Why do people say Unity is good

[TEPO]

What if I were to claim that excessive unbridled unity is actually bad? Because that’s exactly what I believe… I think total unity is worse than pure capitalism and pure socialism combined.

…this is why I can’t stand globalism and the UN, Europa and Eurasia, etc.

 

[Michael_Mayo]

What do you mean by unity?

 

[Frankenfurter]

Diversity is good. Creation of diversity appears to be the creative goal of God’s universe. I take that as an observation of nature that my church says is a part of how we understand God.

That God is a trinity speaks volumes of the lack of unity, but diversity within God himself.

 

[NekoNecro]

It’s very important in Europe because…Well, look what happens when we’re not united in purpose. The wars of religion in the 16th-17th centuries, World wars, Napoleonic wars…

Unity is peace, peace brings prosperity and prosperity brings happiness. It’s better to work with your neighbors than scrapping with them or trying to put them to the sword.

Individuality is exquisite, but there needs to be a common virtue we can all relate to and share. In medieval times that was our Catholicism, but now (since not all of us are Catholic) we tend to use a shared European heritage and set of values to which we can all relate to.

Couldn’t speak so much for anywhere else!

 

[Charlemagne_III]

Diversity is good. Creation of diversity appears to be the creative goal of God’s universe. I take that as an observation of nature that my church says is a part of how we understand God.

That God is a trinity speaks volumes of the lack of unity, but diversity within God himself.

Diversity is good up to a point. But unity is fundamental.

As Aesop’s fable of the Bundle of Sticks point out: “United we stand, divided we fall.”

The Trinity is united in one God. The Trinity are not divided against each other.

CHRIST CALLS FOR UNITY:

“Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word, that they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us; that the world may believe that thou has sent me.” - John 17:20-21

“Other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one flock, one shepherd.” (John 10:16).

 

[nuntym]

+JMJ+

Well, consider this: In Europe, paganism either had empires, tribes, or barbarians. When the Western Roman Empire fell, it fell to the Catholic Church to guide Europe towards civilization again, and this she did by crowning monarchs of nations.

Nations are a Catholic invention.

 

[nuntym]

+JMJ+

The wars of religion in the 16th-17th centuries, World wars, Napoleonic wars…

Uhm, sorry to point this out, but each of your examples are initiated by people who want unity by force.

 

[NekoNecro]

+JMJ+

Uhm, sorry to point this out, but each of your examples are initiated by people who want unity by force.

I suppose we can call attempts at world domination “unity” but there is a key difference

Germany didn’t give Europe or indeed the rest of the world a choice if they wanted to “join” it, rather it sought to either subjugate or wipe everyone else out.

The EU on the otherhand we all joined voluntarily as an institution of mutual benefit for all constituents, not just a single tyrant state

 

[NekoNecro]

+JMJ+

Well, consider this: In Europe, paganism either had empires, tribes, or barbarians. When the Western Roman Empire fell, it fell to the Catholic Church to guide Europe towards civilization again, and this she did by crowning monarchs of nations.

Nations are a Catholic invention.

Also, I have to challenge this. Pontus, Judea, Macedonia, Egypt…These are all nations with crowned monarchs who predate Christianity.

I daresay picking out one tribe leader and singling him out for Papal approval did help in stabilizing a region under one figurehead but Catholicism was not the first to do this, that was probably the Persians or Egyptians.

 

[nuntym]

+JMJ+

The EU on the otherhand we all joined voluntarily as an institution of mutual benefit for all constituents, not just a single tyrant state

On this I agree.

Hmm, I think a good read on this topic would be G.K. Chesterton’s novel The Napoleon of Notting Hill (free to read online). Discover why I agree with the novel’s protagonist’s claim that “There were never any necessary wars but the religious wars. There were never any just wars but the religious wars. There were never any humane wars but the religious wars.”

 

[NekoNecro]

Hrrm, I’m not familiar with this one! Thank you for the link! Gotta stay up tonight so it gives me something to do.

 

[nuntym]

+JMJ+

Also, I have to challenge this. Pontus, Judea, Macedonia, Egypt…These are all nations with crowned monarchs who predate Christianity.

LOL, sorry I did make an exaggeration there. I think I should have made myself more clear that the modern nations we have right now and the modern sense of nationality are Catholic inventions (or rehashing of an old concept, if you will). It was her way of pacifying the different barbarian tribes of Europe without subjecting them under a central political authority. Of course she tried using a central political authority initially by instituting the Holy Roman Empire, but then the Empire just later became a state along with the other states of Europe.

Of course this was not perfect; there were lots (and I mean LOTS) of mini-wars during the Middle Ages.

 

[TEPO]

Diversity is good. Creation of diversity appears to be the creative goal of God’s universe. I take that as an observation of nature that my church says is a part of how we understand God.

That God is a trinity speaks volumes of the lack of unity, but diversity within God himself.

Outstanding response!

I see it the same way as with the first part, but had never even thought about the Trinity in that light. Thanks.

 

[TEPO]

What do you mean by unity?

Well let’s look at unity in its entirety. I say unity is composing a set of common priorities within diversity. Now how far do we let this “unity” go? Should it be given no restrictions allowing it to increase globally in your opinion, or should it be an East / West thing? Maybe continental, or national, or should there be a million unions, with every nation being comprised of 50 to 100?

…because there is a force coming from Washington that seems to be setting its sights for global unity -it’s called the UN. Do we let this force continue untrammeled or do we the people choose to restrict its power? What’s your take?

 

[TEPO]

It’s very important in Europe because…Well, look what happens when we’re not united in purpose. The wars of religion in the 16th-17th centuries, World wars, Napoleonic wars…

Unity is peace, peace brings prosperity and prosperity brings happiness. It’s better to work with your neighbors than scrapping with them or trying to put them to the sword.

Individuality is exquisite, but there needs to be a common virtue we can all relate to and share. In medieval times that was our Catholicism, but now (since not all of us are Catholic) we tend to use a shared European heritage and set of values to which we can all relate to.

Couldn’t speak so much for anywhere else!

How do we explain what we see in Ukraine though? You see, the larger they are the harder they fall. If we’re postponing all those small European wars for a giant East / West war, then is that really solving the problem? Or are we just setting ourselves up for much worse and more catastrophic problem?

 

[TK421]

The UN has historically been supported by the Catholic Church in its mission to help maintain peace and commerce in the world. Far, far further back than this, the Church has consistently been a “pro order” institution. Early Christians prayed for the very emperors who decreed their persecution, torture, and death. When the Roman world fell, Christians showed much sympathy, even in spite of its decadence and inconsistency in obeying the gospel.

The fearful side to this today (and has always been in the past), is that you can use large government bodies to try to maintain peace & prosperity, and ultimately be a channel through which the Church can evangelize (it’s hard to do this when there’s anarchy, isolation, and war), but… what happens when these governments do the complete opposite? What if you’re just setting yourself up for disaster?

I’m not sure that there is an easy way to answer this. You support unity, and then you try as hard as you can to keep that from happening.

 

[TEPO]

Diversity is good up to a point. But unity is fundamental.

As Aesop’s fable of the Bundle of Sticks point out: “United we stand, divided we fall.”

The Trinity is united in one God. The Trinity are not divided against each other.

CHRIST CALLS FOR UNITY:

“Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word, that they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us; that the world may believe that thou has sent me.” - John 17:20-21

“Other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one flock, one shepherd.” (John 10:16).

Yes, God wants us all united in Him, but it’s a stretch to use unity in the other ways of the world, such as in economics, culture, governance, etc. Unity in this other sense needs restrictions, because anything left without boundaries can become corrupt.

…so we shouldn’t just give a free pass to ‘unity’ because the Church preaches it. But rather, we need to keep track of it and possibly turn against it if necessary.

After all, the devil loves unity too. . (And he’s a thief and a mockery)

 

[TEPO]

The UN has historically been supported by the Catholic Church in its mission to help maintain peace and commerce in the world. Far, far further back than this, the Church has consistently been a “pro order” institution. Early Christians prayed for the very emperors who decreed their persecution, torture, and death. When the Roman world fell, Christians showed much sympathy, even in spite of its decadence and inconsistency in obeying the gospel.

The fearful side to this today (and has always been in the past), is that you can use large government bodies to try to maintain peace & prosperity, and ultimately be a channel through which the Church can evangelize (it’s hard to do this when there’s anarchy, isolation, and war), but… what happens when these governments do the complete opposite? What if you’re just setting yourself up for disaster?

I’m not sure that there is an easy way to answer this. You support unity, and then you try as hard as you can to keep that from happening.

Ah, but the devil too loves unity. Adam and Eve too were united in evil with the devil, as the devil is thief and a mockery. Suppose the tables are turned… Will we be willing to turn with them, or will we be too far bonded with the concept of unity?

 

[atassina]

45 Surprising Facts About Extreme Poverty Around the World You May Not Have Realized

Go to the above thread in these forums. None of us alone can help those hundreds of thousands of starving, hungry and diseased people. United together we can at least reduce this world-wide suffering to a trickle.
United we stand. Diverse groups united in one objective is good for world-wide or society wide wide projects.

Communism bad.

 

[TEPO]

45 Surprising Facts About Extreme Poverty Around the World You May Not Have Realized

Go to the above thread in these forums. None of us alone can help those hundreds of thousands of starving, hungry and diseased people. United together we can at least reduce this world-wide suffering to a trickle.
United we stand. Diverse groups united in one objective is good for world-wide or society wide wide projects.

Communism bad.

Dare I say that humanism is the driving force of global unity? How can we deal with the less fortunate without succumbing to the point of no return in regards to an all-powerful common global culture, that may some day decide that God Himself is a ‘problem’?