Why Catholics Can't Sing

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T. More:
Has anyone read this?
Why Catholics Can’t Sing
amazon.com/gp/reader/0824511530/ref=sib_dp_pt/103-3380108-8422210#reader-link

You can read the introduction online. I am curious about others’ thoughts and experiences.
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This is a terrific book. The take-home points for me:
  1. The silent Masses in the Irish glens when Catholics could be executed for attending Mass (makes you re-visit the singing issue in the American Church, which is largely Irish).
  2. Music has ALWAYS been a headache in the Church!
 
Excellent book! My recommendation would be to buy it immediately and read it. Thomas Day brings a lot of common sense, along with an excellent musical sensibility, to the question of music in the liturgy.

He also points out that one of the reasons there was little singing in the Mass in the U.S. was because, as mentioned above, the Irish could not sing at their Masses during their persecution. Thus when the Irish immigrated their way of assisting at Mass became the norm for the most part.

He also gives examples of other countries where there was a lot of active participation and singing because their situation was not the same as the Irish.

He also discusses the liturgical changes in general with alot of common sense.
 
What percent of your parish sings during Mass?
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How would I know? I’m there to worship, not to fill out report cards for other parishoners. “I’m giving you a B for singing, a C for attire, and an F for punctualilty.”
 
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Timidity:
How would I know? I’m there to worship, not to fill out report cards for other parishoners. “I’m giving you a B for singing, a C for attire, and an F for punctualilty.”
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:rotfl: :rotfl:

One reason why we don’t sing (much) is we haven’t done any formal singing since grade school, and for me that’s been a very long time. I’m sure a lot of people can’t read music (I can tell a quick note from a slow note, whether I should be going up or down, and that’s about it).

I’ll leave it to others to handle the issues of the choice of music selected. The musicians like to sing challenging things. I don’t. 😦

Although in my parish, I think the choice of music is determined by how many verses it has. :rolleyes: The more the better, they think. :eek:

I’ve actually suggested that I would attend a class on “How to sing in Church” which might include a bit about reading music and maybe some simple exercises to get the ol’ vocal pipes ready before Mass. :o

There’s nary a soul who can’t sing “Jingle Bells”, “Happy Birthday” or “99 Bottles of Beer on the Wall”, so we could be taught, if somebody took the time. 😛
 
Greetings
This is so funny!!!
Being a convert, the thing I noticed first when I became a Catholic was, Cathholics cannot sing! Or will not sing!
It has been almost 50 years, and things have barely changed.

I come from a family who loves music. My grandad was an Irish fiddler, my grandma played piano and organ, everyone seemed to learn to play something and as a family, we sang. We sang gospel, hymns and all sorts of Christian songs. It was important to us and we loved it. I miss it.

Now and then, I attend a non-Catholic worship service and my heart swells with the music. Oh yes, I truly miss it.

There have been some great composers of Traditional Masses, chants, etc. I do not mean that sort of music. I am thinking of Congregational music.

Catholics do not write very good Congregational music.
Then you have the problem of (some) Catholics who spend a lot of time worrying if music is Catholic or Protestant. I find this pretty funny.

Oh well, this is only one Catholics opinion.
 
When comparing my home parish (Byzantine Catholic) to many of the Latin parishes i have been, I have found that even a a half-dozen of us could out-sing hundreds of the others (once this actually happened and was not a mere guesstimation). OTOH, i have been to Latin parishes that have the effect that Mr Day describes from his time in West Germany-i felt that maybe the roof would collapse the singing was so joyous and heartfelt (again mostly in parishes that are still mostly comprised of Germans, and a Polish parish). I do not know Mr Day’s book so i cannot comment on it directly-but I can make one observation of mine own. I do find one of the greatest hinderances and liabilities to congregational singing is the use of instruments-especially the organ (“the great unbreathing beast”-I. Stravinsky) in the hands of a pianist. Often it is too loud, and choirs and cantors use it as a crutch (some nonesense that one cannot keep on pitch without it), which in turn makes it more central to the music, instead of the singing itself (which in turn is the maidservant of the text).

Musically, congregational singing needs several elements to be successful (this list is in order of things that come to mind):
  1. Melodies that are easily memorized-within a narrow range-about an octave to a 10th, but within a fourth or a fifth allows for readily learned complex and melismatic melodies.
  2. Melodies be formulaic and repetitious-through composed Anthems are alright for special occasions, or strictly solo or choral times when meditation of the laos is desirable (at the Offertory or Communion would be such times).
  3. Strong Cantor(s)/Cantrix(trices) and (if a large congregation) a Schola Cantorum-SATB choirs are fine for congregational singing in Lutheran Churches, but i have never found that Catholics are wired to sing like this-we almost always sing melodies and not harmonies (whenever i sing harmony-i invariable get strange looks)-and most parishes do not have the resources to make choral singing practical.
  4. Make ample use of Antiphons and antiphonal music. The Missal gives Antiphons for the Entrance, the Responsorial, Communion (and i think Offertory). Use them. One need not worry if a paricular hymn fits the occasion if the appointed hymns or psalmody are used. One can use the Antiphon given as a refrain, and the cantor sings the other psalm verses, as many as needed to cover the action. One can use the the chant melody in Antiphonale, or write (or hire someone to write) music that can be easily sung and memorized, and is memorable.
  5. Provide more occasions where singing/chanting are more important. The riches of the Church are not only found in the Missal.There are other services, especially Morning Prayer/Matins and Lauds, and Evening Prayer/Vespers that are or can be mostly or completely sung (yes, like how we Eastern Catholics do, and is still done in Latin Monasteries). The more people sing, the better they get.
  6. Get a group of laity that sings with you-but not in the choir loft-in the congregation. If such helpers are scattered throughout, leading by example, others will join in.
    And finally-the Cantor should have a strong voice, and must be formally trained. He/She must be able to sing without a microphone (if the space is accoustically good, that is), but still be clear in diction. He/She must also have a good grasp of liturgics, though there are plenty of helps to be had for putting together modern Latin Rite services, and overall, the Rite is simple to manage. But a thorough knowledge of the Liturgy means that the service can move along smoothly, and be more conductive to prayer. A strong Cantor makes for a strong congregation in singing.
In Christ,
Adam
 
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akemner:
When comparing my home parish (Byzantine Catholic) to many of the Latin parishes i have been, I have found that even a a half-dozen of us could out-sing hundreds of the others (once this actually happened and was not a mere guesstimation). OTOH, i have been to Latin parishes that have the effect that Mr Day describes from his time in West Germany-i felt that maybe the roof would collapse the singing was so joyous and heartfelt (again mostly in parishes that are still mostly comprised of Germans, and a Polish parish)…
  1. Melodies that are easily memorized-within a narrow range-about an octave to a 10th, but within a fourth or a fifth allows for readily learned complex and melismatic melodies.
  2. etc.
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Good points all.

I am coming out of Pentecostalism and SoBap’ism, in a geographic area (north-central Alabama) where music is a very big thing. The music in the Catholic parish could be better, but it isn’t that bad, probably due to the fact that the Catholic influence here is largely German. I attend the Saturday evening Mass; there isn’t a choir, but there are people scattered around the congregation that sing lustily (if that’s an appropriate word). I try to improvise a bass part when I can.

DaveBj
 
At our parish, congregational singing depends on the Mass time. 5 pm Saturday vigil Mass is largely comprised of elderly people and maybe a third of them sing. 7 am Sunday Mass has no music. 8:30 and 10:30 am Masses are the “family” Masses, and I would guess that about 60-75% of those attending are singing (especially at 10:30 as that is the choir Mass). 12:30 pm is when you get the late sleepers and reluctant teenagers dragged in by their parents. Maybe 25-30% of people are singing at this Mass.

“Why Catholics Can’t Sing” was an excellent book and it made me look at a lot of things in a different way. It also made me extremely self conscious as a cantor- I’m so afraid of being a “Caruso” that our music director has to threaten to turn the microphone up unless I start singing more loudly. Apparently people have a bit of trouble hearing me since I’ve taken Day’s complaints about cantors to heart. :o
 
I go to a church where the comment was made to the effect “How can you pray with all that singing?” You can never win some people over.
 
Why is it that the ones who seem to want to sing also appear to be the talkers before Mass, the ones who appear to to be less reverent for the Consecration and hurry to leave at the end of Mass?

I do not sing one word and don’t intend on starting in the near future.
I go to Mass to be near the Real Presence, to pray while I am in the Presence of Jesus Christ. I do not go to be diverted by singing.

If any of you have seen Padre Pio say Mass, can you imagine him singing and being dirveted from adoraation? I am not worthy to be mentioned in the same breath with Padre Pio, but you know what I have said.:ehh:
 
I’ve read the book and found it mostly very good. You can always tell when someone has read the book, because as they speak about what is wrong with Catholic congregational music today, they always mention the hymns/songs that are written as God speaking. I always think about how many psalms are written from God’s point of view, and wonder what Day would have us do about that, if the psalms are appointed for the day and must be sung or said.

Betsy
 
  1. somebody took all the hymnals out of my pew
  2. you can’t hear the hymn number when it is announced
  3. the cantors and organist are not on the same page/key/tempo and I just give up trying to harmonize between them
  4. I refuse to sing heretical lyrics
  5. the cantor is not following the music as written, using his own arrangement to show off his musical gifts
  6. I have moved to a new parish that uses a different hymnal, different settings for Mass parts, never announces which settings are being used, never trains congregation when new piece is introduced
  7. I don’t read music, and since I sit in the back and can’t hear anything I have trouble following along
  8. along with reasons 2 and 7, the sound system is so bad nobody knows what song we’re doing and the people in the back are half a measure behind everybody else
  9. I am attending Mass in another language, and even though I could probably follow along if I could find the hymn in the book, I don’t understand the language well enough to undertand the number, which is not posted anywhere
  10. the musicians always choose hymns out of my vocal range, which is shrinking as I get older
 
I am annoyed by the talkers before mass.
I pray before, during, and after recieving the body and blood of the Lord.

However, during the Gloria, the Psalm, and the other times it is called for I heartly sing God’s praises.

As St. Augustine taught, “singing is praying twice.”

Now I do not suppose to put my self in the same category as St. Augustine, but I do feel I should follow his advice.
 
Exporter: One reason to sing in worship is that the Bible commands it. Eph. 5:19, Col. 3:16. Jesus sang during the Lord’s Supper. Matt. 26:30.
 
Betsy: That is an interesting point on some hymns being from God’s perspective and I think you are right to look to the Psalms. I have always been fascinated by how the psalms have so many perspectives and audiences. Even at the literal sense, they can have the perspective of an individual, a people, or God. Further, they address God, the self, the wicked, the righteouss, the people of God, etc.

Consider the introduction to psalm 49:
Hear this, all you peoples;
listen, all who live in this world,
2 both low and high,
rich and poor alike:
3 My mouth will speak words of wisdom;
the utterance from my heart will give understanding.
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Or, to make your point, consider Psalm 32. After the psalmist expressing his sin, the Psalms goes into the voice of God speaking back:
I will instruct you and teach you in the way you should go;
I will counsel you and watch over you.
9 Do not be like the horse or the mule,
which have no understanding
but must be controlled by bit and bridle
or they will not come to you.
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Psalm 32 is like a conversation.
 
As a convert, I so miss singing. The Bible is filled with music… my Parish, not so. It could be organ or banjo, I’d just be happy to have real singing!
 
I couldn’t vote because I have a couple of different answers.

I would say that maybe 25 percent sing when our music director leads the music. She always plays things in the key in which they were written, and in my opinion most of the music in our hymnals is just too high for the average (particularly Sunday morning!) voice.

When I lead the music I transpose everything to a lower key and I would bet that 75 percent of the people sing, and they sing LOUD.

I also tend to select several “moldy oldies” that people know and love and can sing without their noses being stuck in the hymnal.

My music director loves to add new songs all the the time, and it seems like many newer hyms have melodies that wander all about, with unsingable intervals, and even with weird time signatures (5/4 and 9/8), which are NOT for the faint of heart!

I love my music director – she is a fine musician, but sometimes she expects more from the congregation than they really can handle. People shouldn’t struggle to sing at Mass. Congregational singing should be a natural outpouring of worship exhibited in simple, yet theologically and liturgically correct, hymns.

That’s my two cents’ worth anyway.

'thann
 
Why is it that the ones who seem to want to sing also appear to be the talkers before Mass, the ones who appear to to be less reverent for the Consecration and hurry to leave at the end of Mass?
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That’s funny because at my parish, it’s exactly the opposite. Most of the singers are the CCE teachers and their families. They are also (for the most part) the more attentive and reverent families at Mass.

I was brought up that singing is an important part of the Mass. Those nuns sure got some things to stick. 😉 It is almost physically painful when I can’t join the singing.
 
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