Why does God "kill" in the Bible?

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Okay, I read this and thought about it. It seems reasonable.
🙂
According to Jewish Exegetes these customs were more observed in their absence then in their implementation . The same Law stood in Rome. Paterfamilias could legally kill his kid if he was a wise guy or displeased him in any way. As far as I know it was a law that wasn’t taken seriously. Dt28:53is not a commandment but it a prophecy of what will happen if the covenant. A covenant is a sacred contract in the middle east ancient cultures that promised and contained curses and unpleasant happenings for breaking said covenant- on either side of the covenant.Dt21:10 has to do with taken a women captive to wife.women captives usually became concubines- here the law lifts up the women to ‘wife’ status which entititled her to much more rights. Numbers 25:10-13 ,25:6-9 have to be read in context and the whole entire chapter at least should be read.The Israelites in the desert have already apostasized multiple times.This is on the brink of entering a sacred land and they start to indulge themselves in worshiping ‘false gods’Whoring with the women of Baal peor is a euphemism for getting involved with pagan worship .Marriage or dalliances with pagans leads to pagan worship. Read Numbers 22-25 to get the big picture. Memory of Baal Peor is accounted again in Dt4:3,Josh22:17,Hosea 9:10 :Ps 106:28 this was apparently a big deal. they were not to bring the dirt of paganism in with them.Leaders of the group of pagan worshipers were impaled. Phineas sees a Israelite going into a "ha-kubah’ a tent part of a cultic worship area gets ticked off because God has already explained this is wrong and this guy still insists in doing what he’s doing and phineas winds up killing both man and women. Phineas is lauded by God in turning God’s wrath away from the Israelites.This is seen as a support of the divine appointment or the Aaronide priesthood.eunuch were forbidden because they were considered “blemished” &“imperfect” . So just like a sacrifice would be considered unfit because of damage–so would a human being. this would fit in to the mindset of the day and place.ok? Good Luck!😛
 
Why not?

Why shouldn’t he hold himself to the same rules as he holds humanity? Just because He has authority? Just because He created us?

Well, why can’t we give parents the same kind of authority? Why not give our leaders that same kind of authorty since they are the rulers?

It’s a stupid double standard. It’s too much like someone saying “do as I say not as I do” and holds no credibility.

But then again, it’s like I always say. nobody ever holds themselves to the standarrds of morality and ethical behavior as they expect others to be held to. I guess the same thing is said of God.

It’s very tiresome.

I am so sick of that utter junk that people can excuse themselves from the standards they expect others to be strictly held by.

And when I hear junk like that it’s very disheartening.

And has me seriously considering whether or not I want to be a Catholic anymore or even want to be associated with God.
OK. Then who will you blame?

There’s a verse in Job I believe that is something to the effect if someone sued God in court “who can make Him go?”

On the question of evil, can I recommend “The Trial of Job: Orthodox Christian Reflections on the Book of Job” by Patrick Henry Reardon
 
Killing your kid that is unruly is a must, by stoning.

Numbers 25:6-9
Reward if you do: Numbers 25:10-13
Lets also kill the drunk unruly kid: Deut 21:10

God ordered it, you better do it.

God also wanted some to eat their kid:

Deut 28:53
There are quite a few mistakes in the passages cited vs. what is said.
Phineas (the first two passages, stone is really javelin?)
has some merit in the argument – but God did not order Phineas to do what he did – and if one takes the reward as a sign of God’s ordering it – think again.
Pagan women , esp these, were sent especially to sexually draw the men of Israel away from god – TO THEIR DEATHS. Which is worse, Phineas Killing one man and woman – or watching the fallout as the plan of BALAK and BALAAM being carried out, which would be the means of being able to EXTERMINATE all the Israelites? Was it self defense, defense of the others in Israel that he carried out? If so, what grounds did God have to be angry with phineas? – there was no “right” thing in the sense of justice in that passage.

Note also: lest you think the woman conceived before the spearing – the pagan gods were the Baals, of which Peor is one… These fertility rite gods included both the serpent and Moloch which are often renamings of Baal Peor etc. – One such renaming – Moloch – is the god of fertility who needs the blood of human babies in his sacrifice every spring.

Could phineas have saved the child ? I doubt it.
I forgot the Ethiopian Enuch had a problem getting to temple.
God doesnt want men with damaged testicles or damaged penis to get anywhere close to his holy places. My mistake.
Deut 23:1
The ethiopian Enuch I already mentioned in Acts not only had a damaged penis, he came specifically to JERUSALEM to worship. He DID enter the temple – and I am sure the chariot he rode in made the transportation issues minimal.

Again, the foreskin of EVERY priest was circumcised.
Also, the umbilical cord is generally cut off (or salted to shrivel).

So, one has to realize that each of the parts of the body are not of equal importance (even in our eyes today) – and that God speaking to a people at this time used “their” language. The body mutilations SIGNIFIED something because of how the people of the time used them.

An example which just crossed my mind is that circumcision was practiced by the Egyptians (their pagan rite). Abraham was told to circumcise himself as a SIGN after he sexually took an Egyptian slave as a surrogate mother for his sterile wife. This misunderstood SIGN was a point of pride for the Pharisees in the New Testament – but it is St. Paul who draws out the obvious contextual connection. Egyptians practiced circumcision, but that did not make them inheritors of God’s promise – and if one thinks about it, this was a miserable sign given to Abraham after he doubted God’s power over fertility – by taking an EGYPTIAN slave woman.

Abraham had to go through a painful act which symbolically put him in bondage to the “gods” of Egypt – and indeed his children willingly sold themselves into that very bondage in Egypt. Like their father Abraham, Egypt seduced them into bondage. God is TEACHING with his signs – they are not just arbitrary.

P.S. There is an odd connection between your handle “not smart”, your activities (ignoring information i have given in the past), and the specific complaints you levy after the information given. I hope you are not trolling.

God bless you.
 
Numbe 12:10 And the cloud departed from off the tabernacle; and, behold, Miriam became leprous, whitei as snow: and Aaron looked upon Miriam, and, behold, she was leprous.
Miriam did more than just question Moses – she mis-used GOD’s previous speaking through her – (yes God spoke through Women too)-- as her having the authority to make political decisions, hypocritically, even against Moses himself. It was sheer pride and racism.
That’s not all it does to the skin, which- can hardly be called white when the leporsy is raging with open wounds.
But that whiteness is exacly what the person recording the event in Gensis singles out as the salient feature of HER leoprosy.
Numbe 12:10 And the cloud departed from off the tabernacle; and, behold, Miriam became leprous,white as snow: and Aaron looked upon Miriam, and, behold, she was leprous.
I only seem to recall one other, the servant of Elijah/Elias who in a similar ethnic issue – the cleansing of a Syrian foreigner – took adavantage of his own relationship to God as authority to extract payment for himself from the foreigner.

An apparently “clean” act which was really filfthy in God’s eyes – to that man also a “white” leprosy is given – but the dark Syrian is clean, and the white Israelite is ironically made “UNCLEAN” which is what leprosy represents in the law of Moses

That whiteness is a sign of cleanness – can’t be confused with the sign of witeness making one actually clean – and lack thereof making others unclean.

For example, the Mormons originally read this error into the scriptures regarding the non-white skinned Native Americans. That “darkeness” they said was the mark of “Cain” or some such, which is an evil person. Undoubtedly, they mistook the symbol for the truth – which in our present political correctness is an embarassment to them.)

Or again, a “white” wedding dress does not make the bride pure – it is an outward sign to be worn by those who are virgin (another sign of purity).

A right interpretation, that is still understood today, is that the white is taken by man to be a sign of clean-ness that is associated with snow – the solid form of water which is not contaminated by the dirt of the ground yet. Pure water from the glacier is good to “WASH” with no matter the ethnicity of the person.
Psalm 51:6 Behold, thou desirest truth in the inward parts: and in the hidden part thou shalt make me to know wisdom.
Psalm 51:7 Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.
The idea, in this psalm about original sin, is by a Jew recognizing his need to be cleansed truly – not superficially.
Acts 23:3 Then said Paul unto him, God shall smite thee, thou whited wall: for sittest thou to judge me after the law, and commandest me to be smitt
en contrary to the law?
Acts 23:4 And they that stood by said, Revilest thou God’s high priest?
Acts 23:5 Then said Paul, I wist not, brethren, that he was the high priest: for it is written, Thou shalt not speak evil of the ruler of thy people
Note: St. Paul CERTAINLY KNEW WHO WAS HIGH PRIEST of his people.
His is claiming an ignorance very sarcastically here – and at the same time shames his opponents in their very objection. – The apparent “high” priest was not really in power – Herod and the Romans were – and in the crucifixion the Jews claimed to have NO KING but Caesar.
A figure head is not the real ruler of one’s nation – and one can’t have it both ways.

St. Paul’s words also reflect the change of priesthood which Jesus brought about – Jesus IS the high priest whom St. Paul’s ignorant brethren are striking.

Like Moses, St. Paul takes the meek way out in an ethnic issue – but still leaves the sin and error of his opponents exposed to shame.

The comment St. Paul makes is true in multiple senses and is characteristic of Jewush irony which is used to teach where hypocrisy is involved. Again “whiteness” is used here as an insult – because of an ETHNIC issue.

The situation (again) is that St. Paul is accused of bringing an un-cleanness into the inner parts of the temple – which never truly was the object of God’s teaching on cleanliness. (St. Paul is innocent anyway – just as Moses was.)

For this reason the “Jews” (inluding the high priest) sought to KILL St. Paul.
Their idea of “cleanliness” is really filfth.

Jesus is USING the OT and the OT God properly when he says:
]Matth 23:25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.
Matth 23:26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
Matth 23:27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are
within full of dead men’s bones, and of all uncleanness.
People (like Miriam) read into the scriptures racist ideas which are not (and never were) God’s. Merely being a Jew made no one saved, nor clean.

Miriam’s example is for the later generations to look back on when their pride has abated. Only then can one “see” the consistency of God. Note: Those who recorded the OT scriptures were racist too – and it is no surprise to me that although God did not share their version of it — God managed to leave ample indicators among the writings of this racist people. In their turn, they would experience a Holocost – both of the Romans burning Jerusalem, and the Nazis burning them in concentration camps.

I’m out of time again, & have to do some work for now.
 
:eek:

I cant believe that last paragraph you wrote!

Not only that, I STILL disagree with you labeling Miriam a racist.

😛
 
:eek:

I cant believe that last paragraph you wrote!

Not only that, I STILL disagree with you labeling Miriam a racist.

😛
😃

Oh really, why?
I have used the “plain” words of scripture to outline a consistent pattern.

Did you read only the last paragreaph or something?

The Jewish people themselves coined the name “Holocost” for the genocide of Hitler. The word means “whole and BURNT offering” – and it refers to the literal whole bodies burned in Auswitch – etc.

What of the racism recorded in the Old testament, the genocide which the Israelites were to carry out against the pagans in the promised land?
There is no escaping that the meaning of the word “racism” can rightfully be applied to many genocidal (pagan-ocidal) events which took place in the Old Testament. I won’t whitewash it…
 
😃

Oh really, why?
I have used the “plain” words of scripture to outline a consistent pattern.

Did you read only the last paragreaph or something?

The Jewish people themselves coined the name “Holocost” for the genocide of Hitler. The word means “whole and BURNT offering” – and it refers to the literal whole bodies burned in Auswitch – etc.

What of the racism recorded in the Old testament, the genocide which the Israelites were to carry out against the pagans in the promised land?
There is no escaping that the meaning of the word “racism” can rightfully be applied to many genocidal (pagan-ocidal) events which took place in the Old Testament. I won’t whitewash it…
?

Um, that was part of my point. God endorsed and condoned the Israelites to carry out all kinds of things against non Isrealites.

Sounds like you are coming around to my way of thinking!👍
 
?

Um, that was part of my point. God endorsed and condoned the Israelites to carry out all kinds of things against non Isrealites.

Sounds like you are coming around to my way of thinking!👍
I don’t recall saying that God himself did anything with regard to Hitler or Roms.
Each of these nations carried out genocide for purely utilitarian reasons – not discriminating about the individual merit or guilt of a person in the present.

“Condoning” an act, or calling it harmless is very close to “allowing it to happen” and “fortelling it would come about” – which I have (and still do maintain) God must have done – but, OTOH, I simply don’t recall God saying genocide was “harmless”.

In fact, King David, who carried out the killing of many , many , people is said to be “after God’s own heart” by his historians – YET when David asks God the privelege of building a “house” for God – God’s response is “you have too much blood on your hands.” God shows that people who speak of him often miss the mark.

By “endorsing” something eg: I assume:
a: to approve openly ; especially : to express support or approval of publicly and definitely b: to recommend (as a product or service) usually for financial compensation
But, the topic of thread was why did “God” kill, and why is “God” portrayed as being the one behind human destruction.

Wuth regard to his “portrayal” that had to do with the linguistics of a racist nation who entered into a contract (covenant) with God. Their racism was mis-interpretation of the will of God – but there was no way to save them freely that did not include entering into a contract of some kind with them.

Nor would I dare maintain that God maliciously wanted the death of the Jews at Auswitch or Jerusalem. As I have already said – many of their sacrifices were an abomination to him. Do you somehow read into my words that the Holocost was somehow really “pleasing” to God? I don’t – because I know that is the Jewish language expressing “their” interpretation of what happened.

Tthese events were the very friut of the evil attitude of racism and domination which God himself is forced to allow to happen by virtue of making us free.
It is hypocrisy to say God is all powerful if one attributes evil and death to God – for it is impossible that God could Lie, Die, or commit an evil act.

As I have said, the principle of double effect can be used to defend God’s actions – even in our distorted image of him – but unlike us, who can’t tell what the future is for certain – God does know what will save the “most” people. etc.

What the angels did on behalf of God – the Angels would have done on their own – because the Sodomites were trying to rape them and disfigure the image of God that they bore. eg: The very (and only) reason that raping a man or woman is intrinsically evil, and murder is possible.

I swat mosquitoes who bite me, and I would shoot a man or woman who was trying to take my life. I might also shoot a son or daughter or grandchild in order to protect someone ELSE they were trying to kill.

I find it a double standard to say God can’t do the same, although he is actually better than I or you.

The same is true for Er and Onan, whom God “slew”. Their act was tantamount to killing the whole human race by denying their salvation. Not the murder of babies which never happened – as a contraceptive act – but the murder of innocent babies that did happen (including the attempt on baby Jesus) by a contraceptive act which rejects the promise of salvation through children.
eg: the promise of Jesus’ coming as foretold to Adam and Eve (and which at least Eve partially misinterpreted).

The question “why is God portrayed as evil” is because those portraying God are blind to how he “really” is – a blindness which is completed by being a son or daughter of the Devil.

As Jesus put it – how is it that you can-not understand what I am saying?
Or again, if you who are evil know how to give good things to your children, — why is it you can’t understand that God gives better things since he is really Good and not partally so.

I don’t think you will argue that there is evil in the world of man – perpetrated by man himself. ( am I wrong? ) If so, then, why is is that you can’t seem to see that there are situations where the Devil & co. has made complete and instantaneous (tempoal) justic impossible? And that what the devil would do on his own – without God – God at least has the possibility of shaping the evil such that by denying certain worse evils actively – he can reduce the total amount of evil committed, and comfort the “innocent”?

(Only God knows what each and every act’s consequences are – unlike Hitler who did a “good for me” calculus, or Immanuel Kant who proposes an incremental calculus of Good which is impossible for man to accurately compute?)

Now I have really burned my free time…
 
Can you explain double effect to me in a way that I can make sense of it? I have heard of it, but it seems as if there could be various ways to misunderstand it.

Thanks!
 
Can you explain double effect to me in a way that I can make sense of it? I have heard of it, but it seems as if there could be various ways to misunderstand it.

Thanks!
I heartily agree with the misinterpretation part. Rather than explain it technically, I will give some examples that I (hope) (you be the Judge of what is sensible) – are not too confusing.

Let’s say my wife was pregnant (she is too) – and that she had a daughter (the prediction of some firends from prayer experiences) –
Now, I have love for my wife (who is difficult rather often) and the child which is to come. I wish each of them the best.

Now let us hypothesize that I didn’t know she was preganant although she actually is and that her belly ached terribly – So much so, that I took her to a doctor – and the doctor scanned the womb area – noticing that the uterus was swollen and ready to rupture. At this point, my intention (aim) is clear – I am trying to help my wife feel better. The doctor’s intention is the same. Now, if this is an early pregnancy the doctor might not even notice the child – and order a hysterectomy if the swelling were threatening my wife’s life. A few things can be said at this point:

My intention is Good – the doctor’s intention is Good.
I don’t want my wife cut up – the doctor doesn’t want to cut my wife up.
BUT in order to save my wife’s life – the doctor “believes” honestly that But – the uterus must be removed, and that part of her body is not as important as the whole of her life.

My wife may go to surgery and have the operation – and I would simply desribe it as an emergency where the horrible act of mutilating her body had to happen, and that although she has suffered a great loss – at least she will live.

The fact that the child was killed was in neither mine, my wife’s, nor the doctor’s mind. There is no active guilt (only at maximum a passive one for not looking harder – and one does not have infinte time to look.)

Now, let us consider a complication – my wife did know she was pregnant (she does). Now an ugly situation happens for those who acknowledge the life of a child in the womb – Hysterectomy will kill the child not just mutilate the body a bit.

Does this fore-knowledge change what must happen? maybe – if we knew whether or not the child would survive and my wife would survive, that could be used to decide how to proceed. But I don’t know the future (unlike God). However, I find it logically obvious that the way I understand the world – the child is going to die whichever action is taken. Should my wife decide the uterus be removed, the child can not live – if the uterus is not removed – the swelling and rupture will kill the child.

I simply have NO known way, nor does my wife, or the doctor, of preventing the child’s death. In effect, the situation is a dilemma.
There is no “just” solution for everyone at the same time. So my wife decides to give up her uterus and Isimply concur, since at least she will live.

Now to complete the explanation (analogy) consider that my neighbor is a smart aleck who des not recognize the life of a child in the womb. Upon discussing the subject with us, because of her concern about our rushing off to the hospital – i divulge that the baby died because the uterus was removed, and we are very sad. My neighbor, in her natural insensitivity, language, and belief system — calls across to our other neighbor kiddie-corner who is also worried “Hey, they aborted the baby and everything is O.K.” And our neighbor being the local historian posts it in the newspaper as that is what happened.

What am I to say? She told the truth in her language, the historian accurately recorded SOME of the “facts” (medically sopeaking) in the newspaper – but they both distorted what my intention was and my regard for the child in the womb. All I can say, is that my friends will be able to figure it out – especially since they have encountered me – and those who don’t know me will mostly be scandalized or self-righteous about the abortion. But, being a man, I don’t care what the world thinks – and I grit my teeth and bear the ambiguous interpretation of what I and my wife did.

My neighbor was commenting on the second effect (the death of the child) rather than the aim (the saving of my wife’s life) – and I stand socially condemned as a baby killer to many in the public eye.

There was one decision – to take or not take the uterus to save one person’s life – there were two outcomes reasonably known – two people died or one person died. That is a “double” effect of a single action of which evil existed in both outcomes. The name is somewhat a misnomer, as there are usually far more than two effects (consequences) to consider.

Immanuel Kant proposed a sort of math / calculus where one computes what action causes the most good – when in fact human ignorance of the future makes a guarantee of right outcome – impossible. Perhaps Einstein would have been aborted… or any number of people in his system of thought. But at heart, all of these attempts at resolving the double effect problem are people trying to find ways to either justify their conscience – or to rail their fists at the world’s injustice. (Hitler wrote mein kampf in prision from world war I. Eg. a result of England’s imperial trade practices, and Germany’s entry into the world market coupled with snobbery, and the like. Hitler’s anger turned into a sort of revenge motif which included everyone who had ever even slightly offended him – including the Jewish gypsies who wandered about in Germany… )

I hope that is a sufficiently clear thumbnail sketch of double effect – which includes a view of possible misunderstanding of the people viewing it form the outside… Vs. the evil way of solving the problem – like Hitler Chose.

God bless you.
 
😃

Oh really, why?
I have used the “plain” words of scripture to outline a consistent pattern.

Did you read only the last paragreaph or something?

The Jewish people themselves coined the name “Holocost” for the genocide of Hitler. The word means “whole and BURNT offering” – and it refers to the literal whole bodies burned in Auswitch – etc.

What of the racism recorded in the Old testament, the genocide which the Israelites were to carry out against the pagans in the promised land?
There is no escaping that the meaning of the word “racism” can rightfully be applied to many genocidal (pagan-ocidal) events which took place in the Old Testament. I won’t whitewash it…
Holocaust-is not a modern word coined -but is ancient and comes from the Hebrew ‘olah’-that which goes up.It was considered the greatest sacrifice that could be offered to God because it was completely and utterly burned except the skin .Racism is a modern term- dislike of the pagans was not based on race because many of the surrounding pagans were Semites. Religion was the basis of their dislike- not race.:eek:
 
Holocaust-is not a modern word coined -but is ancient and comes from the Hebrew ‘olah’-that which goes up.It was considered the greatest sacrifice that could be offered to God because it was completely and utterly burned except the skin .Racism is a modern term- dislike of the pagans was not based on race because many of the surrounding pagans were Semites. Religion was the basis of their dislike- not race.:eek:
:eek:

🤓🤓

I didn’t mean to imply that the word was modern – just that its usage with respect to what the Nazi’s did as a Proper name (“the Holocost”) is something that they chose to assign to the event. I gave the etymology of the word which is ancient.

I would love to see you back that Hebrew up with regard to the word in English – holocost. I know enough Koine (common) Greek to be aware that it is a compound word made up from two words:

Holos – from which the english is usually called “Holistic”, and is the part of the word Catholic. Cath – is Kata – means according to, or agreeing with – Holos means the WHOLE as in the complete faith.

The second part of Holocost – is cost, and I would rather believe that it is also Greek – as in the root which the english gets caustic from – Commonly understood to be something which eats away flesh – like Lye (sodium hydroxide) or fire.

When I see Holocost, I’m immediately struck by its usage in Jesus’ day, and its Greek origin to my knowledge. I must admit, though, I don’t know squat about hebrew root words – and I have read many a definition that I came to the conclusion is flat nonsense.

Welcome, Julia, I enjoyed your last post (before this one) thoroughly (even though I sort of nit picked at it… with the circumcision remarks.!)

:D.

–Andrew.
 
.Racism is a modern term- dislike of the pagans was not based on race because many of the surrounding pagans were Semites. Religion was the basis of their dislike- not race.:eek:
On second thought, perhaps the “cost” is like pentacost – which if I remember right – is just a multiplier, as in five times 10 = the fiftieth day.

The word “semites” is also something of a misnomer – as the moslem I went to school with gleefully pointed out to trip up the teacher – BUT Anti-semitism does not in fact apply to him. If this is so, then why would you dispute my use of “racism”? A difference – even in color of skin – would commonly be understood in the U.S.A. as a basis for racial descrimination, eg:
:Racism has existed throughout human history. It may be defined as the hatred of one person by another – or the belief that another person is less than human – because of skin color, language, customs, place of birth or any factor that supposedly reveals the basic nature of that person
adl.org/hate-patrol/racism.asp

Now, I am not sure why the fact that “racism” is a modern word would preclude it’s use – any more than “Trinity” or other such words which are not found in the bible. Nor am I sure that what is a common / modern definition applies to most people reading the posts: eg: I am not a demographics expert in the internet population…

🤷
 
Some people are going to think that the bible was written for scholars now.🤷
 
Some people are going to think that the bible was written for scholars now.🤷
Many already do – those Scribes and Pharisees were the ones who were educated enough to read and write – not all people could, which is why scribes could make a living. In their day – they were the scholars.

Now, as to the common person – that’s why they had rabbis to explain everything to them…

🙂
 
Many already do – those Scribes and Pharisees were the ones who were educated enough to read and write – not all people could, which is why scribes could make a living. In their day – they were the scholars.

Now, as to the common person – that’s why they had rabbis to explain everything to them…

🙂
YAH, YAH, I know the drill. Thats why we need the Church, ect and so on. I got it.

However, the Church is far more open to interpretation than you seem to portray here.

😉

I do thank you for taking the time to explain your knowledge to me, and appreciate it enormously.

I just don’t see all of it your way, yet.🙂
 
YAH, YAH, I know the drill. Thats why we need the Church, ect and so on. I got it.
😃 – I could continue to ignoure that subject, especially since the church does not engaage at the argument level on this particular point – but simply reaffirms that God’s mastery over history IS NOT just a figure of speech. On this point in the Cathechism, the church simply declines to describe her reasoning in any deep sense.
However, the Church is far more open to interpretation than you seem to portray here.
I’m sorry I gave the mis-impression that I was speaking on behalf of the church in some type of official capacity. I expect you have had a rather nasty game of rugby played with your emotions by the way you speak of what your husband keeps reminding you of. As far as I am concerned, at the moment, your continuing to pray “directly to God” as you feel the need – and to study the scriptures with a deeper sense of the mysteries they speak about is the best I can hope for.
I do thank you for taking the time to explain your knowledge to me, and appreciate it enormously.
You’re quite welcome, although I must admit – I don’t have a very clear vision of all the details myself, and am constantly studying because I have learned where my limits of knowledge are – but not where all the answers are.
I just don’t see all of it your way, yet.🙂
🙂 Fair enough. God bless you, and lead you to a deeper wisdom – wherever that may be. May you also find some comfort for the raw feelings which have been stirred up. . I wish I could understand your feelings better – that I might go beyond the cold, hard, logic of analysis – and into the subtler world of how these pains came about — but that kind of intimacy is difficult to share across a textual page. If I have stirred up some new thoughts, I will be content.

–Andrew.
 
We have this wonderful priest in our parish who explained to us in so simple terms what is the purpose of death. He said to always remember that this life on earth is not the end. In light of this knowledge, God allows death to occur to people for three reasons: either as a reward, a mercy, or a punishment. There is no exception to this.
  1. Death as a Reward - Death is a reward when it occurs to a person who is a friend of God, who allows himself/herself to be filled with God’s goodness. As the Catechism of the Catholic Church says:
1023 Those who die in God’s grace and friendship and are perfectly purified live for ever with Christ. They are like God for ever, for they “see him as he is,” face to face…
  1. Death as a Mercy - Death becomes a mercy when one dies short of making a mortal sin and forever losing Heaven. Rather than condemn himself/herself to hell because of the ever worsening state of his/her soul, God allows death to overcome a person who is in danger of losing Heaven because of ever mounting venial sins or reluctance to let go of the things of this world, and let him suffer Purgatory rather than suffer Hell. Again in the Catechism of the Catholic Church:
1030 All who die in God’s grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified, are indeed assured of their eternal salvation; but after death they undergo purification, so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven.
  1. Death as a Punishment - Finally, when someone keeps on sinning and refusing the grace of God, and that someone has harmed God’s children and God’s Plan to the point that Justice must be served, He lets that sinner die and give him/her what he/she really wants: eternal separation from the Lord. Again from the Catechism:
1033 We cannot be united with God unless we freely choose to love him. But we cannot love God if we sin gravely against him, against our neighbor or against ourselves: “He who does not love remains in death. Anyone who hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him.” Our Lord warns us that we shall be separated from him if we fail to meet the serious needs of the poor and the little ones who are his brethren. To die in mortal sin without repenting and accepting God’s merciful love means remaining separated from him for ever by our own free choice. This state of definitive self-exclusion from communion with God and the blessed is called “hell.”
How does this relate to the Old Testament deaths? Well, first of all we must understand why Jesus, as said in the Apostle’s Creed, “descended to the dead,” or “descended into Hell.” I will let the Catechism do the talking this time:
632 The frequent New Testament affirmations that Jesus was “raised from the dead” presuppose that the crucified one sojourned in the realm of the dead prior to his resurrection. This was the first meaning given in the apostolic preaching to Christ’s descent into hell: that Jesus, like all men, experienced death and in his soul joined the others in the realm of the dead. But he descended there as Savior, proclaiming the Good News to the spirits imprisoned there.
633 Scripture calls the abode of the dead, to which the dead Christ went down, “hell” - Sheol in Hebrew or Hades in Greek - because those who are there are deprived of the vision of God. Such is the case for all the dead, whether evil or righteous, while they await the Redeemer: which does not mean that their lot is identical, as Jesus shows through the parable of the poor man Lazarus who was received into “Abraham’s bosom”: "It is precisely these holy souls, who awaited their Savior in Abraham’s bosom, whom Christ the Lord delivered when he descended into hell."Jesus did not descend into hell to deliver the damned, nor to destroy the hell of damnation, but to free the just who had gone before him.
Therefore, the three reasons for God allowing death to occur that I have described will still apply to the numerous deaths of the Old Testament.

I hope, notsmart, you read the Old Testament in this light.

God bless you, and God bless us all. Let us all pray for all the poor souls in Purgatory, and that God may give us the grace to die in His Friendship and Love :gopray:
 
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