Why do Catholics play the role of victim so much?

[Singinbeauty]

really! where did you get that idea? what happened to the apostles? did they go into a happy party binge after Jesus left?

what happened to the saying of Jesus: if any man wnats to follow me let him pick up his cross daily. if cross means suffers, there you have it.

Sorry!

No, the apostles were murdered and attacked in a lot of cases… how could anyone even equate having a protestant disagree with their catholic faith with what the apostles went through??? It’s ludicrous! So what, someone doesn’t like your faith, boohoo. If all they do is disagree or even mock then you are doing good. All you have to do is walk away or put the poster on ‘ignore’ to not see or hear it. Wait until someone stands over you with a gun to your head and asks if you believe in God, then you can talk about ‘taking up your cross’. I am sorry if I don’t agree that persecution has to do with someone mocking your faith. IMO this is NOT suffering. It is an annoyance but definitely NOT suffering.

We, especially americans, cannot even BEGIN to compare our lives with the apostles. We have it WAY too good. We can go in the middle of the busiest street and scream about God and how much He loves us and the worst you get is people thinking you are an idiot. You do that in some other countries and you get shot or dragged off to jail then executed… Please, no comparing yourself with the apostles who faced death for your Faith. We have the opportunity to freely express our Faith with those around us but we don’t - most of the time - because we are scared about how it will be perceived.

Take up our cross??? We don’t even come close to comparing to the apostles… We are standing next to our crosses, and some of us are expecting Christ to pick it up and carry it for us. We need to take a more active role and not expect Christ to do it all for us. In the midst of His pain and carrying His cross Christ NEVER played the part of victim. He forgave them even during it. So instead of whining about how this protestant or that one - or this catholic or that one - doesn’t agree or makes fun of your Faith, forgive them and move on while telling them about what Christ has done for you.

 

[wisdomseeker]

No, the apostles were murdered and attacked in a lot of cases… how could anyone even equate having a protestant disagree with their catholic faith with what the apostles went through??? It’s ludicrous! So what, someone doesn’t like your faith, boohoo. If all they do is disagree or even mock then you are doing good. All you have to do is walk away or put the poster on ‘ignore’ to not see or hear it. Wait until someone stands over you with a gun to your head and asks if you believe in God, then you can talk about ‘taking up your cross’. I am sorry if I don’t agree that persecution has to do with someone mocking your faith. IMO this is NOT suffering. It is an annoyance but definitely NOT suffering.

We, especially americans, cannot even BEGIN to compare our lives with the apostles. We have it WAY too good. We can go in the middle of the busiest street and scream about God and how much He loves us and the worst you get is people thinking you are an idiot. You do that in some other countries and you get shot or dragged off to jail then executed… Please, no comparing yourself with the apostles who faced death for your Faith. We have the opportunity to freely express our Faith with those around us but we don’t - most of the time - because we are scared about how it will be perceived.

Take up our cross??? We don’t even come close to comparing to the apostles… We are standing next to our crosses, and some of us are expecting Christ to pick it up and carry it for us. We need to take a more active role and not expect Christ to do it all for us. In the midst of His pain and carrying His cross Christ NEVER played the part of victim. He forgave them even during it. So instead of whining about how this protestant or that one - or this catholic or that one - doesn’t agree or makes fun of your Faith, forgive them and move on while telling them about what Christ has done for you.

Sorry. i was not comparing dissagreements with Catholics to the sufferings of the apostles.

but i will say this that protestants false accusations teaching people against the CC has brought great sufferings to the Church. many has left because of lies they been told. many even are hateful towards the CC.

family have been divided because of that. i experience this in my own family.

the rest of it i totally agree with you. arguments back and forth does no good. if they dont hear the first time, walk away and the shake off the dust of your sandals and move on…

blessings

 

[peary]

If you really are the one true church that Christ founded, then why do you give a hoot what anyone else thinks of you? It amazes me the extent some of you will go to play the victim’s role.

Then, why put us in this position?

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

No, the apostles were murdered and attacked in a lot of cases… how could anyone even equate having a protestant disagree with their catholic faith with what the apostles went through??? It’s ludicrous! So what, someone doesn’t like your faith, boohoo. If all they do is disagree or even mock then you are doing good. All you have to do is walk away or put the poster on ‘ignore’ to not see or hear it. Wait until someone stands over you with a gun to your head and asks if you believe in God, then you can talk about ‘taking up your cross’. I am sorry if I don’t agree that persecution has to do with someone mocking your faith. IMO this is NOT suffering. It is an annoyance but definitely NOT suffering.

We, especially americans, cannot even BEGIN to compare our lives with the apostles. We have it WAY too good. We can go in the middle of the busiest street and scream about God and how much He loves us and the worst you get is people thinking you are an idiot. You do that in some other countries and you get shot or dragged off to jail then executed… Please, no comparing yourself with the apostles who faced death for your Faith. We have the opportunity to freely express our Faith with those around us but we don’t - most of the time - because we are scared about how it will be perceived.

Take up our cross??? We don’t even come close to comparing to the apostles… We are standing next to our crosses, and some of us are expecting Christ to pick it up and carry it for us. We need to take a more active role and not expect Christ to do it all for us. In the midst of His pain and carrying His cross Christ NEVER played the part of victim. He forgave them even during it. So instead of whining about how this protestant or that one - or this catholic or that one - doesn’t agree or makes fun of your Faith, forgive them and move on while telling them about what Christ has done for you.

I agree with you in part, but I believe as a Catholic the big picture is being missed in your commentary. Yes it is true the Catholic Church is not being persecuted in the U.S as it was in the first 400 centuries, but never the less the Catholic church is being persecuted in other parts of the world, and where one member hurts we all hurt. But the lessons and teachings from the apostles are still being practiced by Catholics today.

Let me introduce you to the ministry of reconciliation that Jesus instituted in his Catholic (universal) church:
Today’s sufferings by Catholics in the U.S are not what you may imply as to the apostles but they are in context the same;

Here are a few scriptures that Catholics live by in the sacrament of Confession; It is called self denial, and Penance;

Mathew 16:24
19 Then Jesus said to his disciples, "Whoever wishes to come after me must deny himself, 20 take up his cross, and follow me.
25
For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will find it. 21
26
What profit would there be for one to gain the whole world and forfeit his life? Or what can one give in exchange for his life?

Luke 14:27
Whoever does not carry his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple.

Galatians 5:22
In contrast, the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, generosity, faithfulness,
23
gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
24
Now those who belong to Christ (Jesus) have crucified their flesh with its passions and desires.
25
If we live in the Spirit, let us also follow the Spirit.
26
Let us not be conceited, provoking one another, envious of one another.

Let us not be mistaken, Catholics undergo much pain and suffering in the body of Jesus Christ. For one we are called to lay our life down for our friends. To deny oneself, for the love of another, makes us imitators of Jesus Christ. It is done mostly unnoticed, others are done by morticfication, or sacrifice for another to attain the good rather than him/herself. I can only thinko of Mother Theresa as a recent example today. No Catholics take no delight in pain, we do however find blessing in pain as Christ did for the sake of others.

Paul as a living penance, endured much hardships for proclaiming the good news, but he called his hardships “joy”. Paul excercised these hardships in the spirit of penance, as Catholics do today. Catholics die to self inorder to live in the spirit. This is not an easy task to be asked of anyone, cept for the Love of God. Here is Paul again;

Romans 8:13
For if you live according to the flesh, you will die, but if by the spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.
14
2 For those who are led by the Spirit of God are children of God.
15
For you did not receive a spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you received a spirit of adoption, through which we cry, “Abba, 3 Father!”
16
The Spirit itself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,
17
and if children, then heirs, heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, **if only we suffer with him so that we may also be glorified with him. **18
4 I consider that the sufferings of this present time are as nothing compared with the glory to be revealed for us.

The acts of self denial, mortification, and penance that Catholics Practice, are weapons to destroy the obstacles that prevent us from sharing in God’s divine life and love. These are what the apostles taught by living example, these are what Catholics practice in the body of Jesus Christ, in “Sacrament” of Reconciliation, where one denies himself, and offers penance, and sometimes mortification for the sake of others.

Protestants and non-catholics refer to repent and believe in Jesus, as if it were a one time event to become Christian. Catholics apply this repentance to everyday living, not only for ourselves but for others who need saving.

Peace.

 

[kell0618]

If you really are the one true church that Christ founded, then why do you give a hoot what anyone else thinks of you? It amazes me the extent some of you will go to play the victim’s role.

Hi SIA,

In my view, you have just completed the circle in doing what you claim others do. Is your OP an indication of turned cheek or pointing out a speck in your brother’s eye? It does not seem so to me and I will never understand posts which complain about the complaining of another. There are whiners in the world and there are those who attack; There are also those who bear wrongs silently and those who are peace keepers. The aforementioned people come from all backgrounds.

God bless you,

Kelly

 

[SIA]

Hi SIA,

In my view, you have just completed the circle in doing what you claim others do. Is your OP an indication of turned cheek or pointing out a speck in your brother’s eye? It does not seem so to me and I will never understand posts which complain about the complaining of another. There are whiners in the world and there are those who attack; There are also those who bear wrongs silently and those who are peace keepers. The aforementioned people come from all backgrounds.

God bless you,

Kelly

Uhh, what???

 

[kell0618]

Uhh, what???

Hi SIA

I’m sorry you didn’t understand my post as it truly encompasses my view on the subject.

I will break it down for you:

You are complaining because some people are complainers. That makes you a complainer as well. Now THAT is full circle.

Some are able to turn and offer the other cheek; some are tired of turning their heads to offer the other cheek so frequently; some do not turn the other cheek. (that is a Scripture reference to Matthew 5:39)

Are you familiar with the Scripture verse about finding a speck in your brother’s eye yet you don’t acknowledge the plank in your own (Matthew 7:3)? That is the point of my reply to your OP.

There are over 1 billion Catholics, sure I know some may seem to be ‘playing victim’. People have different thresholds of tolerance when under constant attack and I find that the place where the attacks are so blatant and unrelenting is online.

Perhaps you do not understand how it is to be constantly attacked and maligned from non-Catholics in this and other online forums because you are not Catholic yourself.

Let us do everything to give glory to God.

Peace be with you,

Kelly

 

[anamchara]

Protestants and non-catholics refer to repent and believe in Jesus, as if it were a one time event to become Christian. Catholics apply this repentance to everyday living, not only for ourselves but for others who need saving.

Gabriel, I would caution you against making generalized statements about Protestants. Much of what you described about Catholics is also the case of many of the high Church Protestants. You are speaking here about the osas Protestants which are only one part part of a very large and diverse community of our separate brethren. Catholics do not own the market on suffering or many of the other Catholic attributes you describe.

I have major issues with Catholics who start spouting what they think all Protestants believe or don’t believe.

Many Catholics on CAF have a bad habit of playing the victim to the point of being ridiculous. That is the point the OP was trying to make and he or she is absolutely correct. CAF draws in many converts from fundamentalists backgrounds and they often bring with them the same tactics of narrow-mindness and ignorance they had as evangelicals. I’m not speaking about all evangelical converts here. But a big majority anyway.

 

[anamchara]

Perhaps you do not understand how it is to be constantly attacked and maligned from non-Catholics in this and other online forums because you are not Catholic yourself.

Kelly, I’m a Catholic and have never once been attacked for what I believe. Catholics who claim this are spending way too much time online and for whatever reason, online draws in huge amounts of racial evangelicals. Also, many Catholics who claim this on CAF are often looking for it. They love going into other Protestant forums and bringing back with the Proof of this horrible persecution out there. Thank goodness CAF has swarming rules.

Another major factor is that many of our converts on here do come from backgrounds where they were taught horrible anti-Catholic sentiments growing up. For some they have major resentment/anger issues that they have not reconciled. So, they go looking for fights and ways to prove all Protestants wrong. I’ve seen this hundred times.

That is a dangerous road to go down. The Op is picking up on some of that in my opinion.

 

[peary]

**I don’t know about Catholics in here playing the role of ‘victim’ but it’s quite apparent by various postings that protestants have an unfair advantage in that regard. **

 

[djrakowski]

Another major factor is that many of our converts on here do come from backgrounds where they were taught horrible anti-Catholic sentiments growing up. For some they have major resentment/anger issues that they have not reconciled. So, they go looking for fights and ways to prove all Protestants wrong. I’ve seen this hundred times.

I’m a convert from a background quite like the one you’ve just described, and I can assure you, I’m not spoiling for a fight.

A few months ago, I sent a few emails to my former pastor to let him know that I appreciate all he did for my family while we were members of his church, and to get his perspective on a few theological matters I thought we had in common. He responded by telling me not to contact him again unless I was interested in converting back to his church.

Then, another friend, also a convert who attended the same church, stopped by his office to offer him a small gift. It was a book in which some of our distinctive Catholic beliefs were explained in a relatively friendly and non-confrontational manner. His response was to turn his back and walk away from her.

A Calvinist Protestant who lives in my area found me on these very forums, and singled me out for a months-long series of badgering emails in which he accused me of following doctrines of demons, and more than once implied that I was headed for hell.

Not once did I (or the friend I mentioned above) do anything to provoke the hateful actions of these individuals. And neither myself nor my friend have any “major resentment/anger issues” that we’ve yet to resolve. What we have are tons and tons of people who used to be our friends, with whom we used to share intimate Christian fellowship, who no longer consider us Christian. And our efforts to reach out to them in Christian charity have been ignored, or met with outright hostility.

So please, be careful to avoid over-generalizing with respect to those of us who used to be evangelicals and fundamentalists, and with all due respect, please refrain from the amateur psychoanalyzing when trying to determine what drives the all-too-frequent negative behaviors of a very few of fellow Catholics.

EDIT: as another small example of the kid of stuff Catholics endure around here… about a week ago, I offered to give a copy of a Catholic book to another Catholic co-worker, as I had extra left over after giving a bunch of 'em to my apologetics class. He asked me not to bring it over, since there were a bunch of guys from evangelical backgrounds waiting to pick fights with him over religion. I can’t even bring a Catholic book to a fellow Catholic around here without the threat of confrontation with non-Catholics.

 

[anamchara]

So please, be careful to avoid over-generalizing with respect to those of us who used to be evangelicals and fundamentalists, and with all due respect, please refrain from the amateur psychoanalyzing when trying to determine what drives the all-too-frequent negative behaviors of a very few of fellow Catholics.

I used the word “some” I didn’t say all. You chose to come in here and take it personal. And although I appreciate your situation, this thread is about the OP’s concern over why so many play the victim. I was giving my two cents. You can call it amateur psychoanalyzing if you want but I still stand by what I said and feel no reason to refrain. I do not claim to be expert but after spending 3 years on Steve Rays message board and 4 years on here, I’ve seen just about all I can take of ignorant evangelical converts and their victim game. Many of them are angry and I see it all the time “we were lied to!!” “don’t trust Protestants”

Sorry I’ve seen way too much evidence of resentment,then not. There are a few who seem have found some peace in the Catholic Church and don’t seem to hold onto this rancor, God bless them.

 

[anamchara]

EDIT: as another small example of the kid of stuff Catholics endure around here… about a week ago, I offered to give a copy of a Catholic book to another Catholic co-worker, as I had extra left over after giving a bunch of 'em to my apologetics class. He asked me not to bring it over, since there were a bunch of guys from evangelical backgrounds waiting to pick fights with him over religion. I can’t even bring a Catholic book to a fellow Catholic around here without the threat of confrontation with non-Catholics.

There are backward ignorant people in the world, if this is the case at your work then avoid the topic of religion. This guy who wanted said book obviously lets others control what he reads and who he is. Too bad for him. If someone is being harassed at work then go to your union or your supervisor. My husband works for the state as a programmer analyst with many different faiths. They are mature adults and know full well harassment of any kind is not tolerated. You obviously don’t work with mature adults. They sound like children.

I am now going off topic, sorry but that is really ridiculous.

 

[Gabriel_of_12]

Gabriel, I would caution you against making generalized statements about Protestants. Much of what you described about Catholics is also the case of many of the high Church Protestants. You are speaking here about the osas Protestants which are only one part part of a very large and diverse community of our separate brethren. Catholics do not own the market on suffering or many of the other Catholic attributes you describe.

I have major issues with Catholics who start spouting what they think all Protestants believe or don’t believe.

Many Catholics on CAF have a bad habit of playing the victim to the point of being ridiculous. That is the point the OP was trying to make and he or she is absolutely correct. CAF draws in many converts from fundamentalists backgrounds and they often bring with them the same tactics of narrow-mindness and ignorance they had as evangelicals. I’m not speaking about all evangelical converts here. But a big majority anyway.

What part of my statement is not true? The once saved always saved theology believed by prostestants and non-catholics alike does not prejudice against what they believe, Here is my quote;

Originally Posted by Gabriel of 12
Protestants and non-catholics refer to repent and believe in Jesus, as if it were a one time event to become Christian. Catholics apply this repentance to everyday living, not only for ourselves but for others who need saving…

What can be difficult, is to name the different protestant and non-catholic denominations by name who hold to this OSAS theology. What I described about Catholics, comes from this practicing Catholic, I never described what Protestants subscribe too only Catholics. I think it is great that there are Christian denominations that follow the Catholic Traditions of Confession, Penance, Mortification etc. Then lets hear them, I only spoke of what I am sure I know of my Catholic faith.

I dont understand what Catholics you mean by playing the victim of what? When what Catholics practice is to fast, sacrifice, pray, and mortify ourselves for others, is done in secret before our heavenly Father. Just like when we offer a prayer up by the lights of candles that burn heaven bound.

But I will make a mental note of your accusation of me, not to make general statements of Protestants. Even though they might all believe the same. I will try and be specific. I am sure you know although, you dont ask a simple thing, for there are two many to classify as one Christian faith, when many are seperated from one another. Example the Anglican church today, One has to make a clear distinction between Traditionalists and Liberalists Anglicans. Maybe CAF can develope a web site for each seperate denomination here, so as not to offend the church’s in Protestantism,or non-catholics.

Peace be with you

 

[SORROWS]

Very nice post Gabriel of 12

Catholics play the victim? Ridiculous. I have so much admiration for the humility I see in our Religion and am continuously shocked by what I see in the behavior of others.

The Catholic Church is the closest representative of how Our Lord lived His life. It is His Church. We as sinners can only try and follow Him and the Catholic Church is the best example we have.

 

[anamchara]

What part of my statement is not true? The once saved always saved theology believed by prostestants and non-catholics alike does not prejudice against what they believe, Here is my quote;

Not ALL Protestants believe in OSAS. You are talking about a small segment compared to the bigger Protestant communities over all. That’s my point, you have to be careful. You simply can’t generalize about them. They are way too diverse. You are referring mainly to fundamentalists/evangelicals when you say that. They do not make up the entire Protestant faith.

It would be just as frustrating for a Catholic to read major over generalizations about them.

It is important to at least know which ones actually believe that before saying it.

Also, we are talking about Catholics who play the victim of thinking everyone is out to get them, not what they practice. At least this is what I thought the OP was referring to. If this is the case then YES, they do have a bad habit of that on CAF.

 

[Strummer]

I’m a convert from a background quite like the one you’ve just described, and I can assure you, I’m not spoiling for a fight.

And yet you note only the most egregious examples of anti-Catholic behavior with no counterpoint as if your experiences are indicative of the entirety of Protestantism. Now, this is not to discount the horendousness of their behavior, but to “celebrate” this indignation exclusive of any redemption of Protestants in general borders on needless detraction. With all due respect, can you accept that the experiences you’ve outlined may well be unique to a particular geography &/or demography? Out here in the West, I’ve NEVER experienced such behavior from my Protestant friends. On the contrary, I still consider my former pastor (Presbyterian - PCUSA) a good friend and hope to visit him and his family on the coast soon. And, yes, he accepts my conversion back to Catholicism. However, I would not be too surprised to find such behavior from my former step-brother but then he is a dim bulb on the marque of life.

I believe it may be more accurate to say that such sentiments you describe are more indicative of ignorance and inbreeding rather than religion.

 

[Strummer]

What part of my statement is not true? The once saved always saved theology believed by prostestants and non-catholics alike does not prejudice against what they believe,

Anamchara has already pointed out the falacy of your premise so I do not need to elaborate.

What I described about Catholics, comes from this practicing Catholic, I never described what Protestants subscribe too only Catholics.

Never? Really? Then who was it that claimed all Protestants ascribe to OSAS? Has your account been hijacked?

I dont understand what Catholics you mean by playing the victim of what? When what Catholics practice is to fast, sacrifice, pray, and mortify ourselves for others, is done in secret before our heavenly Father.

Ah, so here you lay out a feast of red herring; you give examples that have nothing to do with the issue at hand. “All she wants to do is sing and raise her children. Just leave Brittany alone!”
The behaviors you list are the admirable aspects of practicing the faith. The “self victimization” I see is demonstrated outside of the church. It is the behavior of some who revel in their “suffering” so much that they seem to seek it out and claim oppression at every turn. In this manner, they can feel that they “must be sanctified” because they “suffer so much”. In my opinion such self-serving “martyrdom” demeans the holiness of true saints.

But I will make a mental note of your accusation of me, not to make general statements of Protestants. Even though they might all believe the same.

Ah, but you see: they don’t all believe the same. Why do you think there are different denominations?

 

[goodknight439]

If you really are the one true church that Christ founded, then why do you give a hoot what anyone else thinks of you? It amazes me the extent some of you will go to play the victim’s role.

What is more amazing is the lengths that people go to try and attack the Church.

It is Christianity and the Judeo-Christian belief system that are attacked daily. The Catholic Church is a large target in that group.

 

[djrakowski]

And yet you note only the most egregious examples of anti-Catholic behavior with no counterpoint as if your experiences are indicative of the entirety of Protestantism.

Well, none of the Protestants in my life who know of my conversion have met it kindly - and that includes the liberal Protestants, like my wife’s cousin, who’s preparing for ministry in the Episcopal Church. At a family reunion this past weekend, she gloated over a supposed stream of converts, claiming that 'it’s really easy to convert Catholic priests - and I bet I could convert tons of ‘em.’ Yeah, it ain’t just the folks you and anamchara like to characterize as nothing short of knuckle-dragging, paste-eating apes who’ve come after us for our faith. It’s the enlightened paragons of openness, tolerance and intellectualism that populate the mainstream religions anamchara likes to talk about so much.

So if there are folks around here who are happy about our conversion to Catholicism, I’d like to meet 'em. The only ones who’ve greeted us with a welcome so far have been fellow Catholics, and even then, the only ones who’ve been truly happy are the ones who go to parishes like mine.

Of course it’s not indicative of the entirety of Protestantism, and you’ve read FAR more into my post than intended if that’s what you think. And I would also add that the Protestants who actually care about what they believe around here tend to be conservative evangelicals (like the church I used to attend) and extremely liberal activist Protestants - and neither of those groups are happy about Catholics, least of all converts to Catholicism.

So there may well be Protestants who don’t care about converts or Catholicism, but then they’re usually indfferentists who believe anyone can be saved anywhere without changing anything - I’m OK, you’re OK. I’ll take knuckle-dragging, paste-eating apes with firm convictions over squishy, muddled, liberal elitism that populates mainline Protestantism any day - at least you can pin the former down on what they actually believe.

Now, this is not to discount the horendousness of their behavior, but to “celebrate” this indignation exclusive of any redemption of Protestants in general borders on needless detraction. With all due respect, can you accept that the experiences you’ve outlined may well be unique to a particular geography &/or demography? Out here in the West, I’ve NEVER experienced such behavior from my Protestant friends. On the contrary, I still consider my former pastor (Presbyterian - PCUSA) a good friend and hope to visit him and his family on the coast soon. And, yes, he accepts my conversion back to Catholicism. However, I would not be too surprised to find such behavior from my former step-brother but then he is a dim bulb on the marque of life.

Of course I can accept that - and I can also accept the fact that I’m surprised that these experiences happened here, in Michigan, a state that’s increasingly blue and decreasingly religious.

Further, how does it border on needless detraction for me to explain my experiences?

I would say that every time you accuse us of over-generalizing, you do the same. If I list every time a Protestant has accused me of not being Christian, or has said something terrible about my intellectual and spiritual state for having converted, you counter with something along the lines of, “well, it can’t be true, because that NEVER happens to me in California.” I see - so if it never happens in California, then *obviously *it can’t be happening elsewhere

I believe it may be more accurate to say that such sentiments you describe are more indicative of ignorance and inbreeding rather than religion.

Ah, I see… and I daresay, your attitude is just as elitist and offensive as anything I’ve ever heard out of a conservative Protestant’s mouth.

You obviously don’t know much about conservative Protestantism. Though these folks are, by and large, mistaken in the way they’ve chosen to characterize the Catholic Church, they’re deeply committed to seeing people accept and live the gospel message. Far from ignorant inbreeders, the pastors of these churches often study in serious seminaries for many years before accepting pastoral positions, including courses in Greek and Hebrew, along with pastoral counseling, homiletics and church management. And yet, because they hold strong opinions you don’t like (which, in my experience, is due more to the fact that they’ve been improperly informed), they’re ignorant inbreeders. And the people in these churches often blow away their Catholic and liberal Protestant counterparts when it comes to the formation of community and reaching out to meet the needs of their members and those who live near them, thus exemplifying the spirit of Christian service.

So I suppose your ecumenical efforts won’t include any conservative Protestants, then? I mean, after you’ve poured contempt on them with your nasty insults, you think they’d want to listen to your enlightened viewpoint?