C
CRATUS
Guest
Why is it that those who love God suffer the most? It makes me sad. I think it would feel horrid to have all your faults exposed or to see how “sinful” you truly are. Some people are living in oblivion.
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J
Jamma
Guest
Huh???
J
JRKH
Guest
God seeks to expose our faults because he loves us so much.
He also exposes to us the remedy to those faults.
It is up to us what we do with this knowledge and which we choose - the illness or the remedy.
Peace
James
He also exposes to us the remedy to those faults.
It is up to us what we do with this knowledge and which we choose - the illness or the remedy.
Peace
James
P
Porknpie
Guest
Depends on what your definition of the word suffering means.
The OT Law revealed our spiritual state before God but it could not save us. Christ came into the world so that all would be saved. Those who love God, seek to have a relationship with him and desire to know him more fully. In doing so, they understand His revelation for man and His desire for us to live a holy life. Living a holy Life and putting God’s will ahead of our will, consistently, involves sacrifice and confirming to Christ. In doing so, we conform our lives including sufferings with his death on the cross. As we conform our lives to live in holiness, we gain great hope in the day of Christ’s return, that we will be with him forever. Better to have our sins revealed (self understanding of them) so that we can have hopeful confidence in our salvation.
We are all sinful to various degrees, not some, but every one of us. We have to be careful in not judging others, especially as we may be blind to our own sin.
E
Exiled_Child
Guest
Trust in divine providence: having our faults exposed, and suffering because of it, is one of the greatest things that can ever happen to us. If one prays for wisdom and has one’s prayers answered, it will inevitably come in the form of having one’s faults exposed.
J
John_Martin
Guest
I have not noticed God exposing my faults. What I have seen Him expose is Himself.
And He is truly “Something Else”! Wonderful.
Now, I want to be with Him, so I let Him know who I am, to give him the fairness of saying “No, you can’t be with me”. I tell him everything I see about myself that is contradictory to who and what He is (in Sacrament of Reconciliation). I want to give up all that to be with Him, if He will have me.
Rather than saying “No, go away”, He forgives me (absolution), He calls me to take new steps again in following with Him and doing what He, as my Lord, commands me (penance), and he refreshes me with His Holy Spirit, renewing me with the Virtues of Faith, Hope, and Charity.
I found my faults in examination of myself because I really want to be suitable to with Him, and it was not a finding that brought despair, but an examination and finding with a goal, a hope, that He really is merciful and would let me be with Him and heal me.
P
Porknpie
Guest
Christ says that we should forgive 70 times 7. This models His forgiveness of our sins: to forgive always someone who is repentant. Every loving father forgives his children when they say “I’m sorry.” Likewise, our Heavenly Father does the same with us.
C
CRATUS
Guest
I will not pray anymore, then. Lol.
E
Exiled_Child
Guest
Ha!
It’s always in our best interest to fix our faults’ though, right? A huge part of self-knowledge is being aware of our faults and weaknesses, which can be a painful process, to be sure. We must always begin from where we are, if you take my meaning.
C
Cricket2
Guest
God reveals our faults so we can correct them. As far as suffering, we really can’t measure how much more anyone suffers versus another person. Only God knows that, and reason or benefit of that suffering.
People make a mistake to think that those in obvious misery are suffering more than others. We don’t know what kind of situation others live in, that might look perfect on the outside, or what goes on in the mind or heart. That is for God to know and assess.
People make a mistake to think that those in obvious misery are suffering more than others. We don’t know what kind of situation others live in, that might look perfect on the outside, or what goes on in the mind or heart. That is for God to know and assess.
A
Avila123
Guest
Suffering is uncomfortable and can be very painful, however, sometimes it is only through suffering that sometimes we can grow and be open to God’s wonderful mercy. Personally, this year has been a time of suffering (thinking back, it has been a lot longer but then there have been some respites). Yet through the suffering, I have changed and grown, it is not something I can put my finger on or explain properly - it is as if I am moving to become closer to becoming the person I should, and want to be. With hindsight, I have reluctantly had to admit that suffering was the only tool to work deep within my heart, mind and soul.
When God exposes yet another one of my sins or weaknesses, remorse, repentance and then sweet reconciliation follow. He never exposes what I cannot bear or am not ready to accept, and He provides the Sacrament of Reconciliation to guide and reconcile. I pray to be close to God, so close that there is not a fraction of an atom between us because I love Him. He answers that prayer with love by offering the means for me to return to Him whenever I start to stray, especially when I don’t know it.
My mother used to discipline me and made me go through pain e.g. having warts burnt off or going to the dentist. I didn’t like it, but it was because she wanted me to be healthy and grow up well. God also wants us to grow up healthy, so it is a bit like having spiritual discipline, dentistry and healing etc.
Loving God, following Jesus, it isn’t always easy, but I don’t recall being promised that it would be a comfortable journey, only that the reward is being with Him for eternity. I do a lot of things I don’t always like for the end result e.g. work for a wage, clean the house, go to the Dentist etc, so why should striving for Heaven be different, or indeed easier?
Just my take on the questions.
N
nuntym
Guest
+JMJ+
That is because God is Light and Fire! It is kinda like wondering why you feel warmer and can see yourself better the nearer you are to a fire
N
nuntym
Guest
+JMJ+
You know, this reminded me of an old post I made here in another account (which I stopped using when I deleted the old email associated with it), which I reproduce here.
What you are describing, CRATUS, as I mentioned, is the natural effect of growing closer to God, and is the transformation of one’s soul. This process had been discussed by the late Jesuit theologian Thomas H. Green, who took his discussion from St. Teresa of Avila’s writings (I think; it has been a long time since I read it).
As the two discussed, a soul starts his journey towards God by noticing who God is: the Fire of Love.
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
The soul, enticed by this Warmth and Light, wants to know more and be with God. He therefore starts taking his spiritual life more seriously, and prays more, studies more about his faith, and tries to live as he ought.
Now the soul at the beginning is like a damp log from the forest:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
But as he gets nearer the Divine Fire, choking smoke comes out of him, and finds himself getting blackened, and all the rottenness and imperfections come out of him like the insects and vermin coming out of a log in a fire:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
As Fr. Thomas noted, this is a dangerous time for a soul, as he is forever affected by what the Light has shown him to be: imperfect. All kinds of temptations will assail him, the Enemy will attack him with all his fury for daring to leave Satan’s ranks, and (the cunning Enemy he is) Satan will use those imperfections coming out of the soul against him. This is the main reason why Christians (especially Catholics) leave their faith: they cannot take what the Light has shown them about themselves, and they carry that knowledge the rest of their lives if they do not go back. And that is sad, for it is only the continued approaching of the Lord and trust in Him that will cure this.
For when the Christian soul does not run away from the Lord but endures with courage and trusts the Flames of Love, then something miraculous happens. The soul catches fire with the Fire of Love:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
All the impurities and rot are burned away, and what remains in the soul is Fire: the Image of Jesus Christ through the Holy Spirit, the Masterpiece of the Father:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
And the people around him now see him, not as a damp log, but a source of Light and Warmth that cannot be hidden.
My son, if you come forward to serve the Lord, prepare yourself for temptation.
Set your heart right and be steadfast, and do not be hasty in time of calamity.
Cleave to him and do not depart, that you may be honored at the end of your life.
Accept whatever is brought upon you, and in changes that humble you be patient.
For gold is tested in the fire,and acceptable men in the furnace of humiliation.
Trust in him, and he will help you; make your ways straight, and hope in him.
Sirach 2:1-6
You know, this reminded me of an old post I made here in another account (which I stopped using when I deleted the old email associated with it), which I reproduce here.
What you are describing, CRATUS, as I mentioned, is the natural effect of growing closer to God, and is the transformation of one’s soul. This process had been discussed by the late Jesuit theologian Thomas H. Green, who took his discussion from St. Teresa of Avila’s writings (I think; it has been a long time since I read it).
As the two discussed, a soul starts his journey towards God by noticing who God is: the Fire of Love.
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
The soul, enticed by this Warmth and Light, wants to know more and be with God. He therefore starts taking his spiritual life more seriously, and prays more, studies more about his faith, and tries to live as he ought.
Now the soul at the beginning is like a damp log from the forest:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
But as he gets nearer the Divine Fire, choking smoke comes out of him, and finds himself getting blackened, and all the rottenness and imperfections come out of him like the insects and vermin coming out of a log in a fire:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
As Fr. Thomas noted, this is a dangerous time for a soul, as he is forever affected by what the Light has shown him to be: imperfect. All kinds of temptations will assail him, the Enemy will attack him with all his fury for daring to leave Satan’s ranks, and (the cunning Enemy he is) Satan will use those imperfections coming out of the soul against him. This is the main reason why Christians (especially Catholics) leave their faith: they cannot take what the Light has shown them about themselves, and they carry that knowledge the rest of their lives if they do not go back. And that is sad, for it is only the continued approaching of the Lord and trust in Him that will cure this.
For when the Christian soul does not run away from the Lord but endures with courage and trusts the Flames of Love, then something miraculous happens. The soul catches fire with the Fire of Love:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
All the impurities and rot are burned away, and what remains in the soul is Fire: the Image of Jesus Christ through the Holy Spirit, the Masterpiece of the Father:
(Please Note: This uploaded content is no longer available.)
And the people around him now see him, not as a damp log, but a source of Light and Warmth that cannot be hidden.
My son, if you come forward to serve the Lord, prepare yourself for temptation.
Set your heart right and be steadfast, and do not be hasty in time of calamity.
Cleave to him and do not depart, that you may be honored at the end of your life.
Accept whatever is brought upon you, and in changes that humble you be patient.
For gold is tested in the fire,and acceptable men in the furnace of humiliation.
Trust in him, and he will help you; make your ways straight, and hope in him.
Sirach 2:1-6
J
Jamma
Guest
Nintym,
I am electrified!
I am electrified!
A
Avila123
Guest
Ditto (just lifting my jaw up from the floor). I have saved what you have written so I can look into it some more.
M
Mystical_Seeker
Guest
I thought I had “suffered” for God, in dealing with people who are dishonest and scary. It got really bad.
Enduring that has made me very strong, emotionally and mentally.
As far as being “sinful,” I have no desire to go against God, but I have “sinful tendencies” (e.g. the “7 deadly sin[ful tendencie]s”) so when I see evidence of them slipping out – and especially reflected off of others (which is one reason to “love enemies” btw) I can notice it and figure out where it comes from.
So I’m not so much saying about a sinful act, but those systems inside me that keep me from enjoying contentment with life and union with God. If I notice I feel angry or fearful or jealous or whatever when I do certain things, that is golden information because once that has been identified, I can go about figuring out why. If I can, maybe I can reduce their effects because these emotions ruin my moment, and they influence me in making bad decisions or otherwise being less able to handle some task or situation. For me, I can’t fool people very well so I’d just as soon somebody tell me if I have egg on my face.
The problem is that so many of us try to “defend” the egg on our face, or we will deny it is egg. Maybe it’s bread; I don’t know. Maybe it really isn’t anything but others seem to think so. But whatever it is, if I can tell other people notice it, then it’s important to me because ultimately it influences how others perceive me. That’s important more in a strategic sense than in a spiritual sense; if people like to help me rather than try to make me go away or fight me, that makes my life easier.
Also consider what Paul says about suffering… (no pain, no gain … hee hee)
Rom 5:3-5
Not only that, but we even boast of our afflictions, knowing that affliction produces endurance, and endurance, proven character, and proven character, hope, and hope does not disappoint, because the love of God has been poured out into our hearts through the holy Spirit that has been given to us.
I hope this helps.
MS
S
Sk217
Guest
Hi CRATUS,
It is is because their love for God. Just think like this, Jesus suffered because of his love for us. My mom gave birth of me and she was in a great deal of pain, did she ever regret? Nope. Jesus never promised an easy life, but he asked us to join us to carry the cross, our cross. Remember Simon of Cyrene who helped Jesus carried his heavy cross? Not everyone has the privilege to suffer like Jesus.
We will be in a lot of trials as long as we live in the world, but God asks to persevere. He knows the best, surrender your will, pray and ask for guidance. Attachment to earthly things might lead to suffering too. We will never know what’s in God’s mind, but trust Him to lead the way. He loves you and He wants us to be humble. Remember that live in this world is temporary, but heaven is eternal. Aim for eternal life.
The life of saints like Padre Pio really speaks to my soul. He suffered because his love for Jesus and for the people. And he suffered with joy. You can read his biography if you want
God bless you.
R
ready
Guest
Everything God does is for our utmost benefit and for his honor. God bless you.
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