Why Catholic's can NOT be doctors or pharmacists

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FullOfThought said:
I am so glad I started this thread!!

I have not heard any of these stories… I have not found 1 Catholic doctor… and Physicians for Life told me that in America doctors can’t refuse to give contraception under the law!!

Does anybody know HOW these physicians manage this?

thank you thank you thank you!!!
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There is nothing to manage, the doctors in question are within their legal rights to not prescribe ABC. Physicians for Life gave you incorrect information. In the US, physicians can refuse to prescribe birth control for ethical reasons. Heck, I know doctors who don’t prescribe certain other medications (nothing to do with birth control) because they think the risks outweigh the benefits. Go to onemoresoul.com and you’ll find listings of NFP only doctors all over the country.

You really don’t know a single Catholic doctor? Both my OB/GYN and family practicioner are Catholic (although the OBGYN is not NFP only).
 
The issue here isn’t that Catholic’s can’t/shouldn’t be doctors. The issue here is that in this case you’d have to exercise your rights at the expense of others’ rights. For example, if you are a doctor, your job is to listen to the patient and provide medical information. You cannot impose your religious beliefs on others. This means that you cannot deny someone medical treatment just because your own religion disapproves.

Likewise, it is difficult for a Catholic doctor to prescribe something that is against Catholic beliefs. But the patient might not be Catholic, and you can’t force them to be by refusing to treat them, or judging them for not being Catholic like you are. But as a Catholic it’s difficult to do **anything **that is in contrast to what you are taught is religiously right. Other people’s religions may be different. And then your patient won’t be getting all of their options, because as a Catholic there are certain treatments you just won’t approve. If we support the Catholic doctor, then the patient does not get all of their treatment options. Likewise, if we support the patient, the Catholic doctor has to draw up treatment plans or prescribe meds that the doctor is religiously opposed to.

Definitely a lose-lose situation. You can’t support one’s rights without putting the other at a disadvantage. To ensure that you are getting information on all your options, you could ask for a doctor who isn’t Catholic, but what a waste of a brilliant mind just because a patient is afraid they might get a Catholic doctor who won’t approve. If I was a doctor, I would use my medical knowledge during the workday and then just pray that the patient chooses to do whatever is right. But as a doctor I would have no right to tell the patient, ‘look, this is a sin so I won’t let you do that even though it would solve your medical problem.’ I would give a patient all of his/her options and then just go home and pray that whatever decisions they make, that they make their peace with God about it. By prescribing birth control, for example, you are not forcing someone or telling someone to take it, you’re just giving someone all of their medical options. I know what is right and wrong in my own life personally, but I wholeheartedly support other people’s rights to make their own choices and decisions based on what is going on in their own lives. As long as they have made their peace with God about it, I wouldn’t feel bad about prescribing something that will help them medically.
 
In_Training said:
The issue here isn’t that Catholic’s can’t/shouldn’t be doctors. The issue here is that in this case you’d have to exercise your rights at the expense of others’ rights. For example, if you are a doctor, your job is to listen to the patient and provide medical information. You cannot impose your religious beliefs on others. This means that you cannot deny someone medical treatment just because your own religion disapproves.

Likewise, it is difficult for a Catholic doctor to prescribe something that is against Catholic beliefs. But the patient might not be Catholic, and you can’t force them to be by refusing to treat them, or judging them for not being Catholic like you are. But as a Catholic it’s difficult to do **anything **that is in contrast to what you are taught is religiously right. Other people’s religions may be different. And then your patient won’t be getting all of their options, because as a Catholic there are certain treatments you just won’t approve. If we support the Catholic doctor, then the patient does not get all of their treatment options. Likewise, if we support the patient, the Catholic doctor has to draw up treatment plans or prescribe meds that the doctor is religiously opposed to.

Definitely a lose-lose situation. You can’t support one’s rights without putting the other at a disadvantage. To ensure that you are getting information on all your options, you could ask for a doctor who isn’t Catholic, but what a waste of a brilliant mind just because a patient is afraid they might get a Catholic doctor who won’t approve. If I was a doctor, I would use my medical knowledge during the workday and then just pray that the patient chooses to do whatever is right. But as a doctor I would have no right to tell the patient, ‘look, this is a sin so I won’t let you do that even though it would solve your medical problem.’ I would give a patient all of his/her options and then just go home and pray that whatever decisions they make, that they make their peace with God about it. By prescribing birth control, for example, you are not forcing someone or telling someone to take it, you’re just giving someone all of their medical options. I know what is right and wrong in my own life personally, but I wholeheartedly support other people’s rights to make their own choices and decisions based on what is going on in their own lives. As long as they have made their peace with God about it, I wouldn’t feel bad about prescribing something that will help them medically.
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As long as the doctor is forthcoming about the fact that they do not prescribe contraceptives or abortifacients, I fail to see the issue. My family practice doctors have a sign prominently displayed in their ofice to that effect. Patients going there KNOW that they aren’t going to get birth control. And using/prescribing the drugs used as oral contraceptives as a treatment for a medical issue (such as PCOS) is NOT a sin. A person can take the hormonal pills that are typically prescribed as birth control if the purpose is to treat a legitimate ailment (not for the purpose of contracepting, although that may be a side effect) . So that argument doesn’t hold up.
 
In_Training said:
The issue here isn’t that Catholic’s can’t/shouldn’t be doctors. The issue here is that in this case you’d have to exercise your rights at the expense of others’ rights. For example, if you are a doctor, your job is to listen to the patient and provide medical information. You cannot impose your religious beliefs on others. This means that you cannot deny someone medical treatment just because your own religion disapproves.
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Pregnancy is not a disease. Fertility does not need to be treated.
 
maryjk said:
Pregnancy is not a disease. Fertility does not need to be treated.
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I never said it was. Medicines that are thought of as “birth control” can be used to treat many medical ailments. It can be used for more than just birth control, so why eliminate it completely when it could really help somewhere?

And I’m talking about medical and health check-ups on all levels, not just birth control. I don’t have the right to tell others how to live - I could only provide medical information. Nothing else.
 
In_Training said:
I never said it was. Medicines that are thought of as “birth control” can be used to treat many medical ailments. It can be used for more than just birth control, so why eliminate it completely when it could really help somewhere?

And I’m talking about medical and health check-ups on all levels, not just birth control. I don’t have the right to tell others how to live - I could only provide medical information. Nothing else.
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Because it doesn’t help, much less than “really help” somewhere. hormonal birth control is a class 1 carcinogen, and is pretty much the worst thing for a woman’s body.

AND they all have potential to be abortive.

But…we don’t have a right to tell others how to live and not kill people.
 
In_Training said:
I never said it was. Medicines that are thought of as “birth control” can be used to treat many medical ailments. It can be used for more than just birth control, so why eliminate it completely when it could really help somewhere?

And I’m talking about medical and health check-ups on all levels, not just birth control. I don’t have the right to tell others how to live - I could only provide medical information. Nothing else.
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Not exactly true. You can use hormones that are not specifically “birth control” to achieve the same result in many, if not most, cases.
 
In_Training said:
I never said it was. Medicines that are thought of as “birth control” can be used to treat many medical ailments. It can be used for more than just birth control, so why eliminate it completely when it could really help somewhere?
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Name them.
Name the conditions or diseased that birth control pills TREAT. But name only the ones where birth control pills are the ONLY treatment. Or even where birth control pills are the BEST.
And I’m talking about medical and health check-ups on all levels, not just birth control. I don’t have the right to tell others how to live - I could only provide medical information. Nothing else.
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Do you feel the same way about abortion? That you don’t have the right to tell others how to live.
 
In_Training said:
I never said it was. Medicines that are thought of as “birth control” can be used to treat many medical ailments. It can be used for more than just birth control, so why eliminate it completely when it could really help somewhere?

And I’m talking about medical and health check-ups on all levels, not just birth control. I don’t have the right to tell others how to live - I could only provide medical information. Nothing else.
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Since the Church allows Catholics to use “the pill” for non-contraceptive purposes to treat various medical problems, there is no reason a doctor who doesn’t prescribe then as contraceptives couldn’t prescribe the hormonal pills for a legitimate medical reason if that was the best option for treating a condition.
 
FullOfThought said:
I’ll warn you right now, this has the ability to be contraversial! I do not mean to insult anybody, so please take this with a pinch of salt!

So, I am wondering what your opinion is of the statement that Catholic’s cannot be pharmacists, doctors or any medical career that provides contraception to the public.

My story- I am in medical school and I transferred to become a chiropractor as I completely disagree with contraception under ALL circumstances… I completely believe the Church teachings about contraception. During my journeys I asked many doctors if they had prescribed contraception, and they all said that they had not only provided contraception to many people but had also referred patients to other physicians/clinics for IVF, STERILITY and ABORTIONS. Even practicing as a family physicans or choosing to specialize you still encounter these often, and due to laws in America you cannot refuse care to patients, and referals are considered to be providing these services.

Here is my question:* Under the assumption that a person follows and believes the Catholic Church teaching, knowing that being a pharmacist/physician that you WILL have to provide contraception to patients and/or refer patients for abortons, sterility and IVF treatments, do you think that it is acceptable for a Catholic to be in these careers?*

Thank you,
FOT
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I think it’s more than acceptable, even a necessity, for Catholics to choose careers as physicians, nurses and pharmacists…otherwise who will care for Catholics and keep in mind the teachings of the Church?

I can understand someone having reservations about being a physician or nurse in the field of women’s health, because it’s very difficult to avoid contraceptives, etc.

But as a med-surg nurse, I hardly ever encounter these situations. In fact, in the two years I’ve been a nurse, I’ve only had one patient in the hospital who took birth control pills, and she kept them at the bedside and took them herself, so I had nothing to do with it at all whatsoever. And neither did any of the physicians. I only had to deal with her other medications and treatments, none of them related to women’s health.

If you’re worried about practicing medicine, why can’t you just stay away from women’s health or practice it in a Catholic environment?
 
I didn’t realize I was talking to a panel of doctors with medical degrees who know what’s best for a person better than that person and his/her doctor does.

Name them? You can look it up. You have Google and you might even have access to many doctors in your area too that you can ask. And yes, I don’t feel that I have the right to tell others how to live. That’s God’s job. You can give a person advice until they don’t want it anymore, and then once they don’t want it anymore, you have to stop. Some people have such an issue with controlling others “in the name of religion.” Even Jesus accepted everyone, he preached but did not try to control anyone. He loved everyone for who they were, even if He didn’t agree with their choices. If a person makes their peace with God about whatever it is that they’re doing, I have no right to try to control their decisions.
 
In_Training said:
I didn’t realize I was talking to a panel of doctors with medical degrees who know what’s best for a person better than that person and his/her doctor does.

Name them? You can look it up. You have Google and you might even have access to many doctors in your area too that you can ask. And yes, I don’t feel that I have the right to tell others how to live. That’s God’s job. You can give a person advice until they don’t want it anymore, and then once they don’t want it anymore, you have to stop. Some people have such an issue with controlling others “in the name of religion.” Even Jesus accepted everyone, he preached but did not try to control anyone. He loved everyone for who they were, even if He didn’t agree with their choices. If a person makes their peace with God about whatever it is that they’re doing, I have no right to try to control their decisions.
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Well, look this up:
stlouisreview.com/article/2012-03-29/facing-pill-head
 
One article written by Catholics. Very informative. The scope of study was so wide that it made me change my whole understanding of biology.
 
In_Training said:
I didn’t realize I was talking to a panel of doctors with medical degrees who know what’s best for a person better than that person and his/her doctor does.

Name them? You can look it up. You have Google and you might even have access to many doctors in your area too that you can ask. And yes, I don’t feel that I have the right to tell others how to live. That’s God’s job. You can give a person advice until they don’t want it anymore, and then once they don’t want it anymore, you have to stop. Some people have such an issue with controlling others “in the name of religion.” Even Jesus accepted everyone, he preached but did not try to control anyone. He loved everyone for who they were, even if He didn’t agree with their choices. If a person makes their peace with God about whatever it is that they’re doing, I have no right to try to control their decisions.
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I don’t think you understand what a right is. You do not have a right to birth control, or an abortion. Just like you don’t have a right to cable TV, a house, or a car. You don’t have a right to clothes or food either. In the United States we have negative rights in that limitations are placed upon the government’s ability to control us.

By not prescribing birth control you are not limiting anyone’s rights. You are absolutely right that the doctor is ethically obligated to provide information. They are not ethically obligated to write a prescription. Fortunately, the vast majority of treatment decision do not involve questions of morality.

Consider the case of plastic surgery, a patient may be certain that a certain procedure will improve their confidence or job prospects, etc and think it is absolutely necessary for their quality of life or to live life the way they want. As the doctor you are under no obligation to perform that procedure if you think it is unnecessary, especially if it is out of the scope of your practice and you have no training as a plastic surgeon. Lets say you are a nephrologist. Nor are you obligated to make a referral to a plastic surgeon if you think the procedure will do more harm than good. Heck, what if you are in a rural town and there is no plastic surgeon available for 500 miles. Has the nephrologist infringed upon the patient’s “rights”? There is no way you can make a serious argument that this is the case.

We can establish guidelines of what physicians ought to do under certain circumstances but that is not the same thing as establishing a law. What a physician ought not to do is violate his/her ethical principles.
 
In_Training said:
I didn’t realize I was talking to a panel of doctors with medical degrees who know what’s best for a person better than that person and his/her doctor does.

Name them? You can look it up. You have Google and you might even have access to many doctors in your area too that you can ask. And yes, I don’t feel that I have the right to tell others how to live. That’s God’s job. You can give a person advice until they don’t want it anymore, and then once they don’t want it anymore, you have to stop. Some people have such an issue with controlling others “in the name of religion.” Even Jesus accepted everyone, he preached but did not try to control anyone. He loved everyone for who they were, even if He didn’t agree with their choices. If a person makes their peace with God about whatever it is that they’re doing, I have no right to try to control their decisions.
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I just think this whole thing is a non-issue. A person can go to a non-Catholic doctor if she wants to pursue all her “options.” Trust me; it’s not all that hard to find one :rolleyes:
 
agapewolf said:
And it is obvious that you didn’t read the article.
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I read the friggin article. The ONE article you provided to sum up years of medical conditions and their treatments, provided by doctors with diverse backgrounds in medicine.
 
In_Training said:
I read the friggin article. The ONE article you provided to sum up years of medical conditions and their treatments, provided by doctors with diverse backgrounds in medicine.
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your snark is absolutely out of line and unnecessary.

No, you didn’t read the article, because you claim its one article, when it references OTHERS.

Do NOT respond to me in such a way again. I will not have a discussion with someone who is so crass.

and we can try www.omsoul.com
the list of doctors is almsot too many to count
 
maryjk said:
Name them.
Name the conditions or diseased that birth control pills TREAT. But name only the ones where birth control pills are the ONLY treatment. Or even where birth control pills are the BEST.
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Endometriosis. Menometrorrhagia (depending on the cause). PCOS. Birth control pills are the best intial treatments for these conditions. They are not always definitive but certainly the safest. My understanding is the Church is fine with the Pill being used in these settings.
 
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