Why does Jesus seem very clear on not showing his mother Mary any special Honor?

[in_servitude]

I am going through the RCIA process, just getting started. I am trying to understand the main tenents of the faith first. The problem I am having is the issue of what my family, who are all opposed my conversion, call’s Mary worship. I was doing good at not listening to them until I read two Bible verses given to me to read. I read them in Catholic Bibles and they seem to show very clearly that Jesus wants no special attention given to his mother. The verses are Matthew ch 12 v 46-50, and Luke ch 11 v 27+28. Can anyone help me to understand the seemingly massive contradiction here?

John 2: 1-5

1 On the third day there was a wedding in Cana in Galilee, and the mother of Jesus was there. 2Jesus and his disciples were also invited to the wedding. 3 When the wine ran short, the mother of Jesus said to him, “They have no wine.” 4[And] Jesus said to her, “Woman, how does your concern affect me? My hour has not yet come.” 5 His mother said to the servers, “Do whatever he tells you.”

Are there other places in scripture where we find someone ask Jesus for something, he says that he doesn’t want to, and then he does it anyway? Is this giving Mary “no special attention”? He starts his public ministry right there at the wedding “because” of the request by Mary. Obviously, Jesus knew what he was going to do anyway, he is God. But, he still gave Mary the honor of starting his public ministry. That seems huge to me. Huge, Huge, Huge!

 

[lutherlic]

OP, I have 2 recommendations:

1. please see this page at ScriptureCatholic.com
2. watch this video

I think these may help a lot.

 

[PumpkinSeed]

. Mine was not in the picture as I grew up. And one that I can perhaps form a special bond with a mother figure that involves God seems like a great idea to me.

The good thing about the catholic teaching is that its comforting to know that if you don’t have a human mother there for you, you always have a spiritual one to turn to.

 

[thomasf]

Lk 11:27-28
While he was speaking, a woman from the crowd called out and said to him, “Blessed is the womb that carried you and the breasts at which you nursed." He replied, “Rather, blessed are those who hear the word of God and observe it.”

This is not a denial of the blessing of His mother. Rather, Jesus gives a better reason as to why Mary is blessed. She heard the words of God and said yes. She followed blindly what God asked. She is the first, best Christian. For that she is blessed, not because she nursed Him.

 

[centurionguard]

I am going through the RCIA process, just getting started. I am trying to understand the main tenents of the faith first. The problem I am having is the issue of what my family, who are all opposed my conversion, call’s Mary worship. I was doing good at not listening to them until I read two Bible verses given to me to read. I read them in Catholic Bibles and they seem to show very clearly that Jesus wants no special attention given to his mother. The verses are Matthew ch 12 v 46-50, and Luke ch 11 v 27+28. Can anyone help me to understand the seemingly massive contradiction here?

Read here: scripturecatholic.com/blessed_virgin_mary.html

Misunderstandings about Jesus “rebuking” Mary

Matt. 12:48; Mark 3:33; Luke 8:21 - when Jesus asks, “Who are my mother, and sisters and brothers?,” some Protestants argue that Jesus is rebuking Mary in order to denigrate her. To the contrary, when Jesus’ comments are read in light of Luke 8:5-15 and the parable of the sower which Jesus taught right before His question, Jesus is actually implying that Mary has already received the word as the sower of good ground and is bearing fruit. Jesus is teaching that others must, like Mary, also receive the word and obey it.

Matt. 12:48; Mark 3:33; Luke 8:21 - Jesus’ question about “who are my mother, and sisters and brothers” was also made in reference to Psalm 69:8-9. Jesus the Prophet was answering the psalmist’s prophecy that those closest to Him would betray Him at His passion. Jesus is emphasizing the spiritual family’s importance over the biological family, and the importance of being faithful to Him. While many were unfaithful to Jesus, Mary remained faithful to Him, even to the point of standing at the foot of the Cross.

Matt. 12:48; Mark 3:33; Luke 8:21 - finally, to argue that Jesus rebuked Mary is to argue that Jesus violated the Torah, here, the 4th commandment. This argument is blasphemous because it essentially says that God committed sin by dishonoring His Mother.

Luke 11:28 - when Jesus says, “Blessed rather are those who hear the word of God and keep it,” some Protestants also call this a rebuke of Mary. Again, to the contrary, Jesus is exalting Mary by emphasizing her obedience to God’s word as being more critical than her biological role of mother. This affirms Luke 1:48.

Luke 11:28 - also, the Greek word for “rather” is “menounge.” Menounge really means “Yes, but in addition,” or “Further.” Thus, Jesus is saying, yes my mother is blessed indeed, but further blessed are those who hear the word of God and keep it. Jesus is encouraging others to follow Mary’s example in order to build up His kingdom.

Luke 11:27-28 - finally, Jesus is the one being complimented, not Mary. Therefore, Jesus is refocusing the attention from Him to others who obey the word of God. If He is refocusing the attention away from Him to others, His comment cannot be a rebuke of Mary His mother.

John 2:4 - this is another example that Protestants use to diminish Mary’s significance. Jesus’ question to Mary, “what have you to do with me?” does no such thing. To the contrary, Jesus’ question illustrates the importance of Mary’s role in the kingdom. Jesus’ question is in reality an invitation to His mother to intercede on behalf of all believers and begin His ministry, and His Mother understands this. Mary thus immediately intercedes, Jesus obeys her, and performs the miracle which commenced His ministry of redemption.

Luke 8:28 - the demons tell Jesus the same thing, “what have you to do with us.” The demons are not rebuking Jesus, for God would not allow it. Instead, the demons are acknowledging the power of Jesus by their question to Him.

John 2:4; 19:26 - when Jesus uses the title “woman” (gnyai), it is a title of dignity and respect. It is the equivalent of Lady or Madam. Jesus honored His Mother as God requires us to do.

 

[AmbroseSJ]

thomasf:

She followed blindly what God asked.

Not to quibble, but she followed obediently and promptly, but certainly not blindly. We are to follow God’s word in the same way, obediently and promptly, but not blindly. Mary’s eyes were wide open, and she knew full well what she was doing. That doesn’t mean that she knew all of the ramifications of her decision, nor the future, nor the outcome etc. But that doesn’t mean she followed blindly. Not worrying about the outcome, or other unknown details of what obedience implies, is not blindness, just obedience (a decision to obey.)

That is why the Nazis didn’t get a free pass on following orders blindly during WWII. One always knows what one is doing, even if the outcome isn’t. (That Germany would lose.) There is always an element of “seeing” even when following orders to the letter. It is never blindly.

 

[PJM]

=robertmcbee;8992464]I am going through the RCIA process, just getting started. I am trying to understand the main tenents of the faith first. The problem I am having is the issue of what my family, who are all opposed my conversion, call’s Mary worship. I was doing good at not listening to them until I read two Bible verses given to me to read. I read them in Catholic Bibles and they seem to show very clearly that Jesus wants no special attention given to his mother. The verses are Matthew ch 12 v 46-50, and Luke ch 11 v 27+28. Can anyone help me to understand the seemingly massive contradiction here?

Mary is the Mother of God: Jesus the Christ; but the Incarnation is NOT about the Mother of God [that comes later], but about the Hows and Why’s of Jesus becomming man. Our Lord HAD TO establish HIMSELF as the long awaited Messiah. MAry knew and understood this. If He had permiited a closer post Ministry relationship, the understanding so necessary for Salvation could have /would have been comprimised.

It is AT THE DEATH of jesus when on the Cross that MARY rightly is recogonized both for what She is and for Her Purpose and Need.

John 19:25-27 “So the soldiers did this. But standing by the cross of Jesus were his mother, and his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary Mag’dalene. When Jesus saw his mother, and the disciple whom he loved standing near, he said to his other, “Woman, behold, your son!” Then he said to the disciple, “Behold, your mother!” And from that hour the disciple took her to his own home.”

Now that Christ had fulfilled HIS MISSION; Mary was once angain and for all-time have a most Unique and signifiant Role as the Mother of not only God; but also of ALL of hummanity.

It was only a matter of RIGHT priorities:thumbsup:

God Bless,
Pat

 

[EricFilmer]

We can deduce from Scripture that Jesus not only honored Mary, but perfectly gave Mary the honor a son owes his mother. If this were not so then Jesus failed to perfectly follow one of the Ten Commandments (which, I daresay, is not a position that any Christian would be willing to take).

 

[JimmytheButcher]

I am going through the RCIA process, just getting started. I am trying to understand the main tenents of the faith first. The problem I am having is the issue of what my family, who are all opposed my conversion, call’s Mary worship. I was doing good at not listening to them until I read two Bible verses given to me to read. I read them in Catholic Bibles and they seem to show very clearly that Jesus wants no special attention given to his mother. The verses are Matthew ch 12 v 46-50, and Luke ch 11 v 27+28. Can anyone help me to understand the seemingly massive contradiction here?

No contradiction is found here. The way I have read Matthew is that Christ is giving special recognition to His Mother. He is specifically pointing to Mary and the Apostles. “Behold!” I can see God thundering. “Behold” is a very special word when it is uttered by Christ, breathed out by God. It is the word of creation. It is the ‘ephphatha’ from the Cross when He spake, “Behold, Thy Mother!” He finishes by declaring all who obey the Him in the Fufillment of the Law shall be known as his siblings, but the person who closest to His Sacred Heart is His Mother. Translations are a funny thing. They put punctuation and seperate sentences and paragraphs in often unnatural ways. If you have an issue with a translation seek it in an ancient language and normally the contradiction is taken care of within a few minutes. More on the the priestly breathe of God. This is what is meant when we declare, “Per quem omnia facta sunt!” (By Whom all things were made) and then immediately proceed to declare, “Ex Maria Virgine: Et Homo Factus Est!” (From the Virgin Mary: And, He was Made Man.)

Matthew xii

Quæ est mater mea, et qui sunt fratres mei? 49 Et extendens manum in discipulos suos, dixit : Ecce mater mea, et fratres mei. 50 Quicumque enim fecerit voluntatem Patris mei, qui in cælis est, ipse meus frater, et soror, et mater est.

(Who is my mother, and who are my brethren? 49 And stretching forth his hand towards his disciples, he said: Behold my mother and my brethren. 50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father, that is in heaven, he is my brother, and sister, and mother.)

Nor, is there any contradiction in Luke as well. The way I have read it, all I see is Christ giving reason for why His Mother is blessed above all. Mary came to be the Mother of God not by being a regular sinful person, She came to be the Mother of God by hearing the Word of God and pondered Him in Her Heart. The Word of God is not something. It is somebody, and His Name is Jesus. It is worthy to note that Jesus isn’t rebuking the woman who shouted these words but is elaborating on them. It is inconceiveable that it wouldn’t be a great blessing to be in the proximity of Christ. Imagine how great that must have been for Her and for the crowds! But, greater than mere proximity to God is having Him inside of you, in your bowels. Scripture tells us that the Mercy of God is from the bowels. This is a reference of course to the Incarnation and Painless Nativity of Jesus Christ, True God-True Man.

Luke xi

Factum est autem, cum hæc diceret : extollens vocem quædam mulier de turba dixit illi : Beatus venter qui te portavit, et ubera quæ suxisti. 28 At ille dixit : Quinimmo beati, qui audiunt verbum Dei et custodiunt illud.

And it came to pass, as he spoke these things, a certain woman from the crowd, lifting up her voice, said to him: Blessed is the womb that bore you and the paps that gave you suck. 28 But he said: Yea rather, blessed are they who hear the word of God and keep it.

 

[hannajomar]

Whenever someone brings up an argument along the lines of “Mary wasn’t really a big deal,” (This is no reference to OP here, just in general), I bring up John 19:26-27.

John 19:26-27 (New International Version)
When Jesus saw his mother there, and the disciple whom he loved standing nearby, he said to her, “Woman here is your son,” and to the disciple, “Here is your mother.” From that time on, this disciple took her into his home.

I was discussing this topic with a protestant and asked what did he make of this verse? He said in essence that Jesus just wanted to make sure his mother was taken care of. The Catholic interpretation is that this is the moment when Jesus officially gives us His mother to take as our own mother. He gave her to all of us, not just to John.

Personally, it doesn’t make much sense that Jesus was just tying up some lose ends before He died. He’s hanging on the Cross in more physical and spiritual pain than we can imagine. Every word He says is excruciating. Is He really going to choose that moment to have a personal discussion with John and Mary? To me, that doesn’t make a whole lot of sense. Also, everything else He says from the Cross is directed to all of us, “I thirst,” “It is finished,” etc., are all commonly interpreted as having greater meaning than the pragmatic thing He was referring to at the time. This is the only statement from the Cross that I have seen protestants say He just meant what He said, and nothing bigger or loftier.

 

[174a]

I am going through the RCIA process, just getting started. I am trying to understand the main tenents of the faith first. The problem I am having is the issue of what my family, who are all opposed my conversion, call’s Mary worship. I was doing good at not listening to them until I read two Bible verses given to me to read. I read them in Catholic Bibles and they seem to show very clearly that Jesus wants no special attention given to his mother. The verses are Matthew ch 12 v 46-50, and Luke ch 11 v 27+28. Can anyone help me to understand the seemingly massive contradiction here?

You and I and all of us have family and they are very precious to us and although hopefully we shall meet again in Glory we shall miss them when they are no longer with us, but how much better for us all to be in the family of God in the presence of our Heavenly Father among our brothers and sisters in Christ for all eternity, which when compared with the blink of an eye which is our time on earth is but a single breath when compared to all eternity and we shall all be together again.

.

 

[robertmcbee]

The ‘Main’ help I have gotten was a post by someone that gave me a link to another post. It is the most helpful post I have ever seen and takes care of all my issues. In that other post, the person says basically that the main problem for Protestants like myself is the misconception that our faith comes from the Bible, Whereas In reality, (And I already knew this from history basically), The Bible comes from “THE Faith”… IE… The Catholic Church (In effect) Made the bible… I had never thought of it that way, and I am afraid that the vast majority of people that grew up being taught the way I was, will NEVER be able to… It saddens me to know this fact. But I now have any and all answers taken care of. I have only to ask my local “Ordained” Parish Priest to know any answer that seems obscure. I will go back and link that post in some way if I can figure out how.

 

[robertmcbee]

I found this after an actually useless link posted to me…I went back to the start of the post and the following…

The Church was alive and well and spreading throughout the world for nearly 400 years before the wrtings which make up the Bible, as you know it, were decided upon and officially proclaimed as the inspired word of God. The Church depended upon Sacred Tradition, handed on to it from the Apostles, and the teaching authority of the Church. Sacred Scripture (the Bible) is that poriton of Sacred Tradition which was written down. So the Catholic Church did not come from the Bible, the Bible came from the Catholic Church and the Sacred Tradition of that Church.

I begin with this because there is an important principal here. The fact that you may not find something in the Bible, such as veneration of Mary, does not mean that it was not practiced by the early Church. But lets start with the fact that Catholics do not worship Mary. You will not find a Cathoic doctrine that instructs us to do that. Mary is not divine, she was as human as you and me, therefore to worship or adore her in the sense that we worship God would be idolatry. There was one, huge difference, however. No other human being can claim the same relationship to God as can Mary. She is the daughter of the Father, the spouse of the Holy Spirit and the mother of the Son. No other human has this intimate relationship with the Holy Trinity.

Something that is very (name removed by moderator)ortant for you to understand, concerning praying to saints in general, is a Catholic doctrine known as the “Communion of Saints” which is absent in most Protestant circles. We believe that we are not seperated by death from those who make up the body of Christ and are now in heaven. We are in communion with them by being a part of that same body of Christ. We communicate with them through prayer and ask their intercession for us just as I might ask you to pray for me. So the very idea of prayer, which, in the Protestant world is reserved only for God, is only a way of asking them to help us in our spiritual journey. We, of course, pray directly to God as well (just attend a Mass). You would not find anyone praying to Mary in the Bible because she was still here on earth with the Apostles and disciples at that time. Not only that, but the point of the New Testament was to announce the good news of Jesus Christ, not Mary. She always points us to her Son.

Hope that gets you started.

God bless.