Why do people assume that married priests wouldn’t abuse children at the same rate as celibate priests?

[Tis_Bearself]

Yeah, I figured you would show up and comment on this, Roseeurekacross.

I have placed a personal moratorium on discussing this subject with you at all. I don’t wish to get into uncharitable discussions, and unfortunately I know that’s where it would end up going from the last time we discussed this. Additionally, I know you have strong opinions about the situation in Australia, as you live there. I do not live there and I have strong opinions about it also, most of them very negative. I have avoided mentioning them on here for the most part in the interest of peace, as I do not come on here to argue with people. I say my piece, it’s said, I’m done, and I’m not changing my mind.

Again…have a nice day.

Muting the thread now

 

[Mboo]

Jesus said there are three kinds of celibacy. People who are because of their nature, others who are because of the circumstances of life, and others who are because of God’s love.
Therefore, by demanding priestly celibacy, there will be candidates for the priesthood, both those who have natural problems with marriage or with women and who choose the priesthood just as a camouflage, and those who have truly chosen the christian perfection (indeed, the authentic sacred celibacy is of the order of Christian perfection). But those who choose Christian perfection in truth are rare (from the very testimony of many saints,and from Jesus himself). So I find that priestly celibacy makes priesthood, much more a way to camouflage those with psycho-sexual problems.

 

[edward_george1]

Not hardly. The vetting process is extensive. There’s a reason there are psychological evaluations, criminal background checks, and investigation of a candidate via multiple references and letters of recommendation. Plus the scrutiny that occurs in seminary helps to identify this sort of thing. The system isn’t perfect. There are cracks. But if a man were trying to become a celibate priest to cover for his psychosexual issues, it would eventually come out and be dealt with.

-Fr ACEGC

 

[Mboo]

thank you for this information

 

[Roseeurekacross]

If one , as her maj would say, is going to comment on a major 5 year judicial investigation into historical institutional sexual abuse, it’s function, formation, execution , findings and recommendations,

It’s best one researches the topic thoroughly, rather then engaging in broad sweeping generalisations.
Especially from a legal standpoint.

And as is often said, a thing should be judged by its fruits. How many perps are in jail now? As a direct result of being implicate…

 

[FiveLinden]

Having to explain the legal system differences alone would take a large part of my time.

I understand the differences really, really well.

you prefer to adopt the viewpoints of public bodies critical of the Church because you yourself have a lot of issues with the Church.

I think you are being unfair. I always state the basis of my conclusions. I have never ‘adopted’ the view of any organisation. let alone a Royal Commission. They report by giving the evidence, and their conclusions, with all the logical steps in between. You can then draw your own conclusions.

Therefore, we are fundamentally opposed and any further discussion would be unproductive.

Certainly, if you see no purpose in discussion with unbelievers you would be wasting your time talking to me. But the Church has always done this, and seen a point in it.

 

[PureKathleen46]

I really feel that the seminaries are rife with homosexuals. These people prey on young men who could be their victims.

 

[Nigel7]

Yes, if it were single straight men you would have the scandal of priests having affairs with grown women not children or teen-aged boys.

And oh what a relief that would be for us all at this stage.

 

[edward_george1]

You “feel” this, but do you really know? My seminary wasn’t rife with homosexuals. Were there any? Sure. A very small number. Most of whom got dismissed.

-Fr ACEGC

 

[FloridaCatholic]

That’s not what the church has taught. Celibacy has always been considered better than marriage

 

[twf]

This. It’s pretty disturbing. When you read some of these arguments the implication seems to be that if my wife and I have a dry patch, I might be prone to abuse my son… as if a man who can’t “get some action” from a woman suddenly becomes a sexual predator. It’s a scary way of thinking.

 

[Sarcelle]

Yes

Let me ask this question to those who think married priests are safer than single priests.

If a man is single and he is having sexual relations with a woman his age than he is committing sin. If he is single and chaste than he is more likely to abuse a child or teenager. Is this what people really think of us single chaste Catholics? That we’re all a bunch of child molesters?

Is this the reasoning behind the push for married priests?

 

[Sarcelle]

What is the basis of your feelings?

Did you conduct a survey of seminaries and ask the seminarians what is their sexual orientation?

 

[Anicette]

Oh, this conversation came to the family lunch too!

Because many people think the people abuse others because of irrepressible sexual pulsion, or because of frustration. That’s why some believe in make prostitution legal, as a “palliative”.
But on statistics, men who abused are generally live with someone.
But some are not naive and agree reluctantly that marriage will not be a solution for men who abuse young or teenagers boys.

On affairs outside marriage, many think it is a non-issue, as it does not hurt a “victim”. And if a non issue for all people, priests are include too.

 

[Pug]

I do think it goes with the modern beliefs about M. and other sexual behaviors. One gets the impression that the only healthy thing is to do lots of M. and also self exploration with other people when youngish. If we buy into that, we will be suspicious of these folks who are continent (an unmarried priest). So I think from a modern perspective, I can see where someone would come up with the idea that a married priest (not continent) would be “healthy” and thus “safer” to be around kids.

It is possible that all continent married folks are also viewed as walking time bombs, in modern eyes.

 

[pnewton]

Or have affairs with adults on the side at the same rate as celibate priests?

I believe the reason is that most people are married, or see that as the model. It is human nature to look for differences in tragic situation, so you can think it will never happen to you, or anyone you know.

Teachers, for example, aren’t celibate, and they abuse children in the millions, about 1 in 10. So the data supports celibacy as actually being safer.

https://www.investors.com/politics/...amp-down-news-of-children-abused-by-teachers/

 

[Pug]

I’ve wanted to know a figure for this, so thank you!

I can’t put a smiley on that, though. Too sad.

It would be interesting to see about exposure hours. Students are exposed to their teacher for a large hunk of the day for many years. I’d think they have less priest exposure.

 

[bassmansteiny]

I actually have a family member that works in a female prison in Michigan. You would be surprised how many women in there have sex crimes. There was a mother whom was in there for pimping out her little daughter.

As to the OP’s question, marital status has no relation to pedophilia. Married men and even married women have abused under age children. As disgusting as these current crimes are in the Church and they do need to be handled according to the law, it is still, at this point a small minority of the Catholic Clergy. The Priest and Bishops involved need to be investigated, serve their time if found guilty and repent for their sins. However this does not mean that Priest need to be married.

 

[philipl]

I have advocated for older married men to be allowed to become deacons and then priest. There are several benefits for doing just this

 

[FloridaCatholic]

Pope John Paul II , Vita Consecrata, no. 32: “As a way of showing forth the Church’s holiness, it is to be recognized that the consecrated life, which mirrors Christ’s own way of life, has an objective superiority . Precisely for this reason, it is an especially rich manifestation of Gospel values and a more complete expression of the Church’s purpose, which is the sanctification of humanity. The consecrated life proclaims and in a certain way anticipates the future age, when the fullness of the Kingdom of Heaven, already present in its first fruits and in mystery,[62] will be achieved and when the children of the resurrection will take neither wife nor husband, but will be like the angels of God (cf. Mt. 22:30)”

Pope Pius XII, Sacra Virginitas, no. 32: “This doctrine of the excellence of virginity and of celibacy and of their superiority over the married state was, as we have already said, revealed by our Divine Redeemer and by the Apostle of the Gentiles; so too, it was solemnly defined as a dogma of divine faith by the holy council of Trent, and explained in the same way by all the holy Fathers and Doctors of the Church."

Council of Trent, pg. 225: “If anyone saith that the marriage state is to be preferred before the state of virginity, let him be anathema.” […] "writing to the Corinthians, [Paul] says: I would that all men were even as myself; that is, that all embrace the virtue of continence…A life of continence is to be desired by all.”

Catechism of the Catholic Church, p. 916: “The state of the consecrated life is thus one way of experiencing a “more intimate” consecration, rooted in Baptism and dedicated totally to God. In the consecrated life, Christ’s faithful, moved by the Holy Spirit, propose to follow Christ more nearly, to give themselves to God who is loved above all and, pursuing the perfection of charity in the service of the Kingdom, to signify and proclaim in the Church the glory of the world to come.”

Saint Thomas Aquinas, ST II-II.152.4: “Virginity is more excellent than marriage, which can be seen by both faith and reason. Faith sees virginity as imitating the example of Christ and the counsel of St. Paul. Reason sees virginity as rightly ordering goods, preferring a Divine good to human goods, the good of the soul to the good of the body, and the good of the contemaplative life to that of the active life.”

I Corinthians Chp. VII: “It is a good thing for a man not to touch a woman. [v.1] Indeed, I wish that everyone were like I am [celibate]. [v.7] I should like you to be free from anxieties. An unmarried man is anxious about the things of the Lord; how he may please the Lord. But a married man is anxious about the things of the world; how he may please his wife, and he is divided. [v.32] Are you free of a wife? Then do not look for a wife. If you marry, however, you do not sin, nor does an unmarried woman sin if she marries; but such people will experience affliction in their earthly life, and I would like to spare you that.” [v.28] (see also Mark 12:18-27, Mtt 19:10-12, 2 Timothy Ch. 2:3)