Why do the Byzatine Catholics make the sign of the cross from right to left?

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I heard that the Roman rite, while saying In Nominee Patri Et Fili Et Spiritu Santus.

When you say the word Spiritu (spirit) your hand is over your heart.

Old Slavonic is like english. When they would say In the Name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. The last word Spirt ( i don’t know Slovonic but the words are like the English) your hand is over your heart.
 
There are many venerable practices in Roman Catholicism regarding finger posture during the Sign of the Cross as well.

I cross myself the way Strat does, i.e. with the Byzantine finger formation, but left to right since I’m Roman Catholic.

That said, the Roman Catholic posture of five open fingers has theological significance as well, though the theological significance of it was perhaps attached to it after the initial move (as with most things in Christendom).

The five open fingers simply remind us of The Five Wounds of Christ. Up, down, and then left to right remind us that Christ descended from Heaven (touch the head) to die for our sins (touch the stomach), descended into Hell (touch the left shoulder) and broke the chains of death, granting eternal life/ascended into Heaven (touch the right shoulder). This left-to-right has a beautiful significance, as we see, that is not possible with the Byzantine right-to-left.

By the way, not all Easterners do right-to-left. Most of the Eastern ritual traditions except the Byzantine do left-to-right, like us Roman Catholics.

Also, the endearing Hispanic practice exists of doing the Sign of the Cross and then afterwards crossing the thumb and index finger in the form of a cross and then venerating the cross by kissing it. I’m sure everyone knows what I’m talking about, but it gives us a chance to venerate the cross each time we make the Sign.
 
Another practice I like is the eastern way of crossing each time the trinity is named. I noticed a lady in our church does that during the rosary prayer - each time the “In the name of the …” is said, she crosses herself and then kisses the crucifix. I thought how that was very “eastern” and I liked it so I have started doing the same thing - during the rosary, and other times the trinity is named.
 
meh_sds said:
…Old Slavonic is like english. When they would say In the Name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit. The last word Spirt ( i don’t know Slovonic but the words are like the English) your hand is over your heart.
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Vo imja Otca, i Syna, i Svataho Ducha. Amin.

Ducha = Spirit.
 
Charlesartiste said:
I was raised Orthodox. Was taught we cross ourselved from left to right because Christ spoke to the theif on his left first. And that theif went to Heaven as promised by Christ.

I am sure there are many reasons. But as so many things occurred “back then” I understand there were political reasons Rome reversed the sign. Who knows? At least we are all signing ourselves with the sign of our salvation.

Pax Vobiscum!
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Sorry folks, think my dyslexia must have struck me. Orthodox and Eastern Catholics cross themselves from Right to left. As I wrote I was taught we crossed from the right to the left because Christ spoke to the thief on His right first and assured him of Heaven. Pax Vobiscum !
 
Why waste your precious time on earth wondering about right to left? The divine knows that no matter what order it came the gesture and love was there. I personally think if the intention behind the action was true then it could be a wave, a clasp, an elbow, a cross; as long as you performed it in the sacred name for sacred reasons the true message would be conveyed. Peace
 
damianmark said:
Why waste your precious time on earth wondering about right to left? The divine knows that no matter what order it came the gesture and love was there. I personally think if the intention behind the action was true then it could be a wave, a clasp, an elbow, a cross; as long as you performed it in the sacred name for sacred reasons the true message would be conveyed. Peace
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We stopped wasting our time worrying about it nearly four years ago. 😉

Peace and God bless!
 
😃 ha ha ha ha may peace and love reign forever within your kingdom!! Brilliant thanks for the laughter x
 
Well Hello guys, I am Traditionalist Catholic. I have to admit the I do the sign of the cross right to left;not left to right. I think it’s the RIGHT way because our Lord Iesous is in the right hand of God the Father;the right hand of the Father is the right side. When I do the sign of the cross; when somebody says “In the Name of the Father” the motion is Forehead to Stomach(because God is the head of the Trinity;which makes him the main leaf and the other two are extras just like the Shamrock) then continues this time saying “And The Son” I touch my right shoulder(because our Lord Iesous is in the right hand and right side of the Father) and then they continue on saying “And of the Holy Spirit” and then my right hand touches my left shoulder. I’ve asked Catholic historians about the Catholic church doing the sign of the cross RIGHT to left, these historians said that the church used to do it right to left and that the right side is an apostolic tradition.
 
I have heard, but don’t know the validity, that it was originally right to left. The priest did it that way in giving a blessing. People tended to copy him. However, since they were facing him, they did it in mirror image; they went first to his right rather than to their right.
 
God the Father is not the “head” of the Holy Trinity. The Three Persons of the Trinity are co-equal. Neither is less than the other or subservient to the other. All three are God, none are considered “extras”.
 
:byzsoc: this is the RIGHT way, I think doing this :signofcross: is apostasy and heresey.
 
Godknowswhy said:
:byzsoc: this is the RIGHT way, I think doing this :signofcross: is apostasy and heresey.
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Normally, I would take this as a joke, but having read your previous post, I don’t think it is. You will find no support in Catholic teaching for your assertion that doing the sign of the cross left-to-right as the Latins do, and as all the Eastern Catholics except for those of the Byzantine tradition do, is apostacy or heresy.
 
RyanBlack said:
Normally, I would take this as a joke
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I believe this could be a simple as a early Left handed or Right handed Bishop doing exactly what came most natural. No different than a fork and knife at the supper table for a left or right handed soul.
 
Alexios said:
There are many venerable practices in Roman Catholicism regarding finger posture during the Sign of the Cross as well.

I cross myself the way Strat does, i.e. with the Byzantine finger formation, but left to right since I’m Roman Catholic.

That said, the Roman Catholic posture of five open fingers has theological significance as well, though the theological significance of it was perhaps attached to it after the initial move (as with most things in Christendom).

The five open fingers simply remind us of The Five Wounds of Christ. Up, down, and then left to right remind us that Christ descended from Heaven (touch the head) to die for our sins (touch the stomach), descended into Hell (touch the left shoulder) and broke the chains of death, granting eternal life/ascended into Heaven (touch the right shoulder). This left-to-right has a beautiful significance, as we see, that is not possible with the Byzantine right-to-left.

By the way, not all Easterners do right-to-left. Most of the Eastern ritual traditions except the Byzantine do left-to-right, like us Roman Catholics.

Also, the endearing Hispanic practice exists of doing the Sign of the Cross and then afterwards crossing the thumb and index finger in the form of a cross and then venerating the cross by kissing it. I’m sure everyone knows what I’m talking about, but it gives us a chance to venerate the cross each time we make the Sign.
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I agree, interesting, while I was taught as a child as Strat and you mentioned. I have seen many Catholics using 3-fingers probably more out of just relaxed habit.
 
There’s a danger to saying there’s no beautiful significance in the right to left crossing. Remember, it was traditionally from right to left, in Rome, too.
 
So, just a question here:

If a person feels more comfortable with the Eastern Rite and naturally crosses themselves from right to left like the Orthodox, but attends a Latin Rite church because there is no Eastern Rite church nearby, does it make a person stand out like a sore thumb? In other words, would the parishoners be staring, “why did that person cross themselves the wrong way??”

I ask because, having studied Orthodoxy, I naturally cross myself the right/left way, and though I did not convert to Orthodoxy, and right now want to take the “final leap” into Catholicism, I’ve caught myself at mass a couple times crossing the Eastern way.

So, do I stick out? And, more precisely, if in a Latin Rite church is it somehow “inappropriate” to use an Eastern rite cross?

Thanks for your assistance. :confused:
 
Well that’s my theory, I know God the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are one and the same God. I just believe that God the Father is the Godhead like in the bible it says “For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and THESE THREE ARE ONE.” —1st John 5:7

“Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and GODHEAD; so that they are without excuse.”—Romans 1:19, 20

Colossians 2:2, 9 acknowledges the Godhead as a “mystery” …

“…to the acknowledgement of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ… For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.”

Colossians 2:9 plainly teaches that the Godhead became incarnate in the fleshly body of the Lord Jesus Christ. 1st Timothy 3:16 declare the same truth…“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh…”

Romans 1:19, 20 states… “Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and GODHEAD; so that they are without excuse.”

The Father is God.
Romans 15:6, “That ye may with one mind and one mouth glorify God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.”

Iesous is God.
“And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: GOD WAS MANIFEST IN THE FLESH, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.” 1st Timothy 3:16

Hebrews 1:8, “But unto the Son he [God] saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.”

Colossians 2:9, “For in him [Jesus] dwelleth ALL the fulness of the Godhead bodily.”

The Holy Spirit is God.
Acts 5:3-4, “But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land? …thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.”

1st Timothy 3:16, “And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: GOD WAS manifest in the flesh, JUSTIFIED IN THE SPIRIT, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.”

God the Father sent His only begotten Son (John 3:16).
John 5:36, “But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me.”

The Son was sent to be the propitiation (to appease the wrath of God) for our sins.
1st John 4:10, “Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.”

The Holy Spirit reproves us, teaches us, guides us and testifies of Iesous.
John 14:26, “But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.”

John 15:26, “But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, even the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me.”

Iesous SAID in John 10:30, “I and my Father are one.”

:byzsoc::byzsoc::byzsoc:
 
Part 2 of my theory that God the Father is Godhead.

Jn.5:37: "And the Father himself, who sent me, has borne witness of me. You have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape. ‘Jesus gives the source of his commission, which is from the Father personally. It is the Fathers voice and form they have not seen, yet Christ has.

Christ who is called the exact image of the invisible Father is the voice that the people heard. He then says that they search the Scriptures in them you think you have eternal life but they testify of me."(v.39) The Son is said to be the eternal life with the Father. Are we to believe the Scriptures testify of only a human being and not God himself? In the end of the discourse Jesus says in vs.46-47 “If you believed Moses you would believe Me; for he wrote about me. But if you don’t believe his writings, how will you believe my words?”

When did Moses write of him? Deut.18:15-19: "The LORD your God will raise up for you a Prophet like me from your midst, from your brethren. Him you shall hear, “according to all you desired of the LORD your God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, ‘Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, nor let me see this great fire anymore, lest I die.’ “And the LORD said to me: 'What they have spoken is good. 'I will raise up for them a Prophet like you from among their brethren, and will put My words in His mouth, and He shall speak to them all that I command Him. 'And it shall be that whoever will not hear My words, which He speaks in My name, I will require it of him.” Jesus claims to be the prophet Moses spoke of that should listen to. Notice that it says they did not want to hear the voice of the Lord anymore or see his glory in Horeb. Then God says he will put his words in a future prophets mouth if they do not listen to his words, God will require it of him.” This very thing Jesus said of himself in Jn.8:24 “Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am (He), you will die in your sins.”

John 6:51:“I am the living bread which came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this bread, he will live forever;”

John 8:23: And He said to them, "You are from beneath; I AM from above. You are of this world; I am not of this world.

John 8:12: Then Jesus spoke to them again, saying, “I AM the light of the world. He who follows Me shall not walk in darkness, but have the light of life.”

John 8:58 Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.”

John 10:9: “I AM the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture.”

John 10:11: "I AM the good shepherd. The good shepherd gives His life for the sheep.

John 10:36: "do you say of Him whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’?

John 11:25: Jesus said to her, "I AM the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live.

John 14:6: Jesus said to him, "I AM the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through Me.

John 15:1: "I AM the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser.

John 19:2: Therefore the chief priests of the Jews said to Pilate, “Do not write, ‘The King of the Jews,’ but, ‘He said, “I am the King of the Jews.”’”

Acts 7:32: Stephen speaking of Moses’ encounter at the burning bush “saying, ‘I am the God of your fathers-- the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’ And Moses trembled and dared not look.”

Acts 9:5: And he said, “Who are You, Lord?” And the Lord said, “I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. It is hard for you to kick against the goads.”

The I Am In the Old Testament was whatever man needed. He became, he was his all in all. Jesus in the New Testament uses all the examples to show who He is. He is everything to man and the only way to God.

The most important of all the statements is in John 8:24 after he tells them I am not of this world.
“Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am [He], you will die in your sins.” ( he is not in the original). He is communicating to them he is the same I AM that Moses met at the burning bush which commissioned him.

:byzsoc::byzsoc::byzsoc:
 
I know all three persons in the Trinity are the same since the Son is the the incarnate begotten son of the Father who is the word made flesh. And that the Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father and The Son and through the Son(Filoque). I just believe that the sign of the Cross is right to left.
 
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