Why does one hate the Catholic Church?

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CMatt25 said:
Elvis, I can not judge who Christ will spit out.

But I do wonder what lukewarm means.

For example perhaps to express our faith in Christ with love and not be lukewarm we should be peacemakers. Blessed are the peacemakers He taught in Matt 5 from the Mount.

Or if we can, strive to serve the poor, the homeless, the sick, the naked, and the prisoner? In Matt 25 He taught these as other examples of righteous faith so when we say Lord, Lord, He will know us.

Love one another. The Golden Rule. Do not judge. These are all things of Christ.

Peace be with you.
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**Those who are lukewarm are those who profess faith in Christ as members of his Church, yet don’t follow through. Christ’s message is lost on them because their will - whether it be due to pride, insolence or even sloth - is superior to God’s will.

This is what happened with the Reformation and, unfortunately has happened to some who profess the Catholic faith on this forum yet have no real understanding of Christ’s Church.
 
elvisman said:
Huh??
Nobody’s taking anything personally - at least not I’m not.

I never get angry on this forum because I can only be angry with people I know - and I don’t know you or any of the *other *anti-Catholics I deal with here.
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So it appears then this forum is all a game to you then and because you don’t know people, you have therefore given yourself license to accuse people of hurtful things like hate. And since you don’t know anyone, you can be so certain no one takes your words personally. Ok I think I get it now.
 
elvisman said:
**Those who are lukewarm are those who *profess ***faith in Christ as members of his Church, yet don’t follow through. Christ’s message is lost on them because their will - whether it be due to pride, insolence or even sloth - is superior to God’s will.

This is what happened with the Reformation and, unfortunately has happened to some who profess the Catholic faith on this forum yet have no real understanding of Christ’s Church.
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Those who profess Christ Lord and Savior are members of His Church. That’s how Peter became a member. If you’re talking about becoming a member of the Catholic Church, that’s done by the Sacrament of Baptism which is how I became a member. Then of course to be properly informed I was catechized properly and further received the Sacrament of Confirmation. And then continued in study. Or one can become a member thru the RCIA process. 🤷
 
PORATH said:
Perhaps I am communicating poorly so let me, again, clarify my position.
  1. I am a firm defender of the faith although I don’t have the history on this forum that many of you clearly possess. I have been around the block a few times and have endured attacks on the Church and my faith even when I was ill prepared to defend Her or myself. I know well the frustrating arguments with those outside the Catholic Church.
  2. Kindness and Charity are a must when discussing AND defending the Catholic Church. 1 Cor 4:8-13 speaks to this IMO although it’s breadth is larger than this situation.
  3. As indicated by elvisman, it is our responsibility to correct and defend. How we do that is important for ourselves and produces results commensurate with our attitude and intent. If we are kind we can expect kindness in return but if we are met with vile intentions then we continue to be kind since we are in Christ and HE was LOVE. Shocking at times even to those familiar with Him, but always patient.
  4. I will continue to challenge those who use a “counter-attack” approach to defending the Church. Love does not manifest itself through anger, hatred or impatience, whether percieved or real. FACTS CAN BE SHARED IN KINDNESS.
May we all become unified in ONE HOLY CATHOLIC and APOSTOLIC CHURCH
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A while back, there was a thread about a video on Youtube.
In it, an anti-Catholic Protestant preacher enters a Catholic Church during mass, mind you. Holding a Bible, he begins to scream/preach at the congregation. He shouts out the most vile things about the Church, the Eucharist and the mass - at the top of his lungs.
We had a similar situation at our Church on Christmas Eve several years ago. Only this gentleman received the Eucharist, ran up to the sanctuary, spit it on to the floor and began to scream about what he thought of the Catholic Church.
In your opinion, should either of these men have be allowed to do this or would it be permissible for a few ushers to physically remove them? **
OR - would you consider it their right to do this and that any action taken by the congregation be seen as impolite?**
To a certain extent – this is what happens here on a daily basis. Granted, that it is not during a mass, but the same filth is hurled at the Church. Nobody is escorting them off the forum or even asking them to be silent. We are merely asking them – in stern fashion – to cease and desist with their uncharitable diatribes.**
This does not include mere disagreements with Catholic doctrine, and is usually reserved for the uncharitable assaults.
 
CMatt25 said:
Those who profess Christ Lord and Savior are members of His Church. That’s how Peter became a member. If you’re talking about becoming a member of the Catholic Church, that’s done by the Sacrament of Baptism which is how I became a member. Then of course to be properly informed I was catechized properly and further received the Sacrament of Confirmation. And then continued in study. Or one can become a member thru the RCIA process. 🤷
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Right**. I didn’t say you weren’t a member.**
I said your fruits show you to be a lukewarm member. That’s why I defined what a “lukewarm Catholic” is.
 
elvisman said:
WRONG.
It IS hatred and prejudice because the most of the things mariahloves listed are lies.
**If I lied **about your Church and misrepresented your beliefs, it would - and should bother you. I don’t do that, however, because I do my homework about other denominations before opening my mout.

In short - I don’t come as ill-prepared to a discussion and many of you do. 👍
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Whether they are lies depends upon the person who espouses them. Is it possible that a person can be incorrect, wrong, mistaken rather than deceptive, misleading, or untruthful?

elvisman, please stop pretending to or assuming to know the hearts and minds of those writing in this forum. It is possible to be right, and you are, without sounding hafeful yourself.

I know you don’t percieve yourself this way but it is what you project. Denying that doesn’t change what others hear. Look past your indignation and the misconceptions or falsehoods of others and be a teacher of Truth…that will make you a successful defender.

Truly your brother in Christ
 
Darron_Steele said:
.

I guess we will have to agree to disagree on
a) how proactive the denomination is, in general, on dealing with this problem in accordance with civil law, and
b) whether or not I actually hate the Catholic Church.
It is apparent that you will think whatever you want about the situation – and about me for not agreeing with you.
.
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In threads you can become lost as to who said what and why. Perhaps that is your problem.

a. I never mentitoned how proactive the Church (again I tell you I am not a denomination, By continuing using this word your are using a technique refered to as agressive/nonagressive manner.) Proacive wasn’t mentioned until now, by you.
b. I have never said you hate the Catholic Church. I answered a statement that was not true. You have attempted to make it that I don’t agree with you so I think that you hate the Catholic Church. That is truly a twisting of what was said. Your statement was on the CURRENT way the Church handles things. You stated it as a fact not an opinion. Opinions can be disagreed with. A fact is either true or false. You stated a falsehood. I said (opinion) that you wanted to hold on to the past. Considering your follow up statements, that seems to be a substantiated opinion.
 
elvisman said:
A while back, there was a thread about a video on Youtube.
In it, an anti-Catholic Protestant preacher enters a Catholic Church during mass, mind you. Holding a Bible, he begins to scream/preach at the congregation. He shouts out the most vile things about the Church, the Eucharist and the mass - at the top of his lungs.
We had a similar situation at our Church on Christmas Eve several years ago. Only this gentleman received the Eucharist, ran up to the sanctuary, spit it on to the floor and began to scream about what he thought of the Catholic Church.
In your opinion, should either of these men have be allowed to do this or would it be permissible for a few ushers to physically remove them?
OR** - would you consider it their right to do this and that any action **taken by the congregation be seen as impolite?
To a certain extent – this is what happens here on a daily basis. Granted, that it is not during a mass, but the same* filth* is hurled at the Church. Nobody is escorting them off the forum or even asking them to be silent. We are merely asking them – in stern fashion – to cease and desist with their uncharitable diatribes.
This does not include mere disagreements with Catholic doctrine, and is usually reserved for the uncharitable assaults.
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Thank you for pointing out that this forum is not a mass…too sarcastic?

I would say that those people were deserving of removal from the Church and an invitation to learn the truth even though I would personally feel like I was choking on such an invitation. Nonethieless, I would offer it.

1COR 4:12-13 “…we wear ourselves out with hard work. When we are cursed, we bless: when we are persecuted we endure: when we are insulted, we answer back with kind words. We are no more than this world’s garbage; we are the scum of the earth to this very moment!”

You are clearly answering back…I just don’t hear the kindness…I hear superiority.
 
PORATH said:
Whether they are lies depends upon the person who espouses them. Is it possible that a person can be incorrect, wrong, mistaken rather than deceptive, misleading, or untruthful?

elvisman, please stop pretending to or assuming to know the hearts and minds of those writing in this forum. It is possible to be right, and you are, without sounding hafeful yourself.

I know you don’t percieve yourself this way but it is what you project. Denying that doesn’t change what others hear. Look past your indignation and the misconceptions or falsehoods of others and be a teacher of Truth…that will make you a successful defender.

Truly your brother in Christ
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Again – you haven’t been here long enough to know how some of these people operate – in the sense that they have been informed of the REAL beliefs of the Church. After having been informed of what we actually believe - they CHOOSE to continue to spread the lie instead of taking our word that these are falsehoods, or perhaps visiting an online version of the catechism about them.
Many of the people you that you claim I am uncharitable towards are the very people I have just described. I have spoken with dozens of other people on this forum who agree, as do the Scriptures (1 Thess. 5:14), that the unruly should be admonished.
If you wish to continue to call me out every time I correct one of them – so be it. You seem like a nice enough person – if not, ever-so-slightly misdirected.
Your brother in Christ,
Elvisman
 
elvisman said:
**Again – you haven’t **been here long enough to know how some of these people operate – in the sense that they have been informed of the REAL beliefs of the Church. After having been informed of what we actually believe - they CHOOSE to continue to spread the lie instead of taking our word that these are falsehoods, or perhaps visiting an online version of the catechism about them.

**Many of the people you **that you claim I am uncharitable towards are the very people I have just described. I have spoken with dozens of other people on this forum who agree, as do the Scriptures (1 Thess. 5:14), that the unruly should be admonished.

If you wish to continue to call me out every time I correct one of them – so be it. Perhaps you should also do some policing of the attackers as well. You seem like a nice enough person – if not, ever-so-slightly misdirected.

Your brother in Christ,
Elvisman
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adrift said:
Don’t you think that Tweety is looking in the mirror;)
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I sure am and I see a beautiful women who loves Jesus with all her heart and soul. Who doesn’t care what people say or call her. She is happy in the Lord
 
elvisman said:
– in the sense that they have been informed of the REAL] beliefs of the Church. After having been informed of what we actually believe - they CHOOSE continue to spread the lie instead of taking our word that these are falsehoods, or perhaps visiting an online version of the catechism about them.

Take a look at my exchanges with Darron Steele to see a part example of what em is talking about.
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SCHAICK: A parents teaches a child about GOD, Jesus and what HE did for us- hopefully the information is from the Holy Bible.
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And that Parent “preaches” the word…in order to interpret passages correctly in order to “preach” the word…you need an authority to keep you on track…that would be the Church!
Why would you give your children information form anything else when we have in our hands what came from the Apostles-eyewitnesses to Christ?
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We have the eyewitnesses that passed down the information VIA Oral Tradition…for the first 50 years…before we actually HAD those “writings”. And because Paul tells us clearly to “hold fast to the traditions that have been handed down to you whether by letter OR by word of mouth”.
It is by the standards in the Holy Bible one can tell if a preacher is preaching the true Gospel.
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Then why does the bible tell us to look to the Church for discerning the Spirit of Truth from the Spirit of Error??
CC
[SIGN]I love my Papal Papa! [/SIGN]
 
adrift said:
Take a look at my exchanges with Darron Steele to see a part example of what em is talking about.
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For anyone interested: before you take this individual’s characterization of me at face value, please read the entirety of my posts on this thread.

Thank you.
 
ccolley said:
And that Parent “preaches” the word…in order to interpret passages correctly in order to “preach” the word…you need an authority to keep you on track…that would be the Church!

We have the eyewitnesses that passed down the information VIA Oral Tradition…for the first 50 years…before we actually HAD those “writings”. And because Paul tells us clearly to “hold fast to the traditions that have been handed down to you whether by letter OR by word of mouth”.

Then why does the bible tell us to look to the Church for discerning the Spirit of Truth from the Spirit of Error??
CC
[sign]I love my Papal Papa! [/sign]
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:amen:
 
adrift said:
Take a look at my exchanges with Darron Steele to see a part example of what em is talking about.
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You said a mouthful. 👍
This is what I have been speaking to all along.

In Christ,
**Elvisman **
 
For anyone interested: before you take these two individuals’ characterizations of me at face value, please read the entirety of my posts on this thread.

Thank you.
 
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