Why did Christ have to die?

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mikew262

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First off, I’m a cradle Catholic, was an alter boy, and went to 7 yrs of Catholic School. Throughout my life, I’ve been a sporadically practicing Catholic (hopefully, the sporadic part is over). As some of you have observed, I sometimes voice my own opinion on issues which may not exactly jive with Church doctrine/teachings.

Ok, having set the stage, I have an issue that I sometimes struggle with. Why was it really necessary for Jesus to die? I know what the Church says about it (or I think I do), however I still struggle with the logic. If he died to to show that he could rise again to prove without a doubt he was God, I can buy into that. However, the fact that he died, so our sins could be forgiven, I have a problem understanding. He was God, why couldn’t he just proclaim it, without having to die. What did him dying, prove? Why didn’t he stay on earth longer to continue his ministry?

Of course, maybe to find the real answer, I may have to wait and ask him myself. 😃

Comments?
 
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mikew262:
What did him dying, prove?
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How much He loves us. 🙂
 
Here are my thoughts

God loved us so much that He gave Himself to us in the Person of Jesus Christ.

John the Baptist said, “Behold the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world!” He was blameless, spotless, without blemish.

Jesus died upon the cross so that our sins could be forgiven. See, God is the source of everything that is good and perfect. Love and mercy are good right? Well so is Justice. And a failure to love God by submitting our wills to Him is an Infinite Injustive, its evil, right?(all of us fail to surrender our wills to God ever since Adam and Eve. By doing this we essentially choose ourselves over Him. We are saying, my will not Yours be done) God could have just said “your forgiven” without ever punishing sin, but that would be unjust.

God is infinite right? so by willingly offering Himself, in His infinite perfection, He was able to become the Infinite Atoning Sacrafice for the Infinite Injustice of Sin.

Why did He die? For alot of reasons, to lead by example and show us what we must do: die to ourselves, to surrender to Him, to love others selflessly, be merciful and humble. To atone for our sins and so on.

I hope and pray soemthing makes sense and maybe sheds some light. Lets hear what others have to say.

this si really awesome stuff! when i say awe some i mean it fills me with awe and joy and wonder…
 
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Mickey:
How much He loves us. 🙂
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I know he loves us, but that doesn’t make it clear to me on the purpose of dying versus some other action.
 
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mikew262:
I know he loves us, but that doesn’t make it clear to me on the purpose of dying versus some other action.
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There is no better example of love than for the Father to sacrifice His only begotten Son. What other “action” did you have in mind?
 
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mikew262:
First off, I’m a cradle Catholic, was an alter boy, and went to 7 yrs of Catholic School. Throughout my life, I’ve been a sporadically practicing Catholic (hopefully, the sporadic part is over). As some of you have observed, I sometimes voice my own opinion on issues which may not exactly jive with Church doctrine/teachings.

Ok, having set the stage, I have an issue that I sometimes struggle with. Why was it really necessary for Jesus to die? I know what the Church says about it (or I think I do), however I still struggle with the logic. If he died to to show that he could rise again to prove without a doubt he was God, I can buy into that. However, the fact that he died, so our sins could be forgiven, I have a problem understanding. He was God, why couldn’t he just proclaim it, without having to die. What did him dying, prove? Why didn’t he stay on earth longer to continue his ministry?

Of course, maybe to find the real answer, I may have to wait and ask him myself. 😃

Comments?
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did my response make sense? Did it help?
 
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Mickey:
There is no better example of love than for the Father to sacrifice His only begotten Son. What other “action” did you have in mind?
Click to expand...
I don’t know. Maybe thats all there is to it. With God being all powerful, I would think there might have been a better way versus sending Jesus down here to eventully die violently. Maybe I’m trying to apply to much logic.
 
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mikew262:
I don’t know. Maybe thats all there is to it. With God being all powerful, I would think there might have been a better way versus sending Jesus down here to eventully die violently. Maybe I’m trying to apply to much logic.
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the truth is that any suffering of Christ was sufficient to atone for the sins of the world. The Lord upon the cross has two sides like a coin…the love of God, and the evil of the sin of man…
 
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Anonymous_1:
did my response make sense? Did it help?
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Somewhat. However, you used alot of language that I’ve already heard through the Church. Nothing wrong with that, but I was looking for another spin on it, if possible.

However, thanks for your response.
 
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Anonymous_1:
the truth is that any suffering of Christ was sufficient to atone for the sins of the world. The Lord upon the cross has two sides like a coin…the love of God, and the evil of the sin of man…
Click to expand...
So if Jesus had never come down and/or died on the cross, mankind’s sins could never be forgiven by God?

I know I’m asking elementary questions, but I trying start a logic chain for myself.
 
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mikew262:
Why was it really necessary for Jesus to die? I know what the Church says about it (or I think I do), however I still struggle with the logic. If he died to to show that he could rise again to prove without a doubt he was God, I can buy into that. However, the fact that he died, so our sins could be forgiven, I have a problem understanding. He was God, why couldn’t he just proclaim it, without having to die. What did him dying, prove? Why didn’t he stay on earth longer to continue his ministry?

Of course, maybe to find the real answer, I may have to wait and ask him myself. 😃

Comments?
Click to expand...
Recommended Reading:
catholic.com/thisrock/2004/0402fea1.asp

BTW, what great cover art of that issue of This Rock!
 
like I said before, being God and infinitley benevolent, and spotless, any suffering that Christ endured was sufficient to atone for our sins.

If Christ had never become man and suffered, then i suppose(and am not certain about this) that we would still be seperated from God by the infinite gulf of original sin. Every grace and mercy and blessing that has ever come to man from God has come through Christ on the Cross. That is not to say it is the only way, but it is the way it is…I do not know if there is another way…
 
A thought from Radio Replies Vol.I #745:

“Man, bought by so great a price, is taught his true dignity in the eyes of God, learns how evil sin really is, and is moved to love One who has proved His love in so convincing a way.”
 
God gives Himself ENTIRLEY to us…on the Cross, in the Eucharist, and in Heaven…If we are to experience the joy of Heaven we need to do the same…What is amazing is it is like theology of the body…we are created for “Sexual” union with God!!!
 
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Anonymous_1:
…we are created for “Sexual” union with God!!!
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Are you sure that’s what JPII said in his Theology of the Body series of addresses?
 
MikeW, let me try to break this down to you…

God created us originally perfect and without sin. We chose to turn from Him and sinned. Whether you believe in the Adam and Eve story literally is another discussion in and of itself, but the point is that once there was a perfect state that humans were in. We were sharing in the supernatural life of God! That’s what we call “Grace”.
The warning God gave us was clear, if we eat from the fruit of the forbidden tree, we will die. And died we did. Our first parents sinned and that Original sin has been transmitted to us. Death entered the world through sin. Sin gives birth to death. The penalty of sin is death, not just physically, but spiritually. Spiritual death is eternal separation from God, that is, Hell.
But God loved us so much that He decided to become a human being Himself, and He, that is, Jesus Christ, not having sin inside him at all, made Himself the appropriate sacrifice to take onto Himselff all the sins of the world…you sins…my sins…everything…even our sufferings from sin. This is what the Cross signifies. God doesn’t want us to go to Hell, He wants us to be restored to the original state He created us as. The death of a substitute was by His Law and Justice in regards to sin the only way this redemption could take place. This was of course foreshadowed in the sacrifices of lambs and goats in the Jewish Temple (read Hebrews). Death is the punishment for sin, and God chose to take on that punishment upon Himself so that we would not have to. Now that is Love as far as Love would ever go. Christ didn’t HAVE to die for our sins. Christ CHOSE to die, but death was the natural consequence of sin. Sin kills everything. God restores everything. And one day everything will be fully restored (Revelation 21), but we can experience that now if we just give ourselves to Him, both personally and through the sacraments.
Does this help?
P7
 
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Pryority7:
MikeW, let me try to break this down to you…

God created us originally perfect and without sin. We chose to turn from Him and sinned. Whether you believe in the Adam and Eve story literally is another discussion in and of itself, but the point is that once there was a perfect state that humans were in. We were sharing in the supernatural life of God! That’s what we call “Grace”.
The warning God gave us was clear, if we eat from the fruit of the forbidden tree, we will die. And died we did. Our first parents sinned and that Original sin has been transmitted to us. Death entered the world through sin. Sin gives birth to death. The penalty of sin is death, not just physically, but spiritually. Spiritual death is eternal separation from God, that is, Hell.
But God loved us so much that He decided to become a human being Himself, and He, that is, Jesus Christ, not having sin inside him at all, made Himself the appropriate sacrifice to take onto Himselff all the sins of the world…you sins…my sins…everything…even our sufferings from sin. This is what the Cross signifies. God doesn’t want us to go to Hell, He wants us to be restored to the original state He created us as. The death of a substitute was by His Law and Justice in regards to sin the only way this redemption could take place. This was of course foreshadowed in the sacrifices of lambs and goats in the Jewish Temple (read Hebrews). Death is the punishment for sin, and God chose to take on that punishment upon Himself so that we would not have to. Now that is Love as far as Love would ever go. Christ didn’t HAVE to die for our sins. Christ CHOSE to die, but death was the natural consequence of sin. Sin kills everything. God restores everything. And one day everything will be fully restored (Revelation 21), but we can experience that now if we just give ourselves to Him, both personally and through the sacraments.
Does this help?
P7
Click to expand...
Yep, that’s a pretty good explanation. Thanks!
 
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mikew262:
Why was it really necessary for Jesus to die? However, the fact that he died, so our sins could be forgiven, I have a problem understanding. He was God, why couldn’t he just proclaim it, without having to die. What did him dying, prove? Why didn’t he stay on earth longer to continue his ministry?
Click to expand...
The answer to this question is what keeps me a “Christian” and has not allowed me to come back to the Catholic faith. When one truly understands just why Jesus came to earth, and why he had to die…very eye opening.

God is Holy and Just. The Just part of him needs atonement for sin. Under Jewish law a sacrifice need be made for the covering of sin. It only “covered” sins. Jesus came to earth with one main thing to do. To die as an “atonement” for our sins. See sacrificing you best lamb and following the law…never brought salvation. That was not the intent, cause no one could keep the law.

Jesus became the “sacrificial lamb”. Behold the Lamb who takes away the sin of the world. This is where non-Catholic beliefs differ. A non-Catholic sees Jesus sacrifice as atonement for anyone’s sin’s that accepts that sacrifice. By accepting it, Jesus becomes their savior.

This is where I see it as making perfect sense. Because if one need follow this rule or that rule and this sacrament or that sacrament, Jesus bloody, torturous death becomes illogical. Exactly, why would he have to come down and die such a horrible death if people still needed to do this that or the other thing? It makes no sense. But as he said before he gave up the Ghost, “It is finished” - this referring to the purpose he came, …to be the sacrificial lamb for the world, for anyone who would accept it. Without bloodshed, there is no remission of sin. That is why Jesus’ blood needed to be shed.

It makes total sense to me.
 
Our holy Monsignor is fond of pointing out that it was not God’s Will for Jesus to die. What God willed was that His Son would be obedient, even unto death. This is what God wills for all of us as well. Jesus died because of the disobedience of all men, which is kind of what gave thrust to the players of the time, I guess.
 
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