Why do protestants love to bash our church so much?

[maltmom]

Thank you for pointing out that from each others’ perspective, we see the others just the same.

I’m reminded of the saying, “You know you have created God in your own image, when it turns out God hates all the same people you do.”

Alan

Yesterday I had a discussion with an employee of mine who is now a friend. She was raised in a full gospel church and is the daughter of the pastor. I commented that had she been brought up in another church she would believe what that church teaches. She agreed. I saw the almost hurt look on her face when I told her that I was leaving the Baptist church and joining the Catholic church. Of all of my friends, with the exception of one Catholic friend who surprised me, she was the ONLY friend that came to the Easter Vigil for me. She looked like a deer in headlights when I saw her walk in. Like she said, she may not agree with the teachings of the Church, but she loves me and wanted to support me. My priest is the priest for two churches in our area. The vigil was held at the really small church, not my regular church. I mentioned to her that we were having a fund raiser for repairs to that church. The ceiling looks like it is going to fall. She’s going to donate to the fund because she saw the need when she was there for the Vigil, not because I asked or hinted that she do so. We can agree to disagree in love.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Yesterday I had a discussion with an employee of mine who is now a friend. She was raised in a full gospel church and is the daughter of the pastor. I commented that had she been brought up in another church she would believe what that church teaches. She agreed. I saw the almost hurt look on her face when I told her that I was leaving the Baptist church and joining the Catholic church. Of all of my friends, with the exception of one Catholic friend who surprised me, she was the ONLY friend that came to the Easter Vigil for me. She looked like a deer in headlights when I saw her walk in. Like she said, she may not agree with the teachings of the Church, but she loves me and wanted to support me. My priest is the priest for two churches in our area. The vigil was held at the really small church, not my regular church. I mentioned to her that we were having a fund raiser for repairs to that church. The ceiling looks like it is going to fall. She’s going to donate to the fund because she saw the need when she was there for the Vigil, not because I asked or hinted that she do so. We can agree to disagree in love.

But what did she think about the vigil? You gotta admit, when it comes to ceremony, Catholics Rock!

I usually resist going to the vigil but my wife and kids love to go. They say it is totally beautiful. If your friend shared that beauty even for a minute, then you will have done the best evangelization method there is: giving her some of our beauty, free of charge. Her wanting to donate is not quid pro quo, but out of one-way desire to help. I am very glad you have this person as a friend.

Alan

 

[AbideWithMe]

Thank you for pointing out that from each others’ perspective, we see the others just the same.

I’m reminded of the saying, “You know you have created God in your own image, when it turns out God hates all the same people you do.”

Alan

That’s a good quote to remember.
Good post, Maltmom.

 

[silverdenali]

It’s not all Protestants who bash the Church…

Similarly frustrating to me is when what I call the “ugly Catholic” looks down from on high at our Protestant or Orthodox brothers. We hear things & all of a sudden what Jesus told us to do goes out the window & it’s time to put up our dukes for the Church…

As if a few words before the word Christian means you can guess a man’s heart. Glad He doesn’t operate like that or at least I have a really good feeling He doesn’t.

 

[Jesusismyfriend]

I am Protestant, and i hate that our church refers to the Catholics as false Christians as well. They say the catholic Church is so big into legalism. And people can be saved just by “knowledge of Christ.” I got dissed a lot by members of my own church because I believed works were important. I didn’t only believe that works could get you into heaven. I believe works and faith are needed, and good works are a result of faith. So no works, no faith.
I think it is because so many of them have gotten sucked into the idea that Christ does not expect anything of us. Just live you life however you want. God doesn’t care. He can’t wait to meet you in heaven when you die.
Christ does love. But He had standards He set for Christians to follow. I’m not saying we need to follow the Jewish law to the letter, but we need to obey.
That’s the problem. A lot of them don’t feel obedience is necessary. So they point out everyone who believes in it as false.

 

[maltmom]

But what did she think about the vigil? You gotta admit, when it comes to ceremony, Catholics Rock!

I usually resist going to the vigil but my wife and kids love to go. They say it is totally beautiful. If your friend shared that beauty even for a minute, then you will have done the best evangelization method there is: giving her some of our beauty, free of charge. Her wanting to donate is not quid pro quo, but out of one-way desire to help. I am very glad you have this person as a friend.

Alan

I am very blessed to have her as my friend. She has worked for me for over 8 yrs and I love her very much. I still can’t get her to not put the Dr in front of my name outside of the office. Yes, her donation to the church is from her desire to help. I’d do the same if her church was having a fund raiser.

She admitted that she was surprised and that it wasn’t as “bad” as she thought it would be. I responded, I know there weren’t any demons flying around the ceiling. She nervously laughed at that. She didn’t know what to expect. I tried to prepare her as best I could. She’d only been in a Catholic church once and that was for a wedding. This church is very small. It doesn’t have any stained glass windows and very few statues. She was able to sit with my sponsor’s daughter who was able to explain everything to her which really made her feel comfortable. She had to leave as the Liturgy of the Eucharist began to pick up her son. There were only a few things that she didn’t agree with theologically and she said she was happy she went.

Another employee is studying to become a pastor at her church. I have never agreed that women should be pastors, but as her boss I won’t argue that point with her. She didn’t really know anything about what we believe so she’s been asking a lot of questions. Recently her pastor made a comment that we worship Mary. From our discussions she knew that wasn’t true. I gave her a copy of Fr Larry Richard’s CD on the Mass and copy of the Catechism. She told me that she never wants to stand in the pulpit and tell lies about the teachings of the Catholic Church. I respect that.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

I just got a revelation.

Do not distrust that the Holy Spirit truly is in charge of the way things are going until Jesus comes again.

Things are as they should be. Think like an immortal soul might think, rather than a mortal mind. Then you might imagine that all the things that are going wrong are truly as labor pains for new birth. Or like medicine. It stings to lose a few societal leaders, or a number of troops or civilians. These are all prophesied in three gospels by Jesus, (I hope I remember that right) and are bound to happen.

Brother against brother, etc. It’s all there.

We are simply fulfilling prophesy. To me, we are the lucky ones because as ambassadors for our own points of view, we get to gently and courteously exchange them with each other and it build the rainbow wider and brighter, for all of us. “Blessed are we if we can make peace, for then we shall be call Children of God.”

Alan

 

[Nicea325]

I am Protestant, and i hate that our church refers to the Catholics as false Christians as well. They say the catholic Church is so big into legalism. And people can be saved just by “knowledge of Christ.” I got dissed a lot by members of my own church because I believed works were important. I didn’t only believe that works could get you into heaven. I believe works and faith are needed, and good works are a result of faith. So no works, no faith.
I think it is because so many of them have gotten sucked into the idea that Christ does not expect anything of us. Just live you life however you want. God doesn’t care. He can’t wait to meet you in heaven when you die.
Christ does love. But He had standards He set for Christians to follow. I’m not saying we need to follow the Jewish law to the letter, but we need to obey.
That’s the problem. A lot of them don’t feel obedience is necessary. So they point out everyone who believes in it as false.

I am sorry,but “knowledge” of Christ is not salvation. I can have the “smarts” about Jesus,but yet do nothing he taught us for our salvation.

Exactly! AUTHORITY is an issue for many non-Catholics. They believe Jesus left this loose-knit church where everyone decides what is suitable for him or her.

 

[BenedictFTW]

I have said this more than once, and for those of you who have read this already, my apologies for having to suffer through it again.

I have thought about this, and have come to the conclusion that the Catholic Church is attacked so much precisely because it IS the Church Jesus established, and it DOES contain the fullness of Truth and the full and normative means to salvation given to humanity by God.

If you were Satan, and were waging a war for the souls of humanity, what target would you concentrate on more than the very means of salvation given to the human race by Jesus Himself?

For the devil to achieve his ultimate end goal, he must destroy the Church, because the Church offers humanity the full means to escape the destiny he desires for us all.

Totally agree with this. I would also add that it may help to learn about the history of the Protestant revolution. Many of the false notions they hold today actually come from as far back as 1500s! Just leave the conversation if it gets too argumentative. State your case peacefully, pray to Our Blessed Lord, and move on.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

I am sorry,but “knowledge” of Christ is not salvation. I can have the “smarts” about Jesus,but yet do nothing he taught us for our salvation.

Exactly! AUTHORITY is an issue for many non-Catholics. They believe Jesus left this loose-knit church where everyone decides what is suitable for him or her.

I see your point, but I also see the point that “knowledge” is sometimes used in the Bible to mean something much deeper and more intimate than intellectual understanding.

I’m not a scholar, so FWIW …

Alan

 

[Izdaari]

I belong to a website which I joined before I knew that protestants had anything against catholics and I noticed that the one subject they love to discuss over and over and over in there is how the catholic church (in their opinion) is false. It drives me nuts and I can’t help but think that satan is somehow influencing this. There are usually no catholics present when they do this, but sometimes there are and it becomes a stalemate discussion that just goes round and round in circles. I am just really fed up with what I have seen and need to vent. I’d like to know what others think about this issue too.

God bless.

gabriel

There are a lot of different Protestant views on everything. Some Protestants bash Catholicism, some don’t. In general, the closer you get to fundamentalism, the more they do. Mainline churches (like my new Episcopal one) rarely do. Similarly, there is some Catholic bashing of Protestantism, and you won’t have to look far on this forum to find it.

Personally, I think all three main traditions of Christianity (Protestant, Catholic, Orthodox) have some things right that the others don’t, and all deserve respect as Christian brethren. I don’t reject any doctrine or practice because of which tradition it comes from, but try to evaluate each on its own merit.

 

[Nicea325]

I see your point, but I also see the point that “knowledge” is sometimes used in the Bible to mean something much deeper and more intimate than intellectual understanding.

I’m not a scholar, so FWIW …

Alan

Yes spiritual knowledge to know,love and follow God. Read 1 Cor: 2.

 

[KathleenGee]

And knowledge continues…of God throughout time in the Church.

We do not just hold the understanding of Christ as the earliest Christians knew Him. Even St Paul thought Christ would return in his lifetime.

We will never know all about God…and will always see our understanding of Him, as St. Thomas Aquinas said, like the eye of an owl next to the Sun…noting an owl is awake in the darkness.

 

[JW55]

Much of it is simply repeating what they hear from the pulpit. Many ministers have the same issue. They repeat what they hear and believe it to be truth without bothering to research a Catholic source to confirm their objections.

 

[joshua_b]

And knowledge continues…of God throughout time in the Church.

We do not just hold the understanding of Christ as the earliest Christians knew Him. Even St Paul thought Christ would return in his lifetime.

We will never know all about God…and will always see our understanding of Him, as St. Thomas Aquinas said, like the eye of an owl next to the Sun…noting an owl is awake in the darkness.

This was just as true of the Apostles as it is now. John 16:12-13 tells us that even those who literally walked and spoke with Jesus were not revealed everything, and that Divine Revelation would continue via the Holy Spirit.

 

[batman1973]

I belong to a website which I joined before I knew that protestants had anything against catholics and I noticed that the one subject they love to discuss over and over and over in there is how the catholic church (in their opinion) is false. It drives me nuts and I can’t help but think that satan is somehow influencing this. There are usually no catholics present when they do this, but sometimes there are and it becomes a stalemate discussion that just goes round and round in circles. I am just really fed up with what I have seen and need to vent. I’d like to know what others think about this issue too.

God bless.

gabriel

Kinda goes both ways. I’ve seen quite a few uncharitable comments on Protestantism on this board. Faith is something that is passionate to folks who believe, so there are some sore spots. I admit some Protestant sites are just downright un Christlike.

 

[Richard_Rider]

I belong to a website which I joined before I knew that protestants had anything against catholics and I noticed that the one subject they love to discuss over and over and over in there is how the catholic church (in their opinion) is false. It drives me nuts and I can’t help but think that satan is somehow influencing this. There are usually no catholics present when they do this, but sometimes there are and it becomes a stalemate discussion that just goes round and round in circles. I am just really fed up with what I have seen and need to vent. I’d like to know what others think about this issue too.

God bless.

gabriel

Haters gonna hate.

 

[AlanFromWichita]

Religions makes us all into spiritual cliques.

Jesus came to unify us. “Do not stop them [from doing work in My name even though they are not in our group]. Whoever is not against us, is for us.”

And yet we are against each other. We all need spankings if we are guilty of crowing about group identity and neglecting true love. True love ultimately surrenders not only group identity, but personal identity, by self effacing to the point it simply calls out “Abba, Father.”

Like “they” say, why can’t we all just get along? Jesus didn’t say we have to make our neighbors and enemies think like us, just that we have to love them. And bashing other religions should give halt to EVERY Christian who intends to bring any sort of offering to the altar, because if you have anything against any of your brothers (and I say that includes the mystical Body of Christ including our “lost” sheep) then your gifts are worthless. Go reconcile with your brother and then come back and offer your gifts to the Lord.

Father, please let those who are posters or lurkers in this thread be amply blessed with your loving guidance, and blessed with great peace and joy. Amen.

Alan

 

[JRKH]

Religions makes us all into spiritual cliques.

Jesus came to unify us. “Do not stop them [from doing work in My name even though they are not in our group]. Whoever is not against us, is for us.”

This is a good verse to consider and is one that is often overlooked.
John said to him, “Teacher, we saw a man casting out demons in your name, and we forbade him, because he was not following us.” But Jesus said, "Do not forbid him; for no one who does a mighty work in my name will be able soon after to speak evil of me. For he that is not against us is for us. (Mark 9:38-40)
Let us all consider the implications of this - especially when considered in the light of what Jesus said to Paul at Paul’s conversion…
And he fell to the ground and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why do you persecute me?” And he said, “Who are you, Lord?” And he said, "I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting (Act 9:4-5)
So - When Saul was persecuting Christians, the body, he was persecuting Christ. Those who hate any Christian - hate Christ…

And yet we are against each other. We all need spankings if we are guilty of crowing about group identity and neglecting true love. True love ultimately surrenders not only group identity, but personal identity, by self effacing to the point it simply calls out “Abba, Father.”

Like “they” say, why can’t we all just get along? Jesus didn’t say we have to make our neighbors and enemies think like us, just that we have to love them. And bashing other religions should give halt to EVERY Christian who intends to bring any sort of offering to the altar, because if you have anything against any of your brothers (and I say that includes the mystical Body of Christ including our “lost” sheep) then your gifts are worthless. Go reconcile with your brother and then come back and offer your gifts to the Lord.

Father, please let those who are posters or lurkers in this thread be amply blessed with your loving guidance, and blessed with great peace and joy. Amen.

Amen to this. Love is the key. Love for all - even for our enemies.
However among Christians, among the brethren, Jesus did not simply command Love, He also prayed for unity.
John 17:20-21
20 "I do not pray for these only, but also for those who believe in me through their word, 21** that they may all be one; even as you, Father, are in me, and I in thee, that they also may be in us, so that the world may believe that you have sent me.**
This sentiment is echoed in the NT letters…
Rom 15:5-6
5 May the God of endurance and encouragement grant you to live in such harmony with one another, in accord with Christ Jesus, 6 that together you may with one voice glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

1 Cor 1:10
I appeal to you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree and that there be no dissensions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.

2 Cor 13:11
Finally, brothers, rejoice. Aim for restoration, comfort one another, agree with one another, live in peace; and the God of love and peace will be with you.

Php 1:27
Only let your manner of life be worthy of the gospel of Christ, so that whether I come and see you or am absent, **I may hear of you that you are standing firm in one spirit, with one mind striving side by side for the faith of the gospel,
**
1 Pet 3:8
Finally, all of you, have unity of mind, sympathy, brotherly love, a tender heart, and a humble mind

One of the goals of every true disciple of Christ should be such unity. Not simply agreeing to disagree, but to come together in “one mind”. This desire is what drove those in Antioch to appeal to the Elders in Jerusalem - as it is written in the book of Acts and it is what has driven every Church council from that time to this. The desire to be one and to preserve the truth of the Gospel.

My appeal to all Christians - most especially to those who are children of the reformation - is to seek this kind of unity. There cannot be the kind of unity described in John 17:20-21 where different groups disagree on things like the meaning of the Eucharist or on the necessity of water baptism.

Such unity requires of us, Love, humility and the ability to surrender our own personal views to those of the Holy Spirit given through the Church in council.

Peace
James

 

[AlanFromWichita]

My appeal to all Christians - most especially to those who are children of the reformation - is to seek this kind of unity. There cannot be the kind of unity described in John 17:20-21 where different groups disagree on things like the meaning of the Eucharist or on the necessity of water baptism.

Such unity requires of us, Love, humility and the ability to surrender our own personal views to those of the Holy Spirit given through the Church in council.

Peace
James