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rev_kevin
Guest
Read what I wrote. Did I say anything about the Bible? No
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lil_flower_luv
Guest
I apologize. But FYI, if I asked someone on CAF to apologize to me every time they put words in my mouth, I would never get anywhere. I move on and try to witness to the Faith as best I can. But I truly am sorry. Maybe you understand my point by now?
**What?? ** Tweetymom has a duty to defend and profess the Catholic Faith. And the rest of us, her fellow Catholic brothers and sisters, must remind her of that for the benefit of her own soul.
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Dokimas
Guest
In case everyone missed my question … Did Mary die?
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lil_flower_luv
Guest
Ohhh Yes!!You’re welcome!!! Gosh I love being Catholic. Do you ever just get completely overwhelmed by God’s love?
The Catholic Church is where it’s at!!!I am soo sorry our separated brothers and sisters cannot witness the Real and True presence of Jesus Christ in His Most Blessed Sacrament! :hug1: Thank you for being apart of it!
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rev_kevin
Guest
FYI blasphamy is pretty harsh words to but in someones mouth. I have had plenty of words put in my mouth and never asked for an apology but it was nothing like this.I apologize. But FYI, if I asked someone on CAF to apologize to me every time they put words in my mouth, I would never get anywhere. I move on and try to witness to the Faith as best I can. But I truly am sorry. Maybe you understand my point by now?
**What?? ** Tweetymom has a duty to defend and profess the Catholic Faith. And the rest of us, her fellow Catholic brothers and sisters, must remind her of that for the benefit of her own soul.
But apology accepted.
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rev_kevin
Guest
Good question.
I’m still waiting for a answer to my 4 questions still.
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Teneas
Guest
There is no real documentation to support her death. It is believed she ascended into heaven much like Christ, as she was without sin.
The reason it is believed that this happened is that the Catholic church pretty much knows where all the apostles bodies are, or parts of them, or where they were slain or died. There was never any such place known among the early Christians as a place like that for Mary. Therefore, through tradition, we believe that she was taken into heaven, and never formally “died” on this earth.
There are more reasons for our belief in that, however, I don’t recall them off hand.
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PRmerger
Guest
Yes! Exactly! :extrahappy::dancing:
If it were exactly the same manner, would it then be acceptable to you? That is, if we asked Mary of Nazareth to pray for us* in the same way *we were asking, say, Mary Martinez from Grace Church, to pray for us, would it then be acceptable to you?
I suppose the same question could be asked of this scenario:
I need never talk to my mother to be part of the family. But I do! Every day! I just don’t *have *to.
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lil_flower_luv
Guest
I would have considered a much better answer if I knew it would hurt you so.
It seems on these forums you feel as though if you take too much time with your response, you will lose you chance to make a significant difference. I, myself, have been called countless names and the Church has been attacked and I have been deeply wounded, so do not think you are alone (I am not justifying my rudeness to you and am still sorry.)She died, but was assumed body and soul into Heaven. To better understand her Assumption, go here.
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Teneas
Guest
We do not “need” Mary to talk to God for us, but does not hurt to have his own mother plead on our behalf. Even on earth Christ himself did things for his mother simply because she asked him to. One good example is the turning of water into wine. He told her it was not time to begin his ministry, but she pleaded with him, and he did what she wanted.
God will listen to us, surely. See first answer however.
God will hear us, yes.
Perhaps through his own mother pleading on our behalf, he will see to us faster yes.
All this is based upon the belief we have that “even death can not remove you from Christ”. Of course, this goes with the Communion of the Saints belief that we have as well.
I tried to answer your questions as well as possible, hope it helps.
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Teneas
Guest
Yes, much like that. Sin leads to death from our belief. Therefore much like Elijah, she was taken into heaven and was not subjected to “death”. This is of course, just our belief.
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Dokimas
Guest
Lil and Kev,
Read Psalm 119:165 in the King James Version. If you don’t have the KJV I’ll copy and paste the verse.
Read Psalm 119:165 in the King James Version. If you don’t have the KJV I’ll copy and paste the verse.
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Magdalena09
Guest
There is always biblegateway online as well if you don’t have your bible handy.
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tweetymom
Guest
Great verse can you believe I have it underlined in my Bible?
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PRmerger
Guest
The CC does not say anything about Mary’s death–we are free to believe she died, or we are free to believe, as the Eastern Church teaches, that she simply fell asleep (i.e. the “Dormition of Mary”.)
What the CC says is “when the course of her earthly life was finished, (she) was taken up body and soul into heavenly glory…” *Pope Pius XII Munificentissiumus Deus *(1950)
I think it’s purposely using the circuitious phrase, “when the course of her earthly life was finished” to indicate, “we really don’t know if she died or not.”
Scripture does not tell us that she died.
There are no burial places where Mary’s remains have been venerated.
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Magdalena09
Guest
Just out of curiosity, why is it necessary that it is the KJV?
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Teneas
Guest
I like your answer better than mine
lol More…um…well put together I suppose.
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Dokimas
Guest
Thank you, Lil & PR.
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SHW
Guest
Jesus built His Church upon Peter, the rock. This is why He changed Simon’s name to Peter which means rock so that he could stand in for the Rock. He gave him the responsibility of feeding His flock because Jesus, the Shepherd, was returning to His Father in heaven. So, Jesus appointed a shepherd to stand in for Him on earth to take care of/protect His sheep from spiritual death.
Jn 21:15-18
So when they had eaten breakfast, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon, son of Jonah, do you love Me more than these?”
He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.”
He said to him, “Feed My lambs.”
16 He said to him again a second time, “Simon, son of Jonah, do you love Me?”
He said to Him, “Yes, Lord; You know that I love You.”
He said to him, “Tend My sheep.”
17 He said to him the third time, “Simon, son of Jonah, do you love Me?” Peter was grieved because He said to him the third time, “Do you love Me?”
And he said to Him, “Lord, You know all things; You know that I love You.”
Jesus said to him, “Feed My sheep.
Only Peter was given these specific commands to spiritually nourish Jesus’ lambs (children); take care of/protect Jesus’ flock from spiritual death; and spiritually nourish Jesus’ sheep (adults and children). Only Peter was given the keys of the kingdom of God. Jesus could have restored Peter to justification without ever putting him in charge of His flock. Jesus’ Father personally chose Peter to lead Jesus’ Church.
Mat 16:17-19
Jesus answered and said to him, “Blessed are you, Simon Bar-Jonah, for flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but My Father who is in heaven. 18 And I also say to you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it. 19 And I will** give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven**, and whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven.”
Jesus’ Church is of divine origin so it cannot err in doctrine since it is protected from doing so by the Holy Spirit. Jesus’ Church is also, however, ministered on earth by humans who can sin and do sin. Jesus called and chose Judas to be a leader in His Church. Judas’ betrayal did not cause Jesus’ Church to be tainted because in spite of Judas’ betrayal, Jesus is still in charge of His Church on earth. His Church is of divine origin; not human origin. He chooses the persons whom He desires to lead it; regardless of their personal holiness. Rom 13:1
Evil deeds done by persons within His Church certainly scandalize both the faithful and non-Christians. Each person, whether pope, bishop, priest, or lay member will be judged according to their own personal deeds. Rom 2:5-10
Jesus stated:
Mat 23:1-10
Then Jesus spoke to the multitudes and to His disciples, 2 saying: “The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. 3 Therefore whatever they tell you to observe, that observe and do, but do not do according to their works; for they say, and do not do. 4 For they bind heavy burdens, hard to bear, and lay them on men’s shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers. 5 But all their works they do to be seen by men. They make their phylacteries broad and enlarge the borders of their garments. 6 They love the best places at feasts, the best seats in the synagogues, 7 greetings in the marketplaces, and to be called by men, ‘Rabbi, Rabbi.’ 8 But you, do not be called ‘Rabbi’; for One is your Teacher, the Christ, and you are all brethren. 9 Do not call anyone on earth your father; for One is your Father, He who is in heaven. 10 And do not be called teachers; for One is your Teacher, the Christ.
Jesus states that the scribes and Pharisees have been given the authority from/by God to rule in faith matters on earth. They have succeeded to this authority from Moses by the authority of God. This is why Jesus tells His disciples that they must listen to what they say and do what they say (until the New Covenant begins). However, He is also warning them that in His future Church in His New Covenant, that they better not act like these scribes and Pharisees because the scribes and Pharisees do not practice what they preach. They are hypocrites. Jesus uses exaggeration/hyperbole in order to stress the importance of what He is telling them. He does not literally mean that they cannot call their parents, “father,” or that those who teach cannot be called “teachers.”
James 2:21
Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar?
1 Cor 4:15
For though you might have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet you do not have many fathers; for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.
Abraham is called father. Paul calls himself a father.
Eph 4:11
And He Himself gave some to be apostles, some prophets, some evangelists, and some pastors and teachers, James 3:1
God appoints teachers.
to be continued…
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