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jamil_joseph02
Guest
Why is there a need for God to incarnate/ become human? If God wills man to be forgiven, then He would do so in the first place without incarnating? But still why did He did so?
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Deconi
Guest
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NHInsider
Guest
Because He is perfect and therefore subject to His own constructs.
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Pax
Guest
The incarnation is necessary as part of God’s plan of salvation. Adam, a finite being, sinned against God who is infinite. Man can only perform acts and sacrifices that have finite value. Man cannot perform acts and sacrifices that have infinite value. Atonement for the sin of Adam and all of the sins of fallen man requires a sacrifice of infinite value. Man needed a champion to provide this sacrifice of infinite value. Only Jesus, who is both God and man, could provide the sacrifice of infinite value to make satisfaction for the sins of man. It is for this reason that the second person of the Trinity became man for out redemption.
I hope this helps.
Yours in Christ Jesus Crucified,
Pax
I hope this helps.
Yours in Christ Jesus Crucified,
Pax
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jamil_joseph02
Guest
18 years old sir and still learning the faithFirstly, with much respect, Jamil, how old are you?
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steve_b
Guest
Augustine said
The son of God became the son of man so that the sons and daughters of man could become sons and daughters of God.
But as you say, since God can do anything He wants in a much simpler way, why all the drama…right?
The drama is to demonstrate LOVE
- how much He loves us ON HIS TERMS.
- how much we are to love Him and others as ourselves ON HIS TERMS
- how much we are to be truly transformed, not just forgiven ON HIS TERMS
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MarcoPolo
Guest
To show us this, the ultimate example of love that clicking His fingers could not show. 
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Metaphysically, you can also understand this. After the Fall of Adam, man could no longer reach God. God was in the realm of the eternal, the spiritual. Man remained in the temporal realm, the corporeal physical realm. Man could no longer reach God.
Well, Jesus Incarnate is both human and divine. You see how the person of Jesus opens up to both worlds: God’s divine realm and our human realm. That is how it is “through” Christ that we again reach God. He is the bridge, the door back to God because He opens up to both worlds.
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Metaphysically, you can also understand this. After the Fall of Adam, man could no longer reach God. God was in the realm of the eternal, the spiritual. Man remained in the temporal realm, the corporeal physical realm. Man could no longer reach God.
Well, Jesus Incarnate is both human and divine. You see how the person of Jesus opens up to both worlds: God’s divine realm and our human realm. That is how it is “through” Christ that we again reach God. He is the bridge, the door back to God because He opens up to both worlds.
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jamil_joseph02
Guest
well, are there biblical passages supporting the above explanations?
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Ishamael
Guest
(Im just going to jump right in, yes i am an atheist, but i like to think i’m an open minded one, i’m here to discuss philosophy, challenge you and perhaps you challenge me, i’m not here to troll or any other such nonsense…just thought i would let you know)
But it is a good question, why not simply forgive them if god is all powerful. Why the human sacrifice (which to my understanding was a major no-no in the jewish faith)?
But it is a good question, why not simply forgive them if god is all powerful. Why the human sacrifice (which to my understanding was a major no-no in the jewish faith)?
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w_stewart
Guest
Do not expect every explanation is written in the Bible.
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rovimax
Guest
This is all because of the fact that He is true God and true Man. He is the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world… He is mankind’s sin offering to the Father Heb 10:10. Unless He is true God, He can’t be the redeemer because He could not, in any way pay an infinite debt, and if He was not true Man, He could not likewise be the Redeemer for it was man who was indebted and should pay. That is why the redeemer has to be both God and Man. God because He could pay, Man because He should pay for humankind’s redemption.
I hope I got it right. Glad to help.
I hope I got it right. Glad to help.
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MarcoPolo
Guest
For mine, yes. There is Scripture that shows Jesus is God and man and Scripture that says Jesus is a door/portal (Mark 14:61-62, John 8:58, John 10:7). And you can study Genesis to learn that Adam and Eve were cast out of the dwelling place of God and were therefore in need of this “door” Jesus to return to God.
p.s. I also agree with the others. Do not presume divine revelation comes to us only via Scripture.
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steve_b
Guest
What specifically are you questioning?
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steve_b
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:tiphat: welcome
I:
It IS a good question. Why all the drama? Why not just forgive and call it a day…right? I realize that you being an atheist you’re going to disagree with everything I’m about to say. So I’ll be quick.
Unlike all the rest of creation, We (humanity) are made to the image and likeness of God. That means we are held to the highest standards of all creation. We just don’t live our lives, die, and end up in the ground for all eternity. Even though we won’t ever be divine, we ARE eternal by virtue of our souls being conceived. Our memory intellect and will are the eternal properties of our soul. All of us will live forever the good AND the bad alike. The question is WHERE will that be? Heaven or Hell. Both are choices presented to us. If God did NOT incarnate, heaven would NOT be a choice for us. The one who made us, gave us the ability to make that choice by virtue of His love for us, and the the incarnation. And He wants us to make the right choice. Our life is about making choices. If we ultimately make choices on His terms NOT ours then in the end, based on how we responded to the graces God gives us and the choices we made, we can avoid hell and inherit heaven. Inbetween birth and death there are a great many details to address, as you know to make it possible to come to the right choice of eternity in heaven and avoid eternity in hell.
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CSJ
Guest
How and why God chooses is based on a much more elevated thinking than we are capable of. We can not possibly begin to understand His ways. Nonetheless, I like to think that if sin entered the world through physical means via a man, a woman, and a tree (Adam, Eve, and the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil), how fitting is it that God would free us from that sin using the same physical vehicle via a man, a woman, and a tree (Jesus, Mary, the Cross). Our God, it seems, has a plan.
CSJ
CSJ
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catholic1seeks
Guest
God could have redeemed us just by willing it, but He didn’t.
Why? Because He loves us.
Someone once said that Jesus was the only one who came into the world in order to die.
Why? Because He loves us.
Someone once said that Jesus was the only one who came into the world in order to die.
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Deconi
Guest
Thank you, Jamil.
Do you know what this old adage means? :"If you love something, let it go! If it comes back, it’s yours for life. It it doesn’t, it never was!" ?!?
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jamil_joseph02
Guest
I have once heard that sir. And I guess the passage already speaks for itself. But what else could that passage mean?Thank you, Jamil.
Do you know what this old adage means? :"If you love something, let it go! If it comes back, it’s yours for life. It it doesn’t, it never was!" ?!?
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jamil_joseph02
Guest
I’m simply asking if there are scriptural passages supporting the given answers, nothing more, nothing less and yes, others already have shown some of them. Of course I do not accept that Sola Scriptura concept.
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jamil_joseph02
Guest
that God wills to save us through His incarnation/ death on the cross.
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