Why did JPII kiss the Koran?

  • Thread starter Thread starter SourGrape
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
S

SourGrape

Guest
After reading the posts in a thread begun by rosie2013 about some monks, I began to wonder again why Pope John Paul II kissed the Koran. Anyone here read the reason he decided to do so?
 
Sorry. I just did a search on this topic and found numerous posts on it in previous threads.
 
SourGrape said:
After reading the posts in a thread begun by rosie2013 about some monks, I began to wonder again why Pope John Paul II kissed the Koran. Anyone here read the reason he decided to do so?
Click to expand...
Firstly; I don’t believe anyone is absolutely certain that it was a Quran. It may well have been a Bible, Book of Gospels or a Psalter.
 
While it was a coran, he might have just been trying to be polite to the donors.
 
From what I last recollect hearing on this it was a sign of traditional respect. In the Arabian cultures gissing the gift is a sign of accepting the gift and showing politness and
thanks for the gesture. If it was in fact a Koran we can assume that for the stature of JPII Muslims would have given him a very special limited literary edition of museum quality (perhaps signed by a high level cleric or king or prince) that was intended to reverence the historical significance of the audience. It’s not like the Vatican does not have access to their own copies of various versions of the Koran’s in the Vatican library archive. This was mostly a gift exchanged in a pure head-of-state visit that is common among kingdoms and nations. Let’s not forget that The Pope is not only the leader (or depending on perspective - the perceived leader) for all of Christianity but is also the Vatican head of state since the Vatican is its own nation.

It’s not as if the gesture was an acceptance of the philosophies or teachings contained therein. One should turn it around the other way and take note of the extraordinary nature of a Muslim trusting the words of The Prophet (in an expensive gold leaf edition no doubt) in the hands of the Christian Ruler and trusting that it would not be later destroyed or burned. 😉

Exchanging trust, respect and common civility is how one evangelizes and can hope for progressive improvemetns in relationships and break down misperceptions.

James
 
CentralFLJames said:
From what I last recollect hearing on this it was a sign of traditional respect. In the Arabian cultures gissing the gift is a sign of accepting the gift and showing politness and
thanks for the gesture. If it was in fact a Koran we can assume that for the stature of JPII Muslims would have given him a very special limited literary edition of museum quality (perhaps signed by a high level cleric or king or prince) that was intended to reverence the historical significance of the audience. It’s not like the Vatican does not have access to their own copies of various versions of the Koran’s in the Vatican library archive. This was mostly a gift exchanged in a pure head-of-state visit that is common among kingdoms and nations. Let’s not forget that The Pope is not only the leader (or depending on perspective - the perceived leader) for all of Christianity but is also the Vatican head of state since the Vatican is its own nation.

It’s not as if the gesture was an acceptance of the philosophies or teachings contained therein. One should turn it around the other way and take note of the extraordinary nature of a Muslim trusting the words of The Prophet (in an expensive gold leaf edition no doubt) in the hands of the Christian Ruler and trusting that it would not be later destroyed or burned. 😉

Exchanging trust, respect and common civility is how one evangelizes and can hope for progressive improvemetns in relationships and break down misperceptions.

James
Click to expand...
Agreed. I also wonder if he wasn’t paying respect to that small part in the book that was of God. Although he wasn’t a Franciscan, during the Crusades they successfully developed a relationship toward the evangelization of Muslims.
I do think, IMHO, that it would have eased a lot of Catholics if he had explained the reason for his having done this.
 
As a previous poster has pointed out, it was also a way to honor the magnitude of the gift. For Muslims, the Qu’Ran is the literal word of God. The majority believe that it was uncreated, existing from the beginning of time in the same sense that we believe the Father and the Son co-existed from the beginning of time, uncreated. In a Muslim household, the Qu’Ran always goes on the highest shelf in a given room, and nothing is placed above it.

To give something like that to the leader of a different religion is a tremendous sign of respect.
 
Ultimately no one can know for sure–all we can do is presume the best of intentions. And if his intentions were wrong, how can we know he didn’t confess it and do penance? But that won’t stop the peddlers of scandal from publishing the picture far and wide. Fortunately the vast, vast majority of Catholics don’t even know of it anyway. I’m sure that’s why the Pope didn’t give an explanation–he would only know he needed to give one if he read a few internet forums, blogs, and websites.
 
Lujack said:
As a previous poster has pointed out, it was also a way to honor the magnitude of the gift. For Muslims, the Qu’Ran is the literal word of God. The majority believe that it was uncreated, existing from the beginning of time in the same sense that we believe the Father and the Son co-existed from the beginning of time, uncreated. In a Muslim household, the Qu’Ran always goes on the highest shelf in a given room, and nothing is placed above it.

To give something like that to the leader of a different religion is a tremendous sign of respect.
Click to expand...
Yes, which unfortunately makes it all the more problematic for any Christian, let alone the Vicar of Christ, to respect it in this way. The Muslim view of the Koran, however lofty, is false (which I guess goes without saying.) I can totally understand wanting to please the gift-giver by being grateful for a gift. But it gets really, really murky when the gift they have given you is a blasphemous fraud, only posing as Divine Revelation. There are any number of saints who would have been martyred before showing any such respect for such a book.
 
Genesis315 said:
Ultimately no one can know for sure–all we can do is presume the best of intentions. And if his intentions were wrong, how can we know he didn’t confess it and do penance? But that won’t stop the peddlers of scandal from publishing the picture far and wide.
Click to expand...
Indeed. As our Lord said Himself, For it must needs be that scandals come: but nevertheless woe to that man who is scandalized by them. Oh wait, that’s not how it goes…(Matt 18:7)
 
DavidPalm said:
Yes, which unfortunately makes it all the more problematic for any Christian, let alone the Vicar of Christ, to respect it in this way. The Muslim view of the Koran, however lofty, is false (which I guess goes without saying.) I can totally understand wanting to please the gift-giver by being grateful for a gift. But it gets really, really murky when the gift they have given you is a blasphemous fraud, only posing as Divine Revelation. There are any number of saints who would have been martyred before showing any such respect for such a book.
Click to expand...
Excellent comment! 👍
 
Do not forget that a lot of Catholics continue to be persecuted in Muslim lands. Through this act of respect, John Paul helped to prevent religious intolerance and persecution. Muslims would have respected the Pope for doing this, and it may have even caused many to begin investigating the Catholic religion.

Kissing the Quran is not a sign of acceptance. It is simply a gesture of gratitude to those who gave him this gift.
 
Dempsey1919 said:
Do not forget that a lot of Catholics continue to be persecuted in Muslim lands. Through this act of respect, John Paul helped to prevent religious intolerance and persecution. Muslims would have respected the Pope for doing this, and it may have even caused many to begin investigating the Catholic religion.

Kissing the Quran is not a sign of acceptance. It is simply a gesture of gratitude to those who gave him this gift.
Click to expand...
And the persecutions continue. 😦
 
Maybe but imagine the reaction had Bishop Williamson done the same.
 
And the persecutions continue.
Click to expand...
Sadly. May those who die for Christ receive life everlasting!

John Paul II knew about the persecutions, and I believe one of the reasons for kissing the Quran was an attempt to please the Muslims and end any religious intolerance or persecution.
 
brigid12 said:
Agreed. I also wonder if he wasn’t paying respect to that small part in the book that was of God. Although he wasn’t a Franciscan, during the Crusades they successfully developed a relationship toward the evangelization of Muslims.
I do think, IMHO, that it would have eased a lot of Catholics if he had explained the reason for his having done this.
Click to expand...
I’ve thought that also. I think Koran acccepts the first 5 books of the Old Testament…I am sure his motives were completely in keeping with the love of Christ and obedience to the gospels in regard to loving God and neighbor as our self

I think this is nothing more than a tempest in a teapot
 
Dempsey1919 said:
Sadly. May those who die for Christ receive life everlasting!

John Paul II knew about the persecutions, and I believe one of the reasons for kissing the Quran was an attempt to please the Muslims and end any religious intolerance or persecution.
Click to expand...
Equally importantly, that sign of respect, which is traditional in Middle Eastern countries, did no harm. Refusing, rejecting, or disrespecting the gift would have horribly poisoned relations with the Arab world, and probably increased the persecutions.
 
Only guessing, but the Catholic Faith does accept thoseTruths that exist in other religions. It does not accept those beliefs that it views as untruths. Although much of the Koran would probably not be accepted by the Catholic faith, there are some portions that would be regarded as truths. He may have been making recognition or acknowledgement of those common lines of faith.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top