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"Why Does God Allow Same-Sex Attraction?" What a Priest Said When He Was Asked This Question
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Tis_Bearself
Patron
I’m always kind of shaking my head at threads where straight people give all kinds of opinions on why other people are gay.
As a largely straight person myself, I’ll skip giving my opinion.
As a largely straight person myself, I’ll skip giving my opinion.
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Regular_Atheist
Guest
Is this definitely happening? I could believe it, but I’d be a little sceptical of the data in terms of how useful it can be for analysing broad historical trends. The data on testosterone in the population can’t go that far back. We definitely eat a lot more meat now (and processed meat at that), and we do consume a lot of plastic. I’m not sure that would lead to sexual aberrations though. I’m not convinced that testosterone makes you attracted to women, either. If it were the case then you would assume there to be something common between the diets of lesbians and straight men.
At any rate I’m not Catholic but I do think more people are probably identifying as not being straight now. I think it’s largely driven by social acceptance and the fact that identity around sexuality has changed a lot. Being gay or straight is about your identity and how you feel, so someone might feel that they aren’t entirely straight even if they basically do only practice heterosexuality, and might identify more loosely. The media is obviously a part of that, but just generally in a lot of circles (especially among young people) homosexuality is incredibly normalised and views on sexuality and sexual identity are a lot more loose.
As for general sexual aberration, the easy accessibility of porn is a big factor. We live in a very pornographic culture.
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Anrakyr
Guest
Americans do, other countries banned hormone therapy on livestock. What about all the other countries in the world?
So you can kindly stop repeating that data point. It’s useless.
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27lw
Guest
A bigger problem is female hormones in our water supply from women who take the pill, I believe.Regular_Atheist:
Americans do, other countries banned hormone therapy on livestock. What about all the other countries in the world?
So you can kindly stop repeating that data point. It’s useless.
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Regular_Atheist
Guest
As I said, I doubt there is any kind of direct causation between diet and an increase in homosexuality. Meat consumption generally has gone up around the whole world in the last century though, especially in continents such as Asia that were only later totally subsumed into the global market.
Well, I didn’t want to bring the “Greek love” thing into it, but that is one explanation — it’s culturally expected, or if not that, as in our present culture, it is something cool, hip, “woke”, whatever adjective you want to use. Young people are practically encouraged to “give it a try”.
When I was growing up (1970s), and where I grew up — you can’t even begin to imagine how rigid the gender roles and gender stereotypes were in my time and place — being gay was thought to be a fate worse than death. Yet, strangely enough, one of the male students in my Catholic high school (FWIW, he wasn’t Catholic, his family just preferred that particular Catholic school) was openly gay, and nobody disliked or harassed him over it, he was actually quite popular and well-regarded. Nice guy, witty, fun to be around. Never figured out how he was able to pull it off.
Didn’t know about Saudi. Learn something new every day.
I am totally opposed to harassing, bullying, or discriminating against anyone with SSA, even if they act upon it. It is not the unforgivable sin, and it’s not as bad as abortion — no one ever got pregnant, or caused a pregnancy, by having gay sex.
And, if acted upon, yes, it is evil, as are these other things. There is such a thing as having a compulsive urge to lie, steal, get drunk, or hate people. It’s called “temptation”. We are all tempted, just by different things.
Perhaps — and not to fall into the trap the moderns use of “your innate nature inclines towards it, so it must be okay to act upon it” — but as a straight person, I don’t recall ever “choosing to be straight”. I fell in and out of love with the neighbor girls from the first time I have conscious memories of having done anything.
Agreed totally. As you note, the media and the opinion shapers are trying to normalize homosexuality. It is no more complicated than that.
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Regular_Atheist
Guest
Well I wouldn’t put the cart before the horse. The media does now have a role in supporting it, but the early LGBT movement was a much more fringe movement that definitely fought for acceptance. I wouldn’t speak of it as if there was a plot from above to make people think it’s okay to be gay. However since the 90s or so corporations and mainstream media have grown ever more friendly towards it as public support for the LGBT movement has grown, and nowadays can win publicity by putting a gay couple in an advert or something. The extent of societal acceptance spreads way beyond the media in actuality, though. It is already normalised among a great mass of people, and the media is trying to capitalise on that more than spread it in many cases I think.
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openmind77
Guest
Is this why many animals exhibit homosexual behavior? Homosexual behavior in animals - Wikipedia
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tomarin
Guest
It’s also interesting to note that while we tend to think of heterosexuality and homosexuality as binary opposites, that hasn’t been true of all cultures in all places and times. I remember reading with much surprise a passage in a novel of classic Japanese literature, ‘The Life Of An Amorous Man’ in which this Don Juan-like character, who loves women so much he never settles down with any of them because it would cramp his style, considers with anticipation having a fling with a young man who is also (if I remember correctly) some kind of prostitute. It was as if some icon of manliness like John Wayne or James Bond had alluded positively to a same-sex tryst.
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mary77
Guest
in the Human Zoo book it demonstrates how under certain stressful oppressive situations ( such as narcisstic mothering of her child) in crowded atmospheres homosexual behavior is observed among animals including trying to express dominance over another animal. Its the same abnormal response to stress and anxiety and fear.
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Lea101
Guest
Wouldn’t that be bisexuality?
Drunken orgies were also a thing long ago. I think a significant amount of people have some same sex interest/desire if “the opportunity” is there. But because we think of it as categories, people adopt these labels and it seems that there’s a lot more of such people these days. Just my 2 cents. I do recall reading how many straight women have shown sexual interest in other women before. I figure if all shame and other barriers weren’t in the picture (I.e. Now/in college dorms etc), there will be more homosexual activity and people are more likely to perceive themselves to be gay/bisexual.
As for social/biological factors that may lead to an increase, I’m sure it’s plausible but I just don’t have a clue yet.
Drunken orgies were also a thing long ago. I think a significant amount of people have some same sex interest/desire if “the opportunity” is there. But because we think of it as categories, people adopt these labels and it seems that there’s a lot more of such people these days. Just my 2 cents. I do recall reading how many straight women have shown sexual interest in other women before. I figure if all shame and other barriers weren’t in the picture (I.e. Now/in college dorms etc), there will be more homosexual activity and people are more likely to perceive themselves to be gay/bisexual.
As for social/biological factors that may lead to an increase, I’m sure it’s plausible but I just don’t have a clue yet.
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openmind77
Guest
Are these monkeys responding to stress, anxiety and fear? https://www.discovermagazine.com/mind/casual-sex-play-common-among-bonobos
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RolandThompsonGunner
Guest
There’s also a lot of evidence that sexuality isn’t always fixed. There’s a (relatively) high number of people who have some passing, transient experience with bisexuality when they’re young and then settle into being straight once the ink is dry on their brains, so to speak.
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Hodos
Guest
The presupposition evident from this person’s question is that sin doesn’t exist and that man’s will is not corrupted by sin. I think even a cursory glance at scripture would refute this idea.
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tomarin
Guest
Is bisexuality a separate category altogether or a blending of the other two categories? The protagonist in the novel I read spent most of his time chasing after ladies but in that one instance was considering a same-sex fling - I think by our standards today he would be considered firmly heterosexual yet I got the impression his very occasional interest in young men didn’t preclude that.
My point is that for that particular culture in that particular time (and for members of that particular aristocratic class perhaps?) the definitions of straight, gay or bisexual did not appear to be firmly established. Not unlike in Ancient Greece or Rome.
My point is that for that particular culture in that particular time (and for members of that particular aristocratic class perhaps?) the definitions of straight, gay or bisexual did not appear to be firmly established. Not unlike in Ancient Greece or Rome.
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mary77
Guest
Im really not interested in reading about wild animals.
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Freddy
Guest
You’re right. It’s not black and white. It’s not either/or. It’s a continuum. From the most heterosexual, rugged, masculine jock that you can imagine to the most effete guy. We all fall somewhere on the line between the two. It beats me why so many people don’t grasp this. I think most try to deny it.
When I was a lot younger, Ursulla Andress waded out of the sea in a white bikini in one of the early Bond films. Everyone went nuts. Wow, what a girl! Then not so long ago, Daniel Craig did the same in a pair of blue trunks. Wow, what a guy! And d’you know what? I think Craig looked a lot sexier than Andress.
Where does that put me on that continuum? Well, not as far as the jock on the far left perhaps. But does that make me gay? Well, I’m not wired that way, so no. I’d take Ursulla out for a romantic dinner but not Danny. But it seems that people have a tendency to think that taking her out for dinner with a view to a more intimate finale later on is being a jock. Morally unacceptable for some. But a natural course of events.
But take Daniel out with a view to getting close and personal? That’s evil.
Now I think differently to most on the forum, but I reserve the term ‘evil’ for things like child rape or genocide. It’s a word that shouldn’t have it’s impact lessened by tacking it on to acts which should be simply described as immoral. And the word isn’t just used to describe an act either. It’s used to describe the perpetrator as well. The child rapist. The genocidal maniac.
But people use it as a description they think is applicable to mothers and sons and colleagues and friends and uncles and neighbours.
Call them immoral if you like. And you’ll get a relatively polite discussion about what that actually means to different people. So you can call my niece immoral and I’ll put forward a different point of view. But in certain circumstances, if you called her evil, then things would be a very long way indeed from being polite.
Some complain about the fact that there are still gay parades and a ‘gay movement’ and people still pushing for gay rights. And do you know why that is happening? Because gay people are still being compared to thieves and drug addicts and much, much worse. They are being described as evil.
I mean, what on earth would you expect?
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