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Eileen_T
Guest
Sorry, that’s what I meant. My sister wanted to marry a man who could not comsummate the married and was refused permission.
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mozart-250
Guest
Why is it so important to believe Jesus did not have brothers?
(and I could ask why is it so important to believe that Jesus did have brothers…but nobody is saying I must believe that)
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Eileen_T
Guest
Why not? They were expecting a Messiah who would be born to a virgin. The earliest Christians were Jews and Saul was certainly devout before his conversion, when he was inspired by God.
An angel revealed the news of his son to Zacharias, Mary had an angel sent to her, and so did Joseph. Remember?
Matt. 1:18-25
*…When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child, of the Holy Ghost. Whereupon Joseph her husband, being a just man, and not willing publicly to expose her, was minded to put her away privately. But while he thought on these things, behold the angel of the Lord appeared to him in his sleep, saying: Joseph, son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife, for that which is conceived in her, is of the Holy Ghost. *
I would say he was given a pretty big message in the following verses…
*And she shall bring forth a son: and thou shalt call his name JESUS. For he shall save his people from their sins. **Now all this was done that it might be fulfilled which the Lord spoke by the prophet, saying: Behold a virgin shall be with child, and bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us. **And Joseph rising up from sleep, did as the angel of the Lord had commanded him, and took unto him his wife. And he knew her not till she brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS. *
***“Till she brought forth her firstborn son”… From these words Helvidius and other heretics most impiously inferred that the blessed Virgin Mary had other children besides Christ; but St. Jerome shews, by divers examples, that this expression of the Evangelist was a manner of speaking usual among the Hebrews, to denote by the word until, only what is done, without any regard to the future. *** Footnote - Douay Rheims Bible
***St. Jerome also proves by Scripture examples, that an only begotten son, was also called firstborn, or first begotten: because according to the law, the firstborn males were to be consecrated to God; Sanctify unto me, saith the Lord, every firstborn that openeth the womb among the children of Israel, etc. Ex. 13. 2. *** Ibid
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believers
Guest
Jesus had sisters too.
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Tantum_ergo
Guest
I’m curious as to what our Protestant brothers and sisters (who by the way are not my biological brothers and sisters) think was the relationship of God and Mary.
Can anyone tell me?
Can anyone tell me?
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jimmy85
Guest
St Jerome The Church Father that translated teh scriptures has a wonderfull work aobut the perpetual virginity of Mary. In it he explain with the scriptures why Mary was perpetually virgin.
he wrote this work as an answer to the heretic Helvidious thta claimed that Mary wasent perpetually Virgin.
The Perpetual Virginity of Mary by St Jerome
he wrote this work as an answer to the heretic Helvidious thta claimed that Mary wasent perpetually Virgin.
The Perpetual Virginity of Mary by St Jerome
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Eileen_T
Guest
Don’t forget Acts 1:14-15 where 120 “brothers” are mentioned.
When the theory of Mary losing her virginity after the birth of Christ was first brought up, the early Christians placed it in a catalogue of heresies!
The first Christians said that such an idea was “blasphemy,” “rashness exceeding all bounds,” and “God’s robbery,” “for no one whose mind on Mary is sound would claim that she had any child save Jesus.”
One to claim such was the Gnostic heretic Cerinthus. Do you remember the story of Saint Polycarp, the associate of John the Apostle, wo, when he discovered that he was in the same bathhouse as Cerinthus, he immediately fled, fearing that the building would collapse because the man was such a heretic!
When the theory of Mary losing her virginity after the birth of Christ was first brought up, the early Christians placed it in a catalogue of heresies!
The first Christians said that such an idea was “blasphemy,” “rashness exceeding all bounds,” and “God’s robbery,” “for no one whose mind on Mary is sound would claim that she had any child save Jesus.”
One to claim such was the Gnostic heretic Cerinthus. Do you remember the story of Saint Polycarp, the associate of John the Apostle, wo, when he discovered that he was in the same bathhouse as Cerinthus, he immediately fled, fearing that the building would collapse because the man was such a heretic!
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believers
Guest
I thought we call came from Adam and Eve? Wouldn’t that make us all related?
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StMarkEofE
Guest
There is a tradition which states that St. Joseph had children by his first wife Sarah who died but had some sons (James the less being one) and some daughters. So, when scriptures mention brothers of Christ it really means step brothers.
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Tantum_ergo
Guest
Some people do seem to have trouble giving a simple answer to a simple question.
What is God’s relationship to Mary?
Is it only the relationship He had with Adam and Eve? or with any other human being like you or me?
Did He father a child with Eve? Or Sarah? Rebecca? Did He father a child–only begotten, God of God, light of true, true God of true God–with anyone other than Mary?
Is there any human being who has the same relationship with God that Mary does–Mother of Christ?
What is God’s relationship to Mary?
Is it only the relationship He had with Adam and Eve? or with any other human being like you or me?
Did He father a child with Eve? Or Sarah? Rebecca? Did He father a child–only begotten, God of God, light of true, true God of true God–with anyone other than Mary?
Is there any human being who has the same relationship with God that Mary does–Mother of Christ?
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jimmy85
Guest
sure and that tradition is heretic, read isntead what St Jereome and the entire church has to say about the so call brothers of the Lord.
The Perpetual Virginity of Mary by St Jerome
Jerome explains three propositions:—
1st. That Joseph was only putatively, not really, the husband of Mary.
2d. That the “brethren” of the Lord were his cousins, not his own brethren.
3d. That virginity is better than the married state.
If someone say that the bible states that Jesus had brothers then tehy are not reading the bible well.
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StMarkEofE
Guest
I need to correct my post: It was James the just who was the brother of Jesus. Step and in laws were considered brothers and sisters.
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StMarkEofE
Guest
So, you are stating that St. Joseph was not married prior to his betrothal to St. Mary?
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jimmy85
Guest
I beleive you should read what st Jerome wrote about this, before asking
They were both perpetualy virgins as a holy family. that is why the angel said wake up the woman and her son and bring them to Egypt, the Angel didnt say wake up ur wife.
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gus
Guest
I’m sorry you don’t get itThank you I am well aware of the anti-christ.
I suggest you look around at the people who agree with your position. You are in leauge with those who would love to deny that Jesus is Christ.(that is the anti-Christ). You are well meaning. But I fear in your need to disprove the Church you do their work,
Please meditate on what I have said . You will be in my prayers
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Renton405
Guest
Because if Mary had sex she would transfer the state of original sin to Jesus and thus make Jesus born of original sin…I am with ALLFORHIM on this… beware on making blanket claims against protestant belief systems and in the next breath complain when protestants do the same thing. Please.
Why, in some religions or beliefs, is sex SO dirty and unworthy of God and His perfect Holyness? I just don’t understand this. Sex isn’t dirty, especially when it is between a man and a woman who are married. Do you think of your own mother as dirty because of what she did to bring you into this world? Do you think you (if you have kids) are dirty for what needs to be done to have kids? I do not think of Mary as any less if she had sex and other children. She is, after all, human like the rest of us who needs a savior. Why does this defile her?
As do SOME catholics about protestants…
Read the protoevangelium of James… Jesus had half brothers from Josephs side of the family not Marys…
Remember Jesus said to tha apostle John when he was on the cross “Woman, behold your son, Son behold your mother”…that day St. John took in Mary as if she was his mother… If she had other children jesus would not have stated that.
So all in all, its just protestants interperating scripture incorrectly
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StMarkEofE
Guest
Are you sure that wasnt St.Jerome’s opinion? St. Joseph as any male in Jewish society was expected to take a wife at an early age. Sarah was his first wife by Eastern Tradition and he had many children. This in itself isnt cause for scandal at all, but perfectly normal for that time.I beleive you should read what st Jerome wrote about this, before asking
They were both perpetualy virgins as a holy family. that is why the angel said wake up the woman and her son and bring them to Egypt, the Angel didnt said wake up ur wife.
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jimmy85
Guest
Well within the church fahters there was a tight union when it came to dogmas all of them belived the same ones.
Being a virgin was considered as a consacration to God for those times. I believe Jesus was raised in the purest family. and also virginity is soemthing so important to the christian believes.
I think it is hard for us to believe in that nowadays but I believe it was the way st Jerome said and how the church fahters said ,
As a matter of fact st Jerome and the church fathers know more than us about Jesus and his family.
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flyersfan1088
Guest
Thank you for that. I needed a good laugh tonight.
Your particular brand of heresy was first given a name in print in the year 428 A.D.
St Augustine of Hippo wrote in De haeresibus…
“Heretics called Antidicomarites are those who contradict the perpetual virginity of Mary, and affirm that after Christ was born she was joined as one with her husband.”
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