Why Did God Create Gays?

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I consider myself a devout Catholic but I’m not sure where I stand on the church teaching against homosexual acts. If we are to believe that God created everything and everyone in His Infinite Wisdom, then why did He bother creating gay people?

If His plan was perfect and unblemished, then why create people who’s sexualities are described by the Church as being “disordered”? I’ve heard countless people say “Hate the sin, not the sinner.”

But isn’t it what we DO that defines who we ARE? If people are sinning, then they are sinners. If a gay person isn’t sexually active, then we can’t condemn them. But if they are sexually active, we are called to criticize that behaviour. But in both these situations, the gay person who abstains from sex and the gay person who indulges in it are totally different people defined by their actions. In my opinion, I can’t possibly distinguish condemning someone based on what they do and based on who they are.

On the other hand, if we believe evolution (without the intervention of God), then it provides a much more elegant answer to the question. Scientists can argue that having a small minority of the population be homosexual allows a slight advantage to the heterosexual population for giving offspring. We can go back and see homosexuality is prevalent in a number of species other than humans and it goes back a long, long, long way. Probably since the beginning of modern man. Researchers have also shown that genetic factors can definitely come into play as homosexuality is more common in brothers and relatives in a common maternal line so that might hint that there might even be a recessive genetic mechanism that’s yet to be discovered.

Have any of you managed to reconcile the theology with the evidence for evolution?
(Note: please don’t assume I’m trying to be pretentious. I’m naturally just curious as I’m having a hard time myself believing in both evolution and God’s plan for humanity)
 
savedbygrace92 said:
I consider myself a devout Catholic but I’m not sure where I stand on the church teaching against homosexual acts. If we are to believe that God created everything and everyone in His Infinite Wisdom, then why did He bother creating gay people?

If His plan was perfect and unblemished, then why create people who’s sexualities are described by the Church as being “disordered”? I’ve heard countless people say “Hate the sin, not the sinner.”

But isn’t it what we DO that defines who we ARE? If people are sinning, then they are sinners. If a gay person isn’t sexually active, then we can’t condemn them. But if they are sexually active, we are called to criticize that behaviour. But in both these situations, the gay person who abstains from sex and the gay person who indulges in it are totally different people defined by their actions. In my opinion, I can’t possibly distinguish condemning someone based on what they do and based on who they are.

On the other hand, if we believe evolution (without the intervention of God), then it provides a much more elegant answer to the question. Scientists can argue that having a small minority of the population be homosexual allows a slight advantage to the heterosexual population for giving offspring. We can go back and see homosexuality is prevalent in a number of species other than humans and it goes back a long, long, long way. Probably since the beginning of modern man. Researchers have also shown that genetic factors can definitely come into play as homosexuality is more common in brothers and relatives in a common maternal line so that might hint that there might even be a recessive genetic mechanism that’s yet to be discovered.

Have any of you managed to reconcile the theology with the evidence for evolution?
(Note: please don’t assume I’m trying to be pretentious. I’m naturally just curious as I’m having a hard time myself believing in both evolution and God’s plan for humanity)
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The Church never said to condemn people with the temptations of homosexuality, they just said homosexual acts are wrong and the inclination is disordered.

Some people are naturally inclined to addiction, does that mean God wanted to create alcoholics and drug addicts? No. We don’t get to choose our cross but we do choose to turn way from it or indulge in it.
 
We are all tempted to sin (thanks to original sin wounding our nature - we are fallen, after all). Some might be tempted to excessive drinking or gambling or violence. Others might be tempted to sex outside of marriage (i.e. fornication) or adultery. Others are tempted to have sex with other members of the same sex. Still others are tempted to pornography and masturbation. God isn’t responsible for these temptations. These temptations also aren’t sinful. They just are. Acting on them (and fantasizing about acting on them) is sinful, but simply wanting to sin isn’t sinful and is something everyone struggles with (even Jesus - cf. Hebrews 4:15).

Really, though, your question is off base. God didn’t “create gays.” He created men and women, all of whom are tempted to do sinful things (again, thanks to original sin, not to God).
 
“If His plan was perfect and unblemished,
then why create people who’s sexualities
are described by the Church as being
“disordered”?”

do read up on original sin, God made men and women, our “disorders” are consequences of original sin.
 
He didn’t.

He created human beings, and it is events after they became alive that changed the sexuality.

ICXC NIKA
 
savedbygrace92 said:
evolution (without the intervention of God), then it provides a much more elegant answer to the question.
Click to expand...
I don’t agree that evolution provides an “elegant” answer at all, but shouldn’t we be looking for the truth, not that which is more “elegant”?
 
Homosexuality, along with all sorts of other disorders and diseases entered the world with Original sin. It is a consequence of our fallen nature.

It’s the same as asking, why did God create children with cancer or blind people or those who can’t walk.
 
savedbygrace92 said:
I consider myself a devout Catholic but I’m not sure where I stand on the church teaching against homosexual acts. If we are to believe that God created everything and everyone in His Infinite Wisdom, then why did He bother creating gay people?

If His plan was perfect and unblemished, then why create people who’s sexualities are described by the Church as being “disordered”? I’ve heard countless people say “Hate the sin, not the sinner.”

But isn’t it what we DO that defines who we ARE? If people are sinning, then they are sinners. If a gay person isn’t sexually active, then we can’t condemn them. But if they are sexually active, we are called to criticize that behaviour. But in both these situations, the gay person who abstains from sex and the gay person who indulges in it are totally different people defined by their actions. In my opinion, I can’t possibly distinguish condemning someone based on what they do and based on who they are.

On the other hand, if we believe evolution (without the intervention of God), then it provides a much more elegant answer to the question. Scientists can argue that having a small minority of the population be homosexual allows a slight advantage to the heterosexual population for giving offspring. We can go back and see homosexuality is prevalent in a number of species other than humans and it goes back a long, long, long way. Probably since the beginning of modern man. Researchers have also shown that genetic factors can definitely come into play as homosexuality is more common in brothers and relatives in a common maternal line so that might hint that there might even be a recessive genetic mechanism that’s yet to be discovered.

Have any of you managed to reconcile the theology with the evidence for evolution?
(Note: please don’t assume I’m trying to be pretentious. I’m naturally just curious as I’m having a hard time myself believing in both evolution and God’s plan for humanity)
Click to expand...
The argument about evolution that you make involves just as much faith. Scientists see the fact that homosexuality exists in many contexts, and then they TRUST that there must be a genetic explanation. However, they have not found a gay gene, so they just “posit” it to make the evolutionary explanation. Then their explanation involves questionable premises, like the premise that gay people are less likely to reproduce – this has not been true in hardly any culture I know of, except modern Western culture. The whole thing involves quite a bit of faith.
 
Gay people are created in his image and likeness just as people with anger issues like me, people who have gambling addictions, people who are prone to the the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life.

Having a weakness does not mean being that. A person who is disposed to SSA is capable of loving a person of the opposite sex, I think, they are capable of having children, they are capable of marrying an opposite sex spouse and keeping God’s Law a large amount of the time and not saying, “I’m THIS way, and there is nothing I can do about it.” I may have temper issues, but there’s a lot I can do about it. Most all people are capable of self-control.

Is there really such a thing as “Gays”?? …how bout just “sons and daughters of God.” we all need some kind of healing, but if we say we are without sin, then we are liars.
 
savedbygrace92 said:
I consider myself a devout Catholic but I’m not sure where I stand on the church teaching against homosexual acts. If we are to believe that God created everything and everyone in His Infinite Wisdom, then why did He bother creating gay people?

If His plan was perfect and unblemished, then why create people who’s sexualities are described by the Church as being “disordered”? I’ve heard countless people say “Hate the sin, not the sinner.”

But isn’t it what we DO that defines who we ARE? If people are sinning, then they are sinners. If a gay person isn’t sexually active, then we can’t condemn them. But if they are sexually active, we are called to criticize that behaviour. But in both these situations, the gay person who abstains from sex and the gay person who indulges in it are totally different people defined by their actions. In my opinion, I can’t possibly distinguish condemning someone based on what they do and based on who they are.

On the other hand, if we believe evolution (without the intervention of God), then it provides a much more elegant answer to the question. Scientists can argue that having a small minority of the population be homosexual allows a slight advantage to the heterosexual population for giving offspring. We can go back and see homosexuality is prevalent in a number of species other than humans and it goes back a long, long, long way. Probably since the beginning of modern man. Researchers have also shown that genetic factors can definitely come into play as homosexuality is more common in brothers and relatives in a common maternal line so that might hint that there might even be a recessive genetic mechanism that’s yet to be discovered.

Have any of you managed to reconcile the theology with the evidence for evolution?
(Note: please don’t assume I’m trying to be pretentious. I’m naturally just curious as I’m having a hard time myself believing in both evolution and God’s plan for humanity)
Click to expand...
In my opinion, God DIDN’T create gay people. That is, He created people, and due to the fallen nature of the world, some people suffer from a disordered sexual attraction. Even if it could be determined that there is a genetic factor at play (and it seems that this is somewhat of a doubtful claim based on what I’ve seem) it doesn’t make much difference. We are also hardwired to physically die at some point, due to our genetic make-up, but that wasn’t how God originally intended it. Gay people are not a sub-human species that were created for a specific purpose other than the same purpose that all mankind is made for.
 
Thanks for your answers.

I see a lot of you are saying the same thing. My follow-up question then is who created Original Sin? How did it just appear? Wouldn’t God forsee original sin in His plan and find some way to prevent it?
 
savedbygrace92 said:
Thanks for your answers.

I see a lot of you are saying the same thing. My follow-up question then is who created Original Sin? How did it just appear? Wouldn’t God forsee original sin in His plan and find some way to prevent it?
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The first man and woman chose it.

God chose to gave them a test to test their love. It isn’t real love if the only reason they choose you is because they are given no opportunity to choose otherwise.

The first man and woman chose to disobey their Creator. They messed up the balance of the world
 
Prodigal_Son said:
The whole thing involves quite a bit of faith.
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Not more faith than trying to wrap your head around why God would allow homosexuality to exist if He was so against it to be honest.
MarcoPolo said:
I don’t agree that evolution provides an “elegant” answer at all, but shouldn’t we be looking for the truth, not that which is more “elegant”?
Click to expand...
I personally only like to accept an idea if their is enough evidence for it. And if there is enough evidence, it tends to be more ‘elegant’ in my mind as an answer to a question.

I think its strange to claim that homosexual acts are “intrinsically disordered”. I’ve tried to grapple on what basis we are making that claim. Do we not find it in nature across species and across time? It’s not as if some humans “chose” to be gay. And it’s not as if it’s unnatural (i.e. not found in the natural world)
 
cena said:
The first man and woman chose it.

God chose to gave them a test to test their love. It isn’t real love if the only reason they choose you is because they are given no opportunity to choose otherwise.

The first man and woman chose to disobey their Creator. They messed up the balance of the world
Click to expand...
Then why give us free will in the first place? If God knew we were going to screw it up? Why even put a tree of knowledge to tempt us with in the Garden of Eden? Why give us rules he knows we’d disobey that would lead to the current state of the world? If anything, not giving us free will and forcing us to believe in him makes more sense if he’s all knowing and all good and trying not to let the world fall to pieces.

If it was a choice, then we’d have to come to grips with the fact that God was okay with letting this world be as horrible as it is.
 
savedbygrace92 said:
Then why give us free will in the first place? If God knew we were going to screw it up? Why even put a tree of knowledge to tempt us with in the Garden of Eden? Why give us rules he knows we’d disobey that would lead to the current state of the world? If anything, not giving us free will and forcing us to believe in him makes more sense if he’s all knowing and all good and trying not to let the world fall to pieces.

If it was a choice, then we’d have to come to grips with the fact that God was okay with letting this world be as horrible as it is.
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Think about it: it isn’t real love if the person who loves you didn’t choose it. If someone loves you because they have no choice it’s pointless.

Are you suggesting that God take over the body of all the bad people and stop them? Wouldn’t we argue he was being controlling? Since we all sin does that mean He should control all of us?

Also, no one wakes up one day and commits a grave sin. There are all these little sins that lead us there. Should he force us to not commit those too?

This world is so temporary. Heaven and hell are eternal. In heaven no will ever get sick, hurt, experience injustice, etc. ever again.
 
savedbygrace92 said:
Not more faith than trying to wrap your head around why God would allow homosexuality to exist if He was so against it to be honest.

I personally only like to accept an idea if their is enough evidence for it. And if there is enough evidence, it tends to be more ‘elegant’ in my mind as an answer to a question.

I think its strange to claim that homosexual acts are “intrinsically disordered”. I’ve tried to grapple on what basis we are making that claim. Do we not find it in nature across species and across time? It’s not as if some humans “chose” to be gay. And it’s not as if it’s unnatural (i.e. not found in the natural world)
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Cannibalism and murder has been practiced in the human world and animal world, does this make them natural? Not necessarily.

Sleeping, eating, having sex are natural things. We are tired because we need to sleep because our body needs to rest and repair itself. We get hungry because we need to eat to sustain ourself. We have sex because sex produces children and children keep the human race going.
What purpose do sexual actions achieve other than sexual gratification?
 
Re: Original Sin…

I think God willed to create us in a state of becoming…he foresaw everything. We as humans take part in becoming who we are, some for better, others for worse.

We are warriors on a battle field, and what do warriors do but fight.

We gain merit in this life by his Grace by fighting as the saints did unto the last drop of our blood or in little ways at becoming perfect.

God did say, “Be perfect as your Heavenly Father is perfect.” He could have created us already that way, but he chose not to do that…It’s a bit mysterious as to why, but I’ve tried to provide one of my ideas on this in a nutshell.
 
I’m a guy who is sexually attracted to men and not women. I can tell you for a fact that its not who I am. I’m not gay, I just have feelings toward men. That’s it. God didn’t make me gay, he just made me, and the feelings came after. Same as any other mental disorder.

As for the existence of homosexuality in the animal kingdom; my family’s dog humps kittens. Does that make it natural for me to hump kittens?
 
savedbygrace92 said:
I think its strange to claim that homosexual acts are “intrinsically disordered”. I’ve tried to grapple on what basis we are making that claim. Do we not find it in nature across species and across time? It’s not as if some humans “chose” to be gay. And it’s not as if it’s unnatural (i.e. not found in the natural world)
Click to expand...
The natural law does not mean “found in nature.” Cancer is found in nature, but it’s a medical disorder. The reason we are able to recognize that a disease is out of whack is because we recognize what correct healthiness is. To understand the natural law, one must recognize the proper order of a thing. A properly functioning body is without disease. In disease, something is not in proper order. Just as in the visible world, we can identify physical sickness when things go out of order, so too can we use the visible heirophany of the world to identify what is properly ordered spiritually. This is why Christ repeatedly analogizes sin with sickness and illness. This is why Christ performed physical healings that we might understand the invisible healings that he also does with sickness’ analog, i.e. sin.

Now, simply feeling homosexual tendencies is not sinful, just as one might feel a desire to steal money from someone. But we understand stealing money is wrong because we recognize the proper order of human dignity and that another is due his possession. The natural law with regard to sexuality is similar. Just as someone might have a propensity to steal, one might have a propensity to engage in sexual activity apart from true marriage. Gender is a meaningful attribute of humanity. The very fertility that normatively exists in a homosexual or heterosexual person is one indication of proper order of gender toward the opposite sex. It helps us identify the proper order of men with women. And just as when one resists the temptation to steal, one avoids sin, one who resists the temptation to engage in sexual acts outside of marriage likewise avoids sin.
 
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