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SHW
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Where/what is your source for your claim?
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MyRdmrLvs
Guest
The point of the post was not to infame but to answer the notion that all was well and that the church was one big happy family until those darn protestants messed things up. The point was that there has always been more that one church. The RCC belief that they have been the only Christian church for 2000 years is not true. When the argument is then made that the RCC is the only TRUE church and suggest that the lack of error is proof of that, this leads to the laundry list.
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MyRdmrLvs
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I consider myself to be intellectually honest, If you offer a reasonable scriptural support for a RCC doctrine I will admit it. Oh I just thought of one. I believe in a believers baptism,(dipped not sprinkled) however, I find the scriptural support given for infant baptism to be not unreasonable. there feel better?
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Prodigal_Son1
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Please feel free to start a thread with subjects you would be interested in scriptures supporting Catholic doctrines (1 per thread please, look how this one has gone
), private message me and give me the title and I’d be glad to join in.Oh, it’s not scriptural, but then it’s hard evidence to overlook, referencing infant baptism…but then it does come from Rome…
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bluelake
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Dislike Mary? What makes you think non- catholics dislike Mary?
Mary is the mother of our Savior.
Lu.1:48b reads, “From now on all generations will call me blessed.”
49. For the Mighty One has done great things for me, Holy is His name."
God bless,
bluelake
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MyRdmrLvs
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AMEN ! AMEN! AMEN!
See we agree on quite alot. One question I dont believe in the leadership of the pope, I take my communion from the elders of my church and I dont confess to a priest. So am I a member of that "holy , catholic and apostolic church? Is my soul in jeopardy?
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MyRdmrLvs
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I prefer chuch eye
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MyRdmrLvs
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So there are no pro-choice catholics? or Catholics who use contraception? catholics who believe priests should marry? Or do we just dismiss them as not being Catholic?Hey Tweetymom,
I like Tweety, too.
So, why then doesn’t the Holy Spirit tell every Protestant the same thing when they read the Bible?
**Why does one Protestant **(who claims that the Holy Spirit is helping him) believe that water Baptism is necessary for salvation, yet another Protestant (who also claims that the Holy Spirit is helping him) believes that water Baptism does nothing except show others that he has been saved?
Did Jesus found a Bible when He was on earth? No, He founded His Church.
The leadership of His one and only Church traveled throughout the whole known world and made disciples of Christ through water Baptism Matthew 28:18-20. His Church hierarchy of apostles/bishops, priests/elders, and deacons taught these new disciples what to observe (what to do in order to be remain members in good standing in His one Church) because this is what Jesus commanded them to do. The Catholic (universal, known throughout the whole world) Church of Christ is a body of believers who all believe the same thing and they all share the same faith, same baptism, and same God and Father.
Ephesians 4:4-6
There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called in one hope of your calling; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6 one God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.
Romans 1:8
First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.
This is a visible Church of like-minded believers. They became known as Christians throughout the whole known world Acts 11:26.
There is but one Church, but there are many local congregations (called churches) who are in union with this one Church and they all teach the same exact faith which was founded by Jesus and built upon Peter, the other apostles, and the prophets Ephesians 2:19-21. This Church (house of God 1 Timothy 3:15) was not built upon the Bible. They did not have a NT Bible yet. They learned the true faith by listening to the Apostles and their successors.
1 Corinthians 12:28
And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, varieties of tongues.
1 Corinthians 14:33
For God is not the author of confusion but of peace, as in all the churches of the saints.
Jesus’ One (Jesus founded only one Church), Holy (His Church is guided by the Holy Spirit), Catholic (His Church is universal - throughout the whole world) and Apostolic (built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets and now taught by their successors) Church does not teach confusion (conflicting doctrines).
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MyRdmrLvs
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I have not “lied” one time on this forum yet I have been accused of lying three times. If you see something I say that you dont believe to be true, please be more specific as to what it is, so that I might have the opportunity to either support my positions or concede the point and stand corrected.
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SHW
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Those aren’t keys. “Keys” in ancient times were a sign of authority. In Isaiah 22, it explains about the keys. The keys are given to only the chief steward of the king’s household and no one else. The chief steward is responsible for the safekeeping of the treasures of the kingdom and only he has the keys to the storerooms where the treasures are kept (food, gold, etc). When he dies, the keys are given to another person who then becomes the chief steward because someone must keep the keys safe and ready for the King’s use of his treasury at all times. This office of chief steward cannot be left vacant.
Moses and his successors, the scribes and Pharisees, had authority in the Old Covenant. Jesus called their authority the “seat/chair of Moses.”
Matthew 23:1-3
Then Jesus spoke to the multitudes and to His disciples, 2 saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3 Therefore whatever they tell you to observe, that observe and do,
However, only Peter and his successors were given the authority of the keys of the kingdom of heaven in the New Covenant.
Isaiah 22:22
The key of the house of David
I will lay on his shoulder;
** So he shall open, and no one shall shut;
And he shall shut, and no one shall open.**
The authority assigned with the keys is also accompanied by the authority to “bind and loose” (he shall open and no one shall shut; he shall shut, and no one shall open) and this powerful authority to bind and loose was given by Jesus to Peter along with the keys to the kingdom. This means that Peter’s decisions concerning the Church on earth are upheld in heaven. (Peter was not given the power to declare God’s commandments null and void, however.)
Matthew 16:15-19
He said to them, “But who do you say that I am?”
16 Simon Peter answered and said, “You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
17 Jesus answered and said to him, “**Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. **18 And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”
Only one person can have the keys of the office of chief steward at a time. Jesus chose Peter alone. Peter (and his successors) is in charge of safeguarding the gospel of Christ until Jesus returns at His Second Coming.
I think it best to trust Jesus’ judgment in that He chose to give the keys of the kingdom of heaven to only Peter and no one else and He did this in response to His own Father’s choice of Peter to lead Jesus’ Church.
If His Church ever teaches error, then the gates of Hades have prevailed against it and Jesus is then a liar because He stated that the gates of Hades would not prevail against His Church.
Jesus cannot lie, so we know that the Catholic Church cannot teach error because it is prevented from teaching error concerning faith and morals by the Holy Spirit because He is the Spirit of Truth, not falsehood. John 16:13
It is easy to determine which Church is the true Church of Christ. It is the one who has Peter’s successor at its head because only this one Church is in possession of the keys of the kingdom of heaven and it is also the one and only Church that has the promise of Jesus that Hades cannot prevail against this one Church.
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TEPO
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You would think that praying to Mary “diminishes” the glory to God -if the bible is your ONLY link to God…
Do you recieve Holy Communion with Jesus through the Eucharist ? If you do, then you should realize that you are truly “linked” to Jesus… And you know that Jesus is “linked” to God through the Trinity… So we cant really take anything away, when Jesus lives in us… We can only add.
(but I dont expect you to believe me, I dont think its in scripture…)
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TEPO
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You’re a liar when you say Catholics worship Mary.
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SHW
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Scripture is heart-breaking? Who taught you what you now believe about the meaning/interpretation of the Scriptures that you quote on this thread?
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SHW
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Luke 15:3-7
So He spoke this parable to them, saying:
4 “What man of you, having a hundred sheep, if he loses one of them, does not leave the ninety-nine in the wilderness, and go after the one which is lost until he finds it? 5 And when he has found it, he lays it on his shoulders, rejoicing. 6 And when he comes home, he calls together his friends and neighbors, saying to them, 7‘Rejoice with me, for I have found my sheep which was lost!’ 7 I say to you that likewise there will be more joy in heaven over one sinner who repents than over ninety-nine just persons who need no repentance.
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SHW
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The official name of our Church is Catholic Church. There are two divisions, the Eastern Rite Catholic Church and the Roman Catholic Church which should properly be called Latin Rite instead of Roman Catholic.
The term “Catholic Church” refers to the Roman Catholic Church: in full communion with the Bishop of Rome, made up of the Latin Rite and the 22 Eastern Catholic Churches.
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MyRdmrLvs
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Ouch! I can only imagine that your friend has probably had this concern for some time but had held back only to have it come out in a rather harsh manor. The closest Ive come to being able to get past the prayers to Mary is the idea that you are only asking Mary to pray for you the way you would ask a friend to pray for you. I think as protestants we are concerned that the role of our mediator and high priesthood of Jesus gets pushed aside by mary or worse that you might believe she has power to answer prayers. Perhaps you could asure her about how you feel about Jesus. In an earlier post Prodical did a great list of the many items of faith that protestants and Catholics share. It made me feel good to read his list. Mary in the Catholic sense is very foreign to us but these other things are dear to our hearts let her know they are dear to yours. God bless.
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Prodigal_Son1
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You are pretty darn close.AMEN ! AMEN! AMEN!
No one can say your soul is in jeopardy, but One and He will judge us all.
**Php 2:12 Wherefore, my dearly beloved, (as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only but much more now in my absence) with fear and trembling work out your salvation.
Php 2:13 For it is God who worketh in you, both to will and to accomplish, according to his good will.
Php 2:14 And do ye all things without murmurings and hesitations:
Php 2:15 That you may be blameless and sincere children of God, without reproof, in the midst of a crooked and perverse generation: among whom you shine as lights in the world.
**
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SHW
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No, but you are a Christian brother. Your soul is not in jeopardy unless you know that the Catholic Church is the true Church of Christ and you choose to refuse to join her in spite of knowing that it is Jesus’ true Church.AMEN ! AMEN! AMEN!
Luke 9:49-50
Now John answered and said, “Master, we saw someone casting out demons in Your name, and we forbade him because he does not follow with us.”
50 But Jesus said to him, “Do not forbid him, for he who is not against us is on our side.”
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SHW
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Jesus personally chose Judas to be a leader in His Church. Judas betrayed Jesus. Does the sinfulness of Judas, a follower of Jesus, make Jesus’ Church a false Church? No. Jesus’ Church is of divine origin; it is not of human origin. Some members of His Church are terrible sinners and they cause scandal by their sins. God is not mocked. They will reap what they sow.
Galatians 6:7-9
Do not be deceived, God is not mocked; for whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. 8 For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life. 9 And let us not grow weary while doing good, for in due season we shall reap if we do not lose heart.
John 17:12
While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled.
John 6:66-70
From that time many of His disciples went back and walked with Him no more. 67 Then Jesus said to the twelve, “Do you also want to go away?”
68 But Simon Peter answered Him, “Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life.
Also we have come to believe and know that You are the Christ, the Son of the living God.”
70 Jesus answered them, “Did I not choose you, the twelve, and one of you is a devil?”
**
This is proof that not all the “called” are actually saved in the end (at the end of one’s life on earth). **
So, all those persons who call themselves Catholic and who are also not in obedience to Church teaching will not inherit eternal life unless they repent before death.
2 Timothy 2:19
Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity.”
Those persons who claim to be Christians (every person who names the name of Christ) and who also have abortions, commit adultery, etc., must depart from (repent of) their sins before death or they will not inherit eternal life after they die.
Matthew 7:20-23
Thus you will know them by their fruits.
21 "Not every one who says to me,
Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’23 And then will I declare to them, `I never knew you; depart from me, you evildoers.’
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SHW
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John 6:56
He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him.
John 6:51-55
51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever; and the bread that I shall give is My flesh, which I shall give for the life of the world.”
52 The Jews therefore quarreled among themselves, saying, “How can this Man give us His flesh to eat?”
53 Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you. 54 Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. 55 For My flesh is food indeed, and My blood is drink indeed.
Those persons who did not believe Jesus literally walked away from Him, never to return.
66 From that time many of His disciples went back and walked with Him no more.
Jesus never called them back and said, “Hey, I only meant that spiritually” or “I only meant that symbolically.”
He meant it literally, because the Paschal lamb (blood sacrifice) must be literally eaten and He is the Paschal Lamb of the New Covenant.
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