Why did the Holy See ever allow female altar servers.

[Annabelle_Marie]

BlindManWalking:
Actually our seminary has a huge group going in this year…the biggest they have seen in 40+ years…and our bishop allows altar girl servers…

 

[BlindManWalking]

Frothy? Seriously I’m not going to listen much to someone who would only allow their daughter to make snacks. She can’t sing in the choir?

Yes the church allows it…which also means it hasn’t said its a terrible thing…Some of you are but oh well.

I know from experience…back when I was a girl…there were no altar girls…and guess what…vocations were dying…when I got to an age when vocations should have been booming from no altar girls…they were dying. My two brothers who served? Not even Catholic anymore.

What parents need to do is create an expectation of service…not let them sign up at will like it’s basketball practice.

And yes, I as a women serve as an EMHC and I have had to help twice the RCIA group lead the stations of the cross. Once I had to read as the leader…which meant leading people in prayer…why? Because the other part was the part of Jesus and the only other person who would step up was my husband so obviously he had that part. Just because I serve as an EMHC does not mean I think I’m going to be a priest for crying out loud.

I very plainly said “serve”. While singing in the choir is a type of service, you know very well what I meant based on the context of this thread.

Your apostate brothers grew up in the era of the VII fallout, right?

Never seen a Stations of the Cross where multiple people are leading. Priest leads in all my experiences. Your husband should have been the one reading it in entirety.

As for EMHC’s, I’ve been to daily OF Masses in the area where the entire attendance was around 15 and yet there were two EMHC’s doing their thing. EMHC’s are abused. They’re unnecessary 9 times out of 10. How 10% became all the time, I dunno.

Glad you discount my opinion because I expressed that I would not allow my daughter to do that which is regrettably permissible.

I won’t be marrying anyone with your opinion anyway, so, it’s a wash.

 

[BlindManWalking]

Actually our seminary has a huge group going in this year…the biggest they have seen in 40+ years…and our bishop allows altar girl servers…

What constitutes the biggest group?

doubling 1 just gives 2. While that is a big jump in percent, it’s kinda a joke when looked at for what it is.

What is “big”?

 

[Brendan]

Actually our seminary has a huge group going in this year…the biggest they have seen in 40+ years…and our bishop allows altar girl servers…

As I mentiond before, our parish has about 950 registered familes, and we have about 1-2 men ordained each year. 12 in the last 10 years.

We have only altar boys.

How is your particular parish doing in that regard?

 

[superamazingman]

As I mentiond before, our parish has about 950 registered familes, and we have about 1-2 men ordained each year. 12 in the last 10 years.

We have only altar boys.

How is your particular parish doing in that regard?

Indeed. I ran the numbers, and being traditional pays off. If all the parishes of my diocese produced as many vocations as the gregorian-chant-every-mass-kneeling-to-recieve-communion-ad-orientem-daily-Masses-true-sacred-music-and-a-pastor-who-wears-maniples-and-birettas parish that is in the next town over, we’d have something like 150 -300 priests ordained each year. But guess what: we don’t! Ergo…

 

[superamazingman]

As another poster put it so well a while back: Rome *advocates *for males and *allows *females with special conditions. That truly is the truth of it.

 

[Kathryn_Ann]

Actually the Pope is not impeccable at all.

As to matters of the law and discipline where he is not constrained by doctrine, he has the final word - good, bad or indifferent.

Gentle Note: I believe you mean “infallible,” (rather than "impeccable:angel1:

 

[Kathryn_Ann]

It happened after the 1983 Code of Canon law was promulgated. The language was easily interpreted as allowing female altar servers and so priests started allowing them. When some years later there was a question about the licity of such a decision, a dubium was submitted to Rome which confirmed that
a) yes, females could serve at the altar based on the wording, but that
b) the canon was permissive rather than presciptive, IOW, they could serve but only if the bishop allowed it and a priest could not be forced to allow them in his parish and/or at a Mass he was celebrating.

This seems an excellent answer to the question here, (permissive rather than prescriptive.)
Recalling “Whatsoever you bind on earth will be bound in Heaven, whatsoever you loose shall be loosed in Heaven,” and following the rulings of our Holy Church, we can rest in Her decisions. Our Blessed Mother inspires us to speak respectfully of all God’s children, be they male or female, and that even though our callings may be different, they are equally joyful because we serve our Heavenly Father out of love. :angel1:

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

As I mentiond before, our parish has about 950 registered familes, and we have about 1-2 men ordained each year. 12 in the last 10 years.

We have only altar boys.

How is your particular parish doing in that regard?

Brendan…I am really too tired of hearing about your parish…that it walks on water…so I’m putting you on my ignore button…

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

This seems an excellent answer to the question here, (permissive rather than prescriptive.)
Recalling “Whatsoever you bind on earth will be bound in Heaven, whatsoever you loose shall be loosed in Heaven,” and following the rulings of our Holy Church, we can rest in Her decisions. Our Blessed Mother inspires us to speak respectfully of all God’s children, be they male or female, and that even though our callings may be different, they are equally joyful because we serve our Heavenly Father out of love. :angel1:

Excellent Post!

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

As another poster put it so well a while back: Rome *advocates *for males and *allows *females with special conditions. That truly is the truth of it.

Sure…duh…if a Bishop doesn’t allow it…that’s it. If a priest doesn’t allow it…that’s it…end of story.

But if they do…why all the second guessing of Rome? I guess the laity thinks they know more then the clergy??

 

[roadsend]

Actually our seminary has a huge group going in this year…the biggest they have seen in 40+ years…and our bishop allows altar girl servers…

And how many countries and dioceses are they from?

Formerly some of these dioceses had their own seminaries, chock full of their own folks.

How many are from our own diocese?

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

And how many countries and dioceses are they from?

Formerly some of these dioceses had their own seminaries, chock full of their own folks.

How many are from our own diocese?

Quite a few…and with the upcoming retirement of our Archbishop…I believe you will start to see even more.

 

[superamazingman]

Brendan…I am really too tired of hearing about your parish…that it walks on water…so I’m putting you on my ignore button…

There’s many other parishes like his that support the evidence that if you celebrate the Mass with dignity, have altar boys and communion rails, and sacred music, the collections, parishioners, and vocations will flow in. I’ve seen it many times.

Maybe you could take a hint at this instead of ignoring it.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

Kinda like having boys do Nun things…

They do, they’re called religious brothers.

 

[NewEnglandPriest]

There’s many other parishes like his that support the evidence that if you celebrate the Mass with dignity, have altar boys and communion rails, and sacred music, the collections, parishioners, and vocations will flow in. I’ve seen it many times.

Yes and no. My current parish allows female altar servers, lectors, and EMHC. We are full for every weekend Mass, have 100 at daily Mass, and currently has 4 seminarians studying for the diocese.

A parish one town over only allows male altar servers, uses communion rails and they are half full on weekends, a handful for daily Mass and haven’t sent someone to seminary in over a decade.

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

There’s many other parishes like his that support the evidence that if you celebrate the Mass with dignity, have altar boys and communion rails, and sacred music, the collections, parishioners, and vocations will flow in. I’ve seen it many times.

Maybe you could take a hint at this instead of ignoring it.

Since our parish is busting at the seams and we need to build a new building…I think we must be doing something right. Just maybe.

I just don’t appreciate his attitude or yours for that matter. It’s not so much the message…although some of it I disagree with you on…but it’s how it comes across. This isn’t the traditional forumn…last time I check anyway.

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

Yes and no. My current parish allows female altar servers, lectors, and EMHC. We are full for every weekend Mass, have 100 at daily Mass, and currently has 4 seminarians studying for the diocese.

A parish one town over only allows male altar servers, uses communion rails and they are half full on weekends, a handful for daily Mass and haven’t sent someone to seminary in over a decade.

It’s always interesting. My daily parish (close to my work) is more traditional minded…extended altar rails and such…although they do have female altar servers and I have seen some weird things there and there is a tendancy to rush through the Mass.

My home parish which doesn’t have altar rails at all, distributes under both species, has female lectors and EMHC’s…seems much more reverent. Our priest takes time for things and is very careful. All three of our weekend Masses are pretty much full.

I went to both for Ash Wednesday and it was interesting to note the differences.

 

[BlindManWalking]

Yes and no. My current parish allows female altar servers, lectors, and EMHC. We are full for every weekend Mass, have 100 at daily Mass, and currently has 4 seminarians studying for the diocese.

A parish one town over only allows male altar servers, uses communion rails and they are half full on weekends, a handful for daily Mass and haven’t sent someone to seminary in over a decade.

Fr., when you have to buy an old football stadium, the numbers still won’t impress me… even Joel Osteen packs houses, and even the multitudes left Jesus when He dropped some heavy knowledge on em. Quality, not quantity. Quality will produce quantity in the quantity of quality’s level.

I’m more worried about the quality of the parish life and catechesis.

Your parish has 4 seminarians studying for the diocese? Or the diocese has 4 seminarians? How many diocesan seminarians total? What do I care about a number, what is that percentage in comparison with surrounding dioceses of equal or near equal composition? If your diocese is 1,000,000 people and has say, 20 seminarians total, and a more traditionally minded, orthodox diocese was 500,000 and has 15 seminarians, who has the bigger percentage? Raw numbers are a bit of a cheeky muse, aren’t they? More Picasso than Da Vinci, are they, eh?

Reason I ask is current local OF church has 4 novitiates from CSC at their parish, but they’re just, I dunno, interns or something. They weren’t parish-grown so to speak.

I find it odd that we have so many absolutely, totally, awesome parishes with the spirituality of Saints Augustine and Aquinas! It’s all awesome!

Well, where the heck are these parishes? Many of us have tried to find them.

I’m going to start demanding video proof from now on. :yukonjoe:

 

[Annabelle_Marie]

Your apostate brothers grew up in the era of the VII fallout, right? Oh…here we go…the evils of the world on VII and altar girls…

Never seen a Stations of the Cross where multiple people are leading. Priest leads in all my experiences. Your husband should have been the one reading it in entirety. Well…with so many penance services in town and the such…our priest doesn’t have time to lead them all. And since we have female readers…it won’t make much sense for him to lead it in the entirety…although…since I am shy…I won’t have minded. But that doesn’t change the fact that other times it will be read by females…

As for EMHC’s, I’ve been to daily OF Masses in the area where the entire attendance was around 15 and yet there were two EMHC’s doing their thing. EMHC’s are abused. They’re unnecessary 9 times out of 10. How 10% became all the time, I dunno. Our parish distributes under both species…so they are kind of necessary. Even the daily parish I go to that doesn’t distribute under both…with one priest…they always utilitze one EMHC. But both parishes have more then 15 people at their daily Mass. I’m glad for EMHC’s…cause I have to get back to work. It helps keep the Mass so that people can go on their lunch hour.

I won’t be marrying anyone with your opinion anyway, so, it’s a wash. You could do worse You never know who God might put your way…

Didn’t you say you go to a fssp parish anyway?