WHY do you [if you do?] think the RCC is not the One true Church founded by Christ?

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Tomdstone said:
Some have objected to the Inquisition and the burning at the stake.
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Okay lets just say that the RCC did indeed agree with the burning of the stakes, and the Inquisition although these are false, and it is too much to go into debate, because we will derail thread.

So lets say we give it to you and agree with you that everything you said was 100% true and grave mistakes were made by the Pope and Bishops.

Okay with that said, What does that have to do with the RCC not being the One True Church started by Christ??

Wouldn"t that be like saying I was not the Mother of My Daughter, because I was not a good Mother. So if I was not a good Mother, I could not be the true Mother of my Daughter right?

Are we not saying the same thing? Because you are saying because the Pope is Human and Bishops are Human and Priests that they cannot be in the One True Church Right?
 
LatinRight said:
God bless Son of Niall,

My faith is in the Lord Jesus Christ, in the Word of God and in the teachings of the RCC.

God bless,

LatinRight
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The WOG as interpreted by whom?
And what did Christians do before there was a Bible? How did they read it when most of the world was illiterate?
 
Son_of_Niall said:
The WOG as interpreted by whom?
And what did Christians do before there was a Bible? How did they read it when most of the world was illiterate?
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Christians never interpreted the word of God, It was taught to them by word of Mouth by the Apostles and Bishops and Priests. In the Catholic Church.

There was never Christians before Christ and they were taught by the Catholic Church. They never needed the bible, and as long as there is a RCC you really do not need the bible.

It was here long before the Bible.
 
rinnie said:
Christians never interpreted the word of God, It was taught to them by word of Mouth by the Apostles and Bishops and Priests. In the Catholic Church.

There was never Christians before Christ and they were taught by the Catholic Church. They never needed the bible, and as long as there is a RCC you really do not need the bible.

It was here long before the Bible.
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The churches that exist today and are not in communion with Rome, by in large base their doctrine on the Bible. If as you say "they never needed the Bible " it seems apparent that the Catholic Church made a huge mistake in developing one.
 
Wannano said:
The churches that exist today and are not in communion with Rome, by in large base their doctrine on the Bible. If as you say "they never needed the Bible " it seems apparent that the Catholic Church made a huge mistake in developing one.
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I think a important point is that we can have a Church w/o the bible, but can’t have the bible w/o the Church. We know that because history has shown us that.

Important to point that out because of the current marginalization of the Church by so many in this age.
 
Lenten_ashes said:
I think a important point is that we can have a Church w/o the bible, but can’t have the bible w/o the Church. We know that because history has shown us that.

Important to point that out because of the current marginalization of the Church by so many in this age.
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And history has also shown that we do need the Bible!
 
rinnie said:
Christians never interpreted the word of God, It was taught to them by word of Mouth by the Apostles and Bishops and Priests. In the Catholic Church.

There was never Christians before Christ and they were taught by the Catholic Church. They never needed the bible, and as long as there is a RCC you really do not need the bible.

It was here long before the Bible.
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I know this, I wanted LR to give me his or her answer.
 
Lenten_ashes said:
We need the Word of God.

Didn’t even have a complete bible till 405 AD.

But people still received the Word of God.
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Yes, look at the large number added at Pentecost…and that was before Sacred Tradition as well.
 
Wannano said:
And history has also shown that we do need the Bible!
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then why did God leave us the CC instead of the bible. How does the bible give you the bread and body of Christ? How does the bible give you forgiveness for your sins? How does the bible baptise you in the name of God. Etc. If we NEED the bible how did all those people in the OT survive.

While I agree the bible is the greatest book ever written, I disagree that we need it. What we need is the Church the living Church here on earth.
 
Peter_J said:
This is a bit of a spur-of-the-moment post, but it seems appropriate to this thread regardless …

I was just watching The World Over Live on EWTN, and one of the guests said that dubia that some Cardinals recently sent Pope Francis concerning Amoris Laetitia was to ask him whether certain church doctrines had changed. I forget which guest it was that said that, but I’m inclined to think that he was wrong in saying that that is what the *dubia *was asking. Church doctrine does not change.
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Possibly it would be best to start a thread about this in Church News, but for the moment I thought I would “bump” it here.
 
rinnie said:
then why did God leave us the CC instead of the bible. How does the bible give you the bread and body of Christ? How does the bible give you forgiveness for your sins? How does the bible baptise you in the name of God. Etc. If we NEED the bible how did all those people in the OT survive.

While I agree the bible is the greatest book ever written, I disagree that we need it. What we need is the Church the living Church here on earth.
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I believe the way some protestants worship the bible it borders on idolatry
 
God’s blessings,

I believe I need to answer some questions.

Do we Catholics need the Bible and how can we know the interpretation of the Bible?

I need the help of the **teachings of the RCC **to answer the above questions.

Quote: CATHOLIC SENSIBILITY, DEI VERBUM 21

The Church has always VENERATED the divine Scriptures JUST AS she VENERATED the body of the Lord, since, especially in the sacred liturgy, she unceasingly receives and offers to the faithful THE BREAD OF LIFE from the table of BOTH of GOD’S WORD and of CHRIST’S BODY.

For in the sacred books, the Father who is in heaven meets His children with great love and speaks with them; and THE FORCE AND POWER IN THE WORD OF GOD IS SO GREAT THAT IT IS STANDS AS THE SUPPORT AND ENERGY OF THE CHURCH, THE STRINGS OF FAITH for Her (children), THE FOOD OF THE SOUL, THE PURE AND EVERLASTING SOURCE OF SPIRITUAL LIFE.

“For the WORD OF GOD IS LIVING AND ACTIVE” (Hebr.4:12) and it **HAS THE POWER TO BUILD YOU UP and give you your heritage among all those who are sanctified. (Acts 20:32) ** End quote.

THE SCRIPTURES are referred to as the “BREAD OF LIFE”** in direct association with a reference to the Eucharist.**
Please see also: John 1:1; Matt.4:4; Luke 4:4.

We have access and **we are able to eat the “BREAD OF LIFE” in TWO ways: **
The Church offers the faithful the bread of life FROM THE EUCHARISTIC table of BOTH of GOD’S WORD and CHRIST’S BODY.

When in faith, we are READING or HEARING the Word of God we consuming the BREAD OF LIFE, in which He (Jesus), Himself is consumed and we unite ourselves to Christ.

The Catholic Understanding of the Bible by Fr. John Harden SJ.

Quote: “The Scriptures are holy because their main author is the all-holy God. But they are also holy because they are able to sanctify those who READ the Bible as NO OTHER LITERATURE in the world is capable of doing.

**St. Thomas does not hesitate to speak of the Scriptures as a KIND OF SACRAMENT.

SIMULAR to what happens when we receive BAPTISM or the EUCHARIST.**

The same Holy Spirit who first inspired the Bible CONTINUES TO ENLIGHTEN those who now READ the Bible.” End quote. Emphasize mine.

WE CANNOT OVER EMPHASIS!

When in faith, READING or HEARING the Word of God we are consuming the BREAD OF LIFE, in which He (Jesus), Himself is consumed and we unite ourselves to Christ.

[CCC 108]; Still, the Christian faith is not a “religion of the book.”
Christianity is a religion of the “Word” of God, “not a written and mute word, but incarnate and living.”
If the Scriptures are not remain a dead letter, **Christ, the eternal Word of the living God, must, through the Holy Spirit, “open [our] minds to understand the Scriptures.” **End quote.

The Lamb’s Supper by Scott Hahn Page 48

Quote: One of the great Scripture scholars of the early church, Origen (third century), urged Christians TO RESPECT CHRIST’S PRESENTS IN THE GOSPEL as they RESPECT HIS PRESENCE IN THE HOST.

“You who are accustomed to take part in the divine mysteries know, when you receive the body of the Lord, how you protect it with all caution and veneration lest any small part fall from it, lest anything of the consecrated gift be lost.

For you believe, and correctly, that you are answerable if anything falls from there by neglect.

But if you are so careful to preserve His body, and rightly so, HOW DO YOU THINK THAT THERE IS LESS GUILT TO HAVE NEGLECTED GOD’S WORD THAT TO HAVE NEGLECTED HIS BODY?” End quote.

God bless,

LatinRight
 
Michael68 said:
I believe the way some protestants worship the bible it borders on idolatry
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that is a good point, Its like instead of the way the word of Christ teaches he and his Church are one, they seem to believe its him and the bible.
 
steve_b said:
Scripturally, The Spirit is externally sent into the world by the Son as well as the Father (John 15:26, Acts 2:33), and HE internally proceeds from both Father and Son in the Trinity. **This is why the Spirit is referred to as the Spirit of the Son (Gal. 4:6) and not just the Spirit of the Father (Matt. 10:20). **

In John 15:26 Christ makes clear that the Spirit proceeds eternally originally (that is the sense of the Greek word Christ uses) from the Father, full stop. Those terms are never used of the Holy Spirit proceeding from the Son. The Spirit DOES NOT proceed eternally from both the Father and the Son “equally” (as Lateran IV asserts). Sure, “through the Son” can be understood in an orthodox way, but once the western church said “equally” that foreclosed any understanding of “through the Son”. “Equally” even violates what Bl. Augustine said, which was the the Father remained the original source of the Spirit.

T
after further study, that the problem is more in the area of semantics and different emphases than in any basic doctrinal differences"
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(Diakonia, quoted from Elias Zoghby’s A Voice from the Byzantine East, 43).

Catch that? After further study, Bp Ware thinks this is a semantical issue not a doctrinal issue.

You grossly misstated what F. Ware said. He said “MORE” in the area of semantics…" Not “this is a semantical issue.”
 
Michael68 said:
I believe the way some protestants worship the bible it borders on idolatry
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Most would probably disagree with us that Christianity is not a religion of the book, it’s a religion of the man Jesus Christ.

I know somebody that sleeps with his bible…under his pillow or even holds it at times while sleeping. I love the Word too, but at the end of the day it’s just paper and ink. What’s important is the internalizing of that Word.
 
Michael68 said:
I believe the way some protestants worship the bible it borders on idolatry
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Glad you said ‘some’.
The only Protestants I have ever seen who come close to that are fundamentalists and evangelicals.
 
Lenten_ashes said:
Most would probably disagree with us that Christianity is not a religion of the book, it’s a religion of the man Jesus Christ.

I know somebody that sleeps with his bible…under his pillow or even holds it at times while sleeping. I love the Word too, but at the end of the day it’s just paper and ink. What’s important is the internalizing of that Word.
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I find this very hard to believe.
 
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