibacy doesn’t cause rape, it’s a perverted view of the human person - where people exist solely for your own pleasure - that leads to rape.
And the data does not add up to what you were saying either. Sadly, the group with the highest percentage of child abusers is family members: Fathers, mothers, step-mothers, step-fathers, uncles and aunts. And these people are usually married. There’s tons of saints who were celibates who lived great holy lives. (Mother Teresa anyone?) And there’s lots of married saints as well, it’s whatever God calls you too.

Also, theres no reason to think that the drop in vocations has anything to do with celibacy. If celibacy was something new and right when that came around there was a shortage of priests, then maybe you are right, but that’s simply not the case. It’s because people have lost the knowledge of the awesomeness of Catholicism and the priesthood that there’s a shortage. They dont think religion even matters, so why would they even consider priesthood? Celibacy is a convenient scapegoat but its only ignoring the real problem, in that our people aren’t being catechized properly. Getting rid of celibacy will not fix that whatsoever. But actually the tide is turning and there’s a whole new wave of young vibrant priests coming in who are in love with Christ and his church, I know a few.

Finally, celibacy is a beautiful gift to the Church. It’s a sign that there’s more to this life than pleasure and God is the one who matters most. This doesn’t degrade marriage, but as St. Paul himself said, “he who marries does well, but he who does not marry does better.”

But the qoutes given by paul in his last phrases are all his opinion. Since advocating the teachings and implementing not to marry is a devils teaching. 1 tim 4:1-3

 

[Gorgias]

But the qoutes given by paul in his last phrases are all his opinion. Since advocating the teachings and implementing not to marry is a devils teaching. 1 tim 4:1-3

Hmm. I think you’re tap-dancing around 1 Timothy 4 too much.

Let me ask you a question: does the government in the U.S. (through the particular states) forbid people from driving? (I would be extremely surprised if you answered ‘yes’! ) Yet, the government does provide a set of rules and regulations about who may drive and who may not – it sets up laws that say that a certain subset of the population may drive, and lays down the laws that say who meets those qualifications.

Now, given that this is the case, you wouldn’t say “the U.S. government forbids people to drive”, would you? Yet, that seems to be what your interpretation of 1 Tim claims! After all, the Catholic Church doesn’t say “no one is allowed to get married!” – which is, after all, the claim that Paul is making in 1 Timothy 4. Rather, what the Church is doing is setting down the rules and regulations about valid marriage. By doing so, they are not forbidding marriage, but rather, validly regulating it. Paul doesn’t say that in the end times, some groups will regulate marriage – instead, he says that some will forbid it. Big difference there…

 

[Church_Militant]

Your reasons are mere opinion. Catholic authority yes forbid to marry and it is the law implemented. Does the bible teaches all clergy not to marry, yes there is in the bible qoutes better not to marry in order not to divide attentio in serving the church but teaching not to marry as a law is a demonic teaching. The food in other translation is meat. Catholic authority order that in every friday of lenten, all catholics faithful to observe abstinence of eating meat.

Opinion? I think not., Take careful note of who’s speaking in the following passage.

Matthew 19:10-12
"10 His disciples say unto him: If the case of a man with his wife be so, it is not expedient to marry.11 Who said to them: All men take not this word, but they to whom it is given. 12 For there are eunuchs, who were born so from their mother’s womb: and there are eunuchs, who were made so by men: and there are eunuchs, who have made themselves eunuchs for the kingdom of heaven. He that can take, let him take it. "

Yet only the Catholic Church encourages this commitment commended to us by Our Blessed Lord Jesus Christ Himself. A doctrine of demons? I’d be more careful about making such a statement because Our Lord also said that blaspheming the Holy Spirit is the only unforgivable sin.

As for those who think we need a married clergy and are fooled into believing that celibacy is a factor in the sex abuse scandals, you need to actually do your own homework. (sex abuse Protestant - Google Search) The fact is that married men are more often guilty of this it’s about as bad among n-Cs as it has been with us except that we get more press.

For an in depth Bible study on this, I’d suggest my blog article Priestly celibacy is unBiblical. NOT! .

 

[Porknpie]

I recommend some study of the faith, reading and writing first.

Perhaps, after you spend some time with the catechism, and working on your literary skills, you could investigate the diaconate?

Lover,

Supporting Guanophores point above…suggest…

• listening to the US Catechism on Audio CD that is reference in my signature …
• reading all the tracts on CAF. catholic.com/tracts
• find a Catholic bible and read it along with the Catechism.

 

[Sandra_M]

This is an excellent question in my mind. As a rather new 2009 Catholic I can get confused or misunderstand church teachings. This forum is excellent for me and my only disappointment in this forum is that some members, not many, are too fast to put down a member who has a question or a thought. Be kind as that is what Christians do and this is a church teaching… Please post your opinion or facts whatever but remember we must not judge others just give your own information without a put down to the other person. Sandra M

 

[Arizona_Mike]

Priests in the Eastern Church are not allowed to marry either.

There are plenty of scandals everywhere, so don’t think that because the violations of Latin Rite priests are popular in the American media there are not problems elsewhere.

The Latin Church desperately needs the godly fire that burns in those who are called to celibacy.

For what it’s worth, most Buddhist monks, who function as their clergy, take vows of celibacy and can’t marry (although a few minority liberal sects in Korea and elsewhere have abandoned such vows and allow them to take alternative forms of ordination that allow marriage - the vast majority of Buddhists require celibacy).

Many people who aren’t even Catholic object to Catholic priestly celibacy (Why? They don’t have a dog in the hunt), yet don’t object to the Buddhist demands for celibacy in their clergy - or their teachings on homosexuality and fornication, which largely mirror the Catholic positions.

An additional good reason for celibacy among Catholic priests is the issue of the vows of poverty in many orders, such as the Franciscans and Jesuits - should a father accept a lifestyle of poverty for his children just because he is a Father? How will he provide for education, etc.? Orders that require such vows have a communal commitment that their order will provide for health care, lodging, etc., but it places a heavier burden on the order if they would have to provide for the members’ children. It could also lead to greater friction between the members of the order, as a Jesuit with 5 or 6 or 7 children would use more of the order’s scarce resources than one who remains celibate. An additional source of friction would be the greater conflicting demands of family duties - if the celibate members have to continually fill in for pastoral duties, middle-of-the-night calls for last rites, cover confession, teach classes, etc., because the priest with children has a sick child, has to attend a parent-teacher conference, a kid’s baseball game, etc. That’s a conflict in many offices between those with children and those who are single, I would imagine the same issues would exist in a religious order. If the needs of the order require the priest to relocate and the wife has her own career, there are additional problems, particularly if her paycheck is bringing in most of the family income - will there be a greater pull to abandon the priesthood in such a case to provide a better life for the children? If the unhappy issue of divorce happens and a wife leaves her priestly husband, who pays alimony? Who pays child support? The order? The diocese?

I’m sure these issues could be worked out with a supportive spouse, and they are issues the Protestant clergy have had to reckon with, but they don’t take vows of poverty and it adds levels of complexity to the vocation.

 

[Arizona_Mike]

but you have to admit that youd probably feel safer leaving your child unattended with a married men who has an active sex life with his wife. as opposed to this:
meet Harry, Harry is 40 years old and says he has never touched a woman. he also says he LOVES kids. Harry would like to babysit for you this weekend. would you give him a job lol?

Before marriage, I was celibate for many years. I thought about women a lot, but never thought about child molestation. Normal people don’t become child molesters because they are celibate. That view is inane.

The high rate of child molestation among married fathers, among secular youth group leaders, as well the rate of molestation among married clergy in the Protestant, Jewish, Muslim, LDS, and every other denomination (currently higher than among Catholic priests), shows us that celibacy is not the cause of molestation.

 

[fxcc]

This is true, 1 tim 4:1-3. The devils teachings that the first church of christ was vanished. Know who is the religion promulgating this teaching? The only two teachins given as a sign who teaches the demonic doctrine hidden in white clothes. Forbidden to eat meat as abstinence. The second teachings by them.

1st Timothy 4:1-3 *"Now the Spirit manifestly saith, that in the last times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to spirits of error, and doctrines of devils, Speaking lies in hypocrisy, and having their conscience seared, Forbidding to marry, to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving by the faithful, and by them that have known the truth.“Forbidding to marry, to abstain from meats”… *

In this passage Paul is speaking of the Gnostics, the Marcionites, the Eneratites, the Manicheans and other ancient heretics, who absolutely condemned marriage, and the use of all kind of meat; because they pretended that all flesh was from an evil principle. Whereas the Church, far from condemning marriage, holds it as a holy sacrament; and forbids it to none except those who have chosen the better part (virginity/celibacy): and prohibits not the use of any meats WHATSOEVER; though she does not judge all kind of diet proper for days of fasting and penance.

So, the admonition about heretics who forbid to marry is directed at the heretics of that day and has nothing WHATSOEVER to do with those who willingly take a vow of celibacy for the sake of their service of God. The quoted scripture passage really has no relevance to the topic under discussion here.

 

[guanophore]

1st Timothy 4:1-3 *"Now the Spirit manifestly saith, that in the last times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to spirits of error, and doctrines of devils, Speaking lies in hypocrisy, and having their conscience seared, Forbidding to marry, to abstain from meats, which God hath created to be received with thanksgiving by the faithful, and by them that have known the truth.“Forbidding to marry, to abstain from meats”… *

In this passage Paul is speaking of the Gnostics, the Marcionites, the Eneratites, the Manicheans and other ancient heretics, who absolutely condemned marriage, and the use of all kind of meat; because they pretended that all flesh was from an evil principle. Whereas the Church, far from condemning marriage, holds it as a holy sacrament; and forbids it to none except those who have chosen the better part (virginity/celibacy): and prohibits not the use of any meats WHATSOEVER; though she does not judge all kind of diet proper for days of fasting and penance.

So, the admonition about heretics who forbid to marry is directed at the heretics of that day and has nothing WHATSOEVER to do with those who willingly take a vow of celibacy for the sake of their service of God. The quoted scripture passage really has no relevance to the topic under discussion here.

Thank you fxcc. You have studied your heresies!

I would say it is relative to the extent that it exemplifies how people come up with an objection to this Church discipline. They read such a passage, take it out of context, and use it unjustly to try to find fault with the successors of the Apostles. Detractors will go to any lengths to deny the authority that Jesus has placed in the Church.