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Darkbloom
Guest
Is advocating someone given up the land of their birth and citizenship not a “big fuss” in your estimation?
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royal_archer
Guest
The thing is that you will be forced to pay for them more than ever. The Obama care legislation exempts the non working from contributing to the maintenance of their own healthcare.
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royal_archer
Guest
Through subsidization?
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OLS
Guest
The Health Care Bill is simply un-American. This nation was founded on Christian values that recognize our God given free will. The U. S. Government has been increasingly taking away our freedom. We are NOT the rest of the Western World. We are Americans. If anyone wants socialized medicine, let them go to another country. The Health Care Bill is not helping the poor, it is only adding more problems. It deceptively is taking more freedom from the U.S. citizen. It’s time Americans wake up! Go back and study your history and U.S. Government. Common Sense has gone out the window. We are becoming an oppressed people and that’s immoral. The government appears to be providing health care for its citizens; however it will deteremine what will be done and by whom. U. S. citizens are becoming increasingly dependent on the government’s decisions on how we live our lives. Another point- Water restrictions. If I know that the water to the house is going to be turned off for a while, do I fill containers and then run out and water the lawn when the water is off? NO! I use the saved water for drinking purposes. Where is common sense? The government pretends we can not think for ourselves, takes control, of the situation, suddenly we think we need their control because we are dependent on them to think for us. Let us PRAY for our nation! Let us become more active citizens. Let us take back control and continue to be a nation that will “secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity”.
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aspawloski4th
Guest
Go back to the days of 14 hour work days 6 days a week, 1/2 of your children dying right after birth, having to be rich to get an education byond 8th grade, being relegated to hard labor jobs if you didn’t have an Anglosaxon name, debtors prisons, women as 2nd class citizens, snake oil salesmen that one wouldn’t have recourse against if their product killed a family memeber. Guess what! I’ll take today over that anyday.
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grndslm
Guest
That’s NOT force. For Pete’s sake, man. That’s the UCC!! Uniform Commercial Code.
THAT is common sense. If someone says, you have 30 days to respond if you’re not guilty, it’s only common sense that you’d reply.
If I say, “You have 30 days to respond to this notice, or else I will accept your non-response as a valid affirmation of calling me a bad name, and then I will be legally able to poke you in the eyes.”
…
…
Nobody’s forcing you to get poked in the eye. Your deliberate inaction is a choice that you made, because you felt the need to be dishonorable, hide from your fears, live alone in hell, etc. was just a real great choice… a real honorable decision. That’s your own fault.
Who said anything about giving up the land of your birth??!??
I said give up U.S. Citizenship. You can remain a National or State National without having to be “statutory citizen”. Nobody’s forcing you to remain a U.S. Citizen, which is technically an employee of the U.S. Government.
Citizens owe their allegiance to the corporation.
Nationals owe their allegiance to the people of the land.
There’s a difference. I want no part of the beast known as THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, but the “united States of America” is really awesome.
sedm.org/Forms/MemLaw/WhyANational.pdf
Read this and then you’ll start to understand that you actually aren’t a U.S. Citizen, and you really shouldn’t want to be.
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TenBobNote
Guest
Why do you assume there is inaction? Say they give me a notice that states I have 30 days to pay $1,100 or buy a health insurance policy deemed acceptable by the federal government, as I have refused to buy health insurance. I reply stating that I refuse to purchase any health care plan because I am able to take care of my own person, I also refuse to take part in this unauthorized declaration of this federal government’s power grab stripping any meaning that may be left in the 10th amendment. The federal government will look at the letter they have received from me, give me a set amount of time to pay the fee, then if no acceptable action has taken place I will be thrown in jail.
How is that not force?? They are forcing me to disregard any rightful principles I may have about my personal sovereignty or about The Constitution. If I do not disregard any principles I may have they will force me into jail.
It is still intrusive if you wanted to stay within the current popularized system and you should not be forced to do this to get away from some health insurance mandate.
What if you wanted to change the system from the inside out? You would certainly want to stay in it if that were the case, If you do believe in the original intent of The Constitution.
You may be interested in this discussion, dailypaul.com/node/132609
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Lypher
Guest
If we vote on forced service that requires the Amish to go to war or lose their land is it just? We can do it, we are the majority is it right to do it?
In 1932 the Citizens of Germany decided to try an experiment. They turned their Republic into a National Socialist Dictatorship. That Party eventually Nationalized Heavy industry, Banking, Healthcare and created mandatory service requirements for the greater Social good. National Socialism has been tried before and in fact is currently being tried in Venezuela, and Ecuador will move in that direction along with Bolivia. I believe it is going to be tried here. We do not have all the trappings of hate and restrictions, but if you start seeing travel restrictions or requirements for graduates of higher education to PAY back the government as if they were serfs for education under some National Services law, or mandatory fee’s and services with penalties then oppression is on its way. It will be called something else, like in Germany it was called compliance. I am not sure what it will be called here.
I will pray for our Country because the Greatest threat to her is from within.
God Bless You.
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grndslm
Guest
I know that there is inaction on your part, because that’s how the IRS functions. THEY HAVE NO CONTRACT WITH YOU, WHATSOEVER. I keep repeating some of these concepts over and over again, like the Uniform Commercial Code, and I don’t think you guys are really catching on. They are using that, the UCC, against you, by getting you to admit to things that you didn’t even know you were admitting. They are “manufacturing consent” (props to Noam Chomsky) by sending you a Notice (i.e. - a “bill of exchange”, or a “negotiable instrument”). That Notice will say, “You have 30 days to respond to this, or else a bunch of legal jargon will be acted upon you after you go into a state of dishonor, and that state of dishonor additionally means that you admit you are a resident of the District of Columbia, and will be paying our corporation the 40% taxes that we are claiming you owe us.”
OK… what are your options really. Every time that I mention your options, I always put “Reply to their Notice with a Notice of your own”. You somehow read over that option. And, even reading my examples of, “If you don’t reply within 30 days, or else I’ll poke your eyes out”… you still thought that not entering a line of communication with me was the best option you had. Somehow you thought that paying money or getting health care were your only options.
This is how they manufacture consent on your behalf. They disguise your options, because you can do what you want, so long as you follow the rules that they follow – the UCC. You reply to their own Notice with your own Notice… which basically asks 100 questions that no one in the corporation (i.e. - the state) will be able to answer, and then you end your Notice with… “and if you do not reply to this Notice within 30 days, answering every one of my 100+ questions, then your lack of response will mean that you have no evidence of any debt that I, a free and sovereign man, could possibly owe you, a corporation, which I have never knowingly contracted with.” You just word it the way that you see fit, the way that you understand it.
In fact, it’s called a “Notice of Understanding and Intent”, and then you end it with your “Claim of Right”. The titles are just what they sound like. All of this is just communication. If you know how to communicate, ask REALLY good questions in order to understand concepts, and know how to read the Constitution… then all you have to do is claim your right at the end of your Notice. Get it notarized or signed by 3 witnesses, then send it off. If they don’t reply within 30 days, they enter into a state of dishonor first, and you’ve won. You take your papers to court if they ever hassle you again, and that information must be entered into court as fact that you never went into a state of dishonor, and on top of it, you claimed your rights as a free man… not an agent of THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA (aka: a U.S. CITIZEN).
It’s not force, because you chose to go into the state of dishonor all on your own. They gave you a way out, and you totally looked past it.
What you don’t understand is that, according to the UCC, you have no rights if you do not claim them first thing in the negotiations of a contract. So, if you walk into a commercial court (basically, any court room today)… and you don’t say, “Hi, First thing’s first… I reserve all my rights”… THEN YOU DON’T GET ANY RIGHTS!! If you don’t claim your rights, then you don’t get them. It’s really that simple.
They will not force you into jail, as long as you ask the right questions.
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grndslm
Guest
Compare to a nagging wife that asks you to take out the trash during the SuperBowl.
It’s obviously dishonorable to ignore your wife.
It’s just as dishonorable to say, “No!”
So, what’s your options to remain honorable and not say, “Yes.”??
A) ask a question – “Can it wait until the commercial, honey?”
B) make a conditional offer – “Yes, I will do it, if you let me wait until the commercial.”
Same principle with ANY Notice that you receive from speeding (speeding tickets are notices), from a debt collection agency, from the IRS, or whoever… there are always questions and conditional offers you have as your tools.
If a cop tells you, “Step out of the vehicle, please.” I know what I’d say…
“That won’t be a problem officer, just so long as you can provide me with some evidence that I have committed a crime.”
No evidence? Then, no, he can’t search jack of mine. I will no claim my common law right to privacy in front of the officer, and then exercise it thru whatever means I feel most optimal at the time. But you can’t exercise your rights if you do not claim them.
If you are a U.S. National, you’re still on the same soil that the Citizens will be on. How will you not be able to change the system from within?
What seems worse to me, is that people realize they’re in a cage with a bunch of rabid circus animals… and they want to stay inside. I want to get outside that cage, but stay on the same soil.
BECAUSE THEY CLAIM THEIR FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHT TO RELIGION!!!
Amish people don’t have to have permits for guns, apply for drivers licenses, get a state-issued ID to get on an airplane, pay income taxes, or do anything else that their religion is against. The First Amendment is a biggie, and people don’t realize that that’s their ticket out of most anything. The Bill of Rights is a list of things that the Government cannot do. So, how are they removing all these rights? Well, they get your consent!!!
Amish people don’t consent to corporations. They have a better understanding of “divine right” than followers of Christ. Pretty humorous if you ask me.
I’m the only one that realizes this, apparently… and that’s exactly the problem that permits such authoritarian rulers to persist.
You guys need to watch Michael Badnarik’s Constitution Class if you really want somebody to teach you How To Not Comply.
Please watch that video, and then watch the entire Constitution Class if you want to learn a good deal of history, and, specifically, the difference between rights & privileges.
Rights are something that sovereign men have.
Privileges are something that Citizens (representatives of a corporation) must beg for.
It’s obviously dishonorable to ignore your wife.
It’s just as dishonorable to say, “No!”
So, what’s your options to remain honorable and not say, “Yes.”??
A) ask a question – “Can it wait until the commercial, honey?”
B) make a conditional offer – “Yes, I will do it, if you let me wait until the commercial.”
Same principle with ANY Notice that you receive from speeding (speeding tickets are notices), from a debt collection agency, from the IRS, or whoever… there are always questions and conditional offers you have as your tools.
If a cop tells you, “Step out of the vehicle, please.” I know what I’d say…
“That won’t be a problem officer, just so long as you can provide me with some evidence that I have committed a crime.”
No evidence? Then, no, he can’t search jack of mine. I will no claim my common law right to privacy in front of the officer, and then exercise it thru whatever means I feel most optimal at the time. But you can’t exercise your rights if you do not claim them.
You don’t have to relinquish Citizenship, but I’m certainly going to. You can simply reply to the Notices every 60 days (30 for you, 30 for them)… and you really won’t even realize how little time you spent on the issue. You can convince others that mandates to buy from private corporations is fascism, and that others should fight it, like you.
You can still change the system from the inside out. You can still vote as an elector. There is information on that in the PDF above.
If you are a U.S. National, you’re still on the same soil that the Citizens will be on. How will you not be able to change the system from within?
What seems worse to me, is that people realize they’re in a cage with a bunch of rabid circus animals… and they want to stay inside. I want to get outside that cage, but stay on the same soil.
More and more people are waking up. Some day “We the People” will prevail over “Me the Corporation”.
See… you can’t require the Amish to go to war or lose their land. Do you want to know why??
BECAUSE THEY CLAIM THEIR FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHT TO RELIGION!!!
Amish people don’t have to have permits for guns, apply for drivers licenses, get a state-issued ID to get on an airplane, pay income taxes, or do anything else that their religion is against. The First Amendment is a biggie, and people don’t realize that that’s their ticket out of most anything. The Bill of Rights is a list of things that the Government cannot do. So, how are they removing all these rights? Well, they get your consent!!!
Amish people don’t consent to corporations. They have a better understanding of “divine right” than followers of Christ. Pretty humorous if you ask me.
Over my dead body will I comply. I have a choice.
I’m the only one that realizes this, apparently… and that’s exactly the problem that permits such authoritarian rulers to persist.
You guys need to watch Michael Badnarik’s Constitution Class if you really want somebody to teach you How To Not Comply.
Please watch that video, and then watch the entire Constitution Class if you want to learn a good deal of history, and, specifically, the difference between rights & privileges.
Rights are something that sovereign men have.
Privileges are something that Citizens (representatives of a corporation) must beg for.
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Lypher
Guest
You may be right, but all of your comments presuppose that “they” are following the law. I would assume that any “Court” that would allow one “free” man, or corporation, to enslave another lacks the moral or ethical standards to follow such nuances within a given set of laws of men. Chances are that court would ignore those rights since the auditors of their actions, ignorant free men such as myself, would not know enough to keep them honest.
All the above only applies if your supposition is true. To me it sounds like the same type of logic that one NO TAX paying group always tries to push, but end up losing all their property?
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grndslm
Guest
The court will ignore those rights if you (a) don’t claim them, and/or (b) claim to be a U.S. Citizen, bound by statutory law. (a) is pretty easy, but some people will still forget to simply say, “I reserve all my rights” the first thing in a court room. (b) is the tricky one, because, as I have explained… there are dozens of ways that the government “manufactures consent” on your part. When you go get a driver’s license, issued by the state… a requirement is being a U.S. Citizen first. When you ask the state for permission to carry a concealed weapon, you are, on your own free will, turning your second amendment RIGHT into a PRIVILEGE. That’s your own doing.
It gets even more technical than that. If you don’t refute that your name is not JASON RYAN CASWELL, they will assume that your all-caps name is the legal person, which is a statutory “person”, bound by statutory law. You must claim that you are a sovereign man with unalienable rights endowed by your Creator, and Him alone… and your given name is Jason Ryan, while your family name is Caswell; you don’t have a first, middle, & last name, which is only for legal persons. On top of that, prefixes like Mister, Miss, Mrs., etcetera… also allude to your legal person status. Using a federal zip code, say 70112, shows that you are a U.S. Citizen, under the jurisdiction of the federal government… and not protected by the jurisdiction of the states.
There’s several tricks that the government plays, but they’re really not that difficult. You just have to understand that… on land, you can hold up the Supreme Law of the Land at any time, and remind the government official you’re dealing with that they took an oath [written in the Constitution] to uphold the Constitution. If you remind them of this oath, and then you hint to knowing how to take action [by claiming “treason”, “perjury”, “gross negligence, which is equal to fraud”, etc.] against either the corporation or the agent of that corporation… your chances of making it out with all your skin is pretty good.
The whole point is that the more people realize what power lies within the Constitution, within themselves, etc… people will stand up to fight the beast, which is the federal government acting outside its jurisdiction, thru fraudulent deception. People need to take the government to court for everything, plead Not Guilty all the time, ask the court to define which “United States” they are referring to, ask them to define all types of legalese terms that are designed to confuse… heck, take 5 minutes between each question about a definition. That’s the whole point. Ask even more questions based on authority, about
“compelled association”, about unalienable rights, about where rights come from, about who or what those rights are protecting, etc. Eventually, they will have to surrender if people are actually educated as to the rights that they already hold, but must only claim.
The logic is sound, just as Truth is irrefutable. You can’t possibly defeat Truth.
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Ed_CA
Guest
Anybody who drives an automobile or truck is forced by Big Brother to wear a seat belt. Likewise, Big Brother forces drivers to have automobile insurance and a current registration. . If one lives near a river, Big Brother forces people to have flood insurance.
For those who totally object to Big Brother forcing one to have health insurance, then such persons should sign a consent form that they refuse medical care, even emergency care. Is it not better to either die or be maimed and not submit?
For those who totally object to Big Brother forcing one to have health insurance, then such persons should sign a consent form that they refuse medical care, even emergency care. Is it not better to either die or be maimed and not submit?
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janw
Guest
Anyone without insurance gets sick, they get emergency medicaid if its serious. Taxpayer pays the bill. This to me is a good reason to force someone to buy insurance.
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royal_archer
Guest
And the truth is that there are a lot of people in jail or the grave yard because they thought their rights trumped the power of the government.
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royal_archer
Guest
The problem is not with forcing those people who would other wise be a burden on society to buy insurance. The problem is that those people are not going to be forced to buy insurance, they will still get their medical costs paid for by the rest of us. This legislation does nothing to correct that problem.
What this bill does do is it forces companies to shift more costs for extreme measures onto other customers and prevents people from buying more affordable coverage.
The legislation also prevents people from not buying a policy with coverage of procedures that are not cost justified, not necesary or not moral. You have to get every thing the government pencil pusher wants you to pay for regardless of if you want it or not.
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Plain_John
Guest
I would much rather being forced to buy healthcare for my neighbors than being forced to buy weapons of mass destruction as I do now.
I have been buying universal healthcare for the military. What about the rest of us.
I have been buying universal healthcare for the military. What about the rest of us.
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Ella
Guest
Me too!
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Ed_CA
Guest
The argument should be what is the distinction between rights and privileges. If private property ownership is a right, then the Lincoln was wrong in the Emancipation Proclamation because slaves were private property. Women did not have the voting privileges, they were granted this privilege by men. One cannot just claim a privilege to be a right; they only right one has is that of free choice.
The defenders of the US Constitution realize health care is just a privilege, not a right. Hence, it is unconstitutional for Big Brother to force persons whether it be health insurance, flood insurance, fire and home insurance, automobile insurance, or life insurance. If one freely chooses not to buy any type insurance, and through bad luck, has a calamity, then one can go happily to the grave knowing that he or she did not submit to Big Brother.
Thank God for Fox News!!
The defenders of the US Constitution realize health care is just a privilege, not a right. Hence, it is unconstitutional for Big Brother to force persons whether it be health insurance, flood insurance, fire and home insurance, automobile insurance, or life insurance. If one freely chooses not to buy any type insurance, and through bad luck, has a calamity, then one can go happily to the grave knowing that he or she did not submit to Big Brother.
Thank God for Fox News!!
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